Hello,

Long time lurker, first time poster. Need some help in making a decision related to speakers and receiver to get. The room that I am planning to install the speakers in is the family room, with vaulted ceilings. The room dimensions are: 20x15, with the highest point in the room 30' while the lowest is 24'. The room in question also has back stairs and opens up to kitchen/breakfast nook and it is seperated by half wall. I had sent a message to Axiom and Jean-Claude (Thanks Jean-Claude) responded with Epic 60/350 combination for the room.

My usage is 40 (music)/ 60 (movies) and think that the system will do a wonderful job. My concern is that the original budget I had was $5000, (($2500 for both speakers and receiver) and (50-60" TV + stand + upconverting dvd $2500)) and with the Epic60 combinations I have blown that budget. I might be able to swing additional 500 but would prefer not to do that if possible. Would like to get the owners/audioholics opinion on the following changes to the original recommendation:

1) Are the factory outlet speakers identical to the epic 60. Can I purchase individual speakers from factory outlet and get epic 60 combination (1-vp100, 1-ep350, 2-m60 and 2-qs8 = epic60-350). Which will save about $200.

2) What do I lose in terms of sound quality if I replace the m60 with m50, which saves another $200.

3) Any recommendation for receiver, the ones mentioned in the forum are a bit expensive (Denon 2807, HK 7xx series, Yamaha RXV-2xxx, Sherwood ???, Pioneer Elite 80?), they all run about a grand. I think I would be better off spending the money on speakers instead of the high end receivers.

4) I am also in the market for a big screen tv. Leaning towards the JVC HD-ILA or the Sony A2000 series (50 to 60" size range)? My seating arrangement is about 12 or so feet from the likely location of the tv. Would like to get a Panasonic Plasma (9UK from Visual Apex), but concerned about the amount of power used by the plasma (535watts according to the manual)
or am I being a bit to anal related to electrical usage?

Sorry for the long message. Any help/advice/opinion is appericiated.

Thanks
-Deepak

Deepak Welcome

I can help you with a couple of your questions and I'm sure others will jump in soon with more advice.
You can go to the factory outlet and get any system you want, and I beleive if you order 5 items you get an additional 5% off. There is no difference in the outlet products from the new products other than they may or may not have a blemish, I could never find one on mine.
As far as receivers go you can find many good receivers in the $300.00 to $500.00 range that should more than meet your needs. If you have a paticular budget in mind for a receiver I'm sure you will get many suggestions. Again welcome, and have fun with your choices.

How's this...

Axiom M60/350 from outlet $2189
Denon AVR-2307ci $629
Sony KDS-55A2000 $1999
Oppo 981HD $229
TV Stand under $265 $265

Without a doubt get your Axioms through the outlet. They likely arrive 100% perfect. Blems, if any, will be minute.

Denon's get nothing but raves around here, and seem to be the #1 brand receiver mated with Axioms (at least on the boards). The 2307 should be plenty powerful enough for you.

I own a Sony SXRD myself and love it. I just did a search and Vanns.com has the best price (from a trustworthy source) and they offer free shipping to boot. GREAT deal!

Oppo is the king of uprezing dvd players. Their latest model, the 981HD not only has uprez, but will also playback SACD. All for $229. Seems like a no brainer purchase to me.

Racksandstands.com is terrific. The biggest selection, the best prices. I've bought a few items from them, and have never had problems. In fact, they went out of their way to help me out the last time. I highly recommend you deal with them for your stand. The link above is a custom search for a stand under $265, rated 'excellent', and suitable for a rear projection television.

That all comes to $5311. Still a little bit over your $5000, but darn close and you'd have yourself one heck of a system.

Deepak, another welcome. Yes, you certainly should be able to come in under $2,500 for speakers and receiver with some minor changes that wouldn't significantly affect performance. First, as Michael indicated, you should have no hesitation in ordering from the Outlet. That 10% saving, plus the 5% saving for ordering 5 items together won't be quite enough alone, so consider saving on a less expensive, but very fine, sub such as the HSU VTF-1 for about $400. With the Axiom discounts plus the HSU you'd be about at $1,880. You could save about another $100 by using a vertical M2 center.

As to the receiver, you're wise to want to save there rather than on the speakers, since there're several fine models available for under $500. I'd suggest that you consider the Onkyo 604 for about $365. That would put your total well within your budget at around $2,200.

Welcome!

1) Yep, that is what I did to save money, same speakers so why not. A 60 is a 60, a 350 is a 350, etc... no matter where you buy it from, they are still brand new.

2) The 60's will perform better in the mid-range and high's category in my opinion, and most likely have better bass response. That is a pretty big room...

3) If you buy from local retail stores you will pay MSRP, unless you wait for good deals. I waited until one of my local stores had an employee cost day, and got my Denon 2805 for 20+ % off. There are lots of reputible etailers online also where you can save money, just make sure they are authorized. There are lots of good receivers out there in the 400-600 range as well from the above listed brands.

4) Can't help you on this one, I prefer a front projector/screen combination over a TV anyday.

One thing to consider is that you have roughly 8000 cubic feet so if you are at all into "wanting to rock the house" don't go smaller just to save a few bucks. Maybe wait a bit till your budget has more $$$. In the long run you'll probably be happier. I have an EP350 in my bedroom and it does fine there but it would not cut it in my great room....roughly 14000 cubic feet. ( Though the EP600 shakes my world.) The 60's will do a fine job for you.

Another thing that I haven't seen mentioned in your budget.....don't forget that after all the hardware you're still going to need at least a couple hundred $$$ or so in cables and interconnects.

No matter what you get enjoy it!

My house is in the process of being built, so my HT is still a few months away. I can share a little bit about my experiences in searching for the right receiver. You're right that the receivers you mention are probably not the best use of money with your budget. They don't affect the sound as much as the speakers do, and they'll also be replaced earlier, so no need to blow the budget there.

When I started looking at receivers, I also was in the $1000-$1500 price range and considering the same ones you are. I've subsequently worked my way down to about $500, because that's what the Yamaha RX-V659 costs. There's a great review about it on Audioholics, though the main drawback is that it doesn't support HDMI switching. If you're going with a 5.1 system, then a 5.1 or 6.1 receiver may be a little less expensive than a 7.1 receiver.

One feature that isn't often prominently advertised in the product description, but worth looking for, is a set of pre-outs for all the channels, so that you can connect the receiver to an external amplifier. Your room is pretty large, so it's conceivable that you may need an external amplifier, at least for the front channels. The lowest-end models usually have only subwoofer pre-out, or none at all.

Another feature to consider is lip sync (audio) delay, which will help compensate for the possible video delay introduced by the video processing of the TV. I don't know much about the processing features of the TV's you're looking at, so this may not be an issue for your setup. Again, the lowest-end model receivers usually don't have this feature.

If you're looking for non-HDMI receivers, then $400-$500 is the sweet spot (in my opinion). Receivers that fall in this range include the Yamaha RX-V659 (and its twin, the HTR-5960), Denon 787 (I believe the AVR-1907 may be its twin), and Onkyo 703. I'm not as familiar with the HDMI receiver options.

Hope this helps (rather than confuses!)

Another option for "receiver" is the Emotiva Ultra Theater combo. A full set of separates, with HDMI switching via a separate box (come included with the LMC1 pre/pro). All for $900 with free shipping right now.

That's a deal that's hard to beat.

Must say that I haven't heard these units, but if my Rotel receiver goes, this is the route I'm taking.

EmotivaAudio

From what I've read, the LMC-1/LPA-1 combo is a great way to go if one is looking at separates rather than a receiver. The LPA-1, in particular, is a great deal for a 125 wpc ×6 amplifier. However, the LMC-1 does have a couple of shortcomings, at least for me. First, it doesn't have the lip sync audio delay. Second, it has only limited flexibility for the digial audio inputs (coax and optical), so that you can only connect 3-4 digital audio inputs. For $400-$500, one can get more features by using a receiver as a pre/pro.

Thanks for everyones comments. I have decided to hold off on the purchase and use the money for other immediated requirements and will have to wait until next year.

Going back to lurking mode for now.

Thanks again.
-Deepak

Just wanted to add some positive feedback for when next year's plans start to materialize. I know the feeling of the waiting game, it took me a long time to put away my upgrade dollars.

Your room sounds very similar to my living room area. Fairly large, high vaulted ceiling, open into the kitchen. I just wanted to add that I am very impressed with my pair of M60s in this environment. When we were moving into this house, I had some bookshelves I hooked up on day 1 to get us some 'moving in' music. They were a nice pair of Harmon Kardins that rocked my old, much smaller living room. I was scared because in the new big room, they sounded very tinny and suffered bad from echo.

The M60s sounded incredible in comparison. They seemed to defeat the echo effect almost entirely with moderate volume and the clarity was great, amazing actually! My room also has two large openings to other rooms and a catwalk in behind upstairs. So, I added the old subwoofer from my old HTiB system to the mix and it added some bass back that the room seemed to be stealing. In fact I had to turn it down to about 40% to get it to blend nicely. (It was still set at about 85% from the old HK's) The M60s did the rest.

I'm no expert but thought I would share my experience since it sounds like we have the same physical setup. Note: I only play music in this room. HT is down in the basement.

Hope that helps you with some worries you might have had over the room size and shape.

>>That all comes to $5311. Still a little bit over your $5000, but darn close and you'd have yourself one heck of a system.

You are forgetting about $300 for cables

We pulled the trigger and ordered the Epic 60/350 system. Sorry, was not thinking straight and started another thread instead of posting on the current thread.

http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=155993&an=0&page=0#Post155993

I am going to post some pictures of the room and would love to get opinion on the best location for the qs8 and subwoofer.

Thanks for everyone's input.
-Deepak