Well I thought it was about time I said hello to everyone on the Axiom forum. I've been sitting in the background for about the last nine months reading all the comments and experiences people have with there HT and audio set ups. I must say this is a great forum and I've learnt so much from here.
Here's a little back ground on me....Last year I moved to a different country, with meant selling all my audio gear to save on moving costs , but the up side to that was I can now buy near gear .
My last HT was a Pioneer receiver with Wharfedale speakers in a 5.1 set up (center and sub was Polkaudio) and I was happy with that. However I'm in the position now where I can buy nicer gear. So I researched speakers (B&W and the like) and came across Axiom. All the reviews I've read (on M60 & M80) have been very positive and pricing is great compared to other brands with similar performance. The Axiom team is very friendly and have a wealth of knowledge too, as with many of you here. It looks likely I will go for the Epic80-500. At first I had concerns about the M80s because the average room size in the country I live in now is typically around 1500 cubic feet where the M80s will be in. But from what I've read here M80s still sound great in small rooms. Is this correct?
The other issue I had was (because I'm a Pioneer guy) was what receiver. After much reading and research I'm looking at Denon 3808A(this is the replacement model in Japan) because it is very well priced and has the same features of other receivers I looked at but are still over priced compared to Denon. It also seams that I don't have to add a second amp to run M80s because Denon can do the job on its own, which means I save money.
I still have to wait a few months before I can buy everything and have the pleasure of listening to the Axioms, but I'm looking forward to it
So anyway hello to you all and thanks for all the great posts on the forum. I look forward to reading more.

Welcome! I imagine the M80s will be fine in your small room. Some people say it's nice to get them away from the walls a good distance, but I don't have much room to play with myself in that regard, so I can't say how much of an impact that has. I'm very pleased with the M80s, though, even in my less-than-ideal current location. I don't think you can go wrong with that Denon, either.

Hi CV thank you for the welcome
It's nice to hear comments from people who have similar space issues and product that I'm looking at and what they feel about it. It makes it much easier to make informed decisions on what to buy.

As long as you can fit them in, they should sound fine.

Welcome to the forums Reddragon. I’ve used an Epic 80-500 5.1 and 7.1 system in a 1536 cubic foot room in an apartment and couldn’t be more pleased. Depending on the layout of the room I don’t think you’ll see much improvement in going from 5.1 to 7.1 but if you know you will want the other two speakers later in a larger room it wouldn’t hurt to get them now and give it a try.

The only issue you may have (which any speakers will have) is bothering neighbors if you share walls. You can still play things at respectable SLPs especially if you attenuate the bass a little. To make up for this I’ve used a Buttkicker to add back the rumble that’s missing when the subwoofer is turned down. So getting some brand of transducer might be something to consider if your listening volume is going to be limited.

Cheers,
Dean

Hi StuntGibborn, thanks for your post
Fitting the Epic80-500 in the room is no problem. I'm the kind of person that doesn't over clutter a room, especially the living/HT area. I like to keep it simple. This room will topically only have in it the Epic80-500, two stands for the QS8s, flat panel LCD TV on it's own stand, audio bench in front of TV to place VP150 on and DVD/Bluray disc's, 3 seater couch and an audio rack/tower to place Receiver/ Bluray player and possible other components on.
The M80's are similar size to what I had back home but cabinets are deaper.
It's funny my wife use to ask me...do you really need speakers that big?? My answer was do you really need to buy other handbag? She doesn't ask me anymore hahaha

The only thing you'll have a problem with is getting through the wait after you order some.

Hi Dean, thanks for the great advise. I was trying to decide between 5.1, 6.1 or 7.1 setup but based on your experience with same size room I will just stick with 5.1. I can always add later if needed. I was also concerned with the apartment and neighbor thing to. I will be moving before buying the Axioms, so I will try to find an apartment where one side doesn't back on to another apartment if possible. From what I've seen so far room sizes are about the same everywhere, so volume will be limited.
Thanks for the tech advise too, I'll look into that as well.

Cheers

Yeah I know what you mean. I haven't had an HT setup now for nearly a year after moving countries. I currently live with my parent in laws where my wife and I are saving to set up our own place in the near future. They're not into high tech stuff, so I have to watch movies and listen to music on my PC I feel like banging my head on the wall because I know what I'm missing out on. Oh the wait must be worth it right?

Dragon, another welcome. Yes, it is time for you to say hello; you registered a whole month ago and we've been wondering why we haven't heard from you(just kidding).

Sure, you'll find that the wait was worth it when you get to enjoy the beautiful sounds through your M80/ 500.

Thanks JohnK, so you have been spying on me hahaha.
I like to sit back and assess things first I guess.
All though I'm confident about the Axiom speakers (even though I haven't heard them yet) and have changed my mind countless times over the past few months about receivers. Man what a sea saw it's been. But now after reading many reviews and reading on this forum I'm 90% decided on the Denon.
Thanks again for your welcome.

Wait till you start looking at projectors and screens. It’s totally redefined waffling for me.

Thankfully I have already decided on which screen to get. Now that I live in Japan I found the market to be very limited. That is Japan is a very domestic market place where the local manufacturers supply everything high tech, (which can be very different to what is sent overseas). I found it very hard to find the brand chooses like what North America has. I was planning for Samsung LCD flat panel because they have really pulled their products together and made great stuff, but I discovered that they putted out of Japan because of the domestic market thing. So my choices were limited to Panasonic, Sony, Sharp, Pioneer(plasma), Hitashi. All make great LCD TVs for Japan. In the end I'm going Sony because of features and competitive pricing. I did consider Panasonic but their bad customer service and product support (in Japan anyway) decided that one for me. I also seriously looked at Pioneer but their pricing is way to high compared to other brands. I did also consider importing but again shipping cost for something that big just costs to much.
It's been lots of fun researching everything though and my knowledge has grown.

When I was stationed In Okinawa in the early 80s everyone bought cameras and a lot of guys picked up audio equipment because of he favorable exchange rates.

Any chance you’re into anime? You could let CV and I know what the latest and greatest shows are these days.

Hey Reddragon:
I don't really have anything else to add to what others have said, but just wanted to say "welcome to the forums!"...

Yep, welcome as well! Where do you live now, and where you come from?

Sorry grunt I'm not so up to date with anime here but I'm sure once I get my gear I will diffidently be exploring what's available. So I'll keep you posted. How ever the last anime I saw was Ponyo about a fish turning into a human girl. Very cute movie. I found DVD and Bluray in Japan to be very expensive. Like a bluray disc costs around $60US. How much are they in North America?

Hi Mark, thanks for the welcome. Very much appreciated

Hi sirquack, I come from New Zealand and now as of last year live in Japan. It's been a real eye opener and quiet an interesting experience.

On the low end, $18 or so and on the high end I've seen them for $35. Most seem to run ~$25 though....

Wow great pricing. In New Zealand they run for $25-$40 dollars($12-$25US depending on exchange rate). In Japan a new release is 4500 yen which at current exchange rate is $80NZ. So I will fill my suit case with discs when I visit NZ again

I've seen sales on older movies in Blue Ray for under $15 CN, but new titles are generally in the $30 range.

Oh, and welcome Red!!

Hello! Welcome to the club.


Oh really! Is this the equivalent of the 3808CI in the US? Or do you mean this is the replacement *for* the CI? I've been thinking about getting a 3808CI, but if there's a replacement in the wings....

/me asks the great google for info on the 3808A...

Edit: Ahhh, I see, the 3808A = 3808CI. You got me excited there for a minute.

Reddraggon,

Mostly just a welcome also from me. Your mention of being 90% decided on the 3808 (any component really), made me chuckle in thinking of my AVR decision journey. I do recall feeling pretty good at the 90% decided stage of which Axioms and which AVR to buy... Having finally settled on and ordered my F.O. Axioms I do feel good there. I don't want to infect you with my 'do I wait for a new 38xx model-itis', but suffice it to say, being at even 95% decided still feels like the decision is just around (yet another) corner! But hopefully you do not suffer as much from Waffle-itis as Dean and I do. After all, you have already changed countries! How tough can an AVR choice be by comparison!

Again, welcome.
PS. I thought I sensed a Kiwi accent in those key strokes! I'd love to visit New Zealand. I have heard such wonderful things about it. I have visited the 'big island' to the west and loved that experience.

If you're a Pioneer guy and looking at the price range of the 3808, take a peek at the Pioneer Elite SC-05 or the SC-07.

I recently demoed a Pioneer Elite SC-05 with my M80's. Truly wonderful sound quality. No problems at all driving 4-ohm M80's, even out to very loud volume levels.

I know what you mean...



Tho I do think I have PJs narrowed down. Screens on the other hand, I'll wait 'til I have the space.

Welcome. But you can't just come in and say "I got it all worked out." Utter confusion and hand wringing is preferred for the first 500 posts. So chew on this: For your small room and growing savings, I would suggest the M60s over the M80s. The review Alan posted on the M80s points out that in a small room, the M60 may be the better bet. Plus, the ability to move away from the wall is diminished in a small room.

And, the 60s would save a few pounds (in shipping) and yen to buy some headphones for those late nights the neighbors might not appreciate. If you plan to move to another large room in the next 10 years, then choose the M80.

In other words, only buy the 80s after you have scripted out the next decade!



No, no, stop...I'm just happy to help, no thanks needed.

I'm also a newbie here. I have been researching a new HT setup for a couple of months and like what I have read and seen about Axiom. Unfortunately I have not been able to listen to them yet. I'm looking at the Epic Grand Master 500 with an ONKYO TXNR906. Any advice?

Where at in New Zealand. I lived in Wellington for a year and half around about 1988. I loved it there except for the weather even with a 5/3/2 wetsuit I still froze my backside off surfing Lyall Bay and Titahi Bay in the winter.



Which ones are you looking at. I’ve changed models at least 4 times ending up right back where I started. Though I had the screen nailed down but now I’m totally waffling on that. I need someone to start shooting at me, I make much better decisions when the adrenaline is flowing.

Cheers,
Dean

P.S. Reddragon - yes I’m trying to hijack your welcome thread so you can officially be a member of the forums.

The speakers are fantastic. That doesn't help you much, I know. Check out the 'hearing things' forum and see if there's someone nearby that would do a demo. Most of us Axiom owners enjoy demoing our systems. You can email Axiom about it too - they keep a list of demo-ers and might be able to set you up with someone.

I recently tried an Onkyo SR876, which is the little brother to the N906. I was less than thrilled with its SQ when driving M80's. However, based on others positive experiences and numerous glowing reviews elsewhere (everywhere), I am in a very small minority of people that weren't absolutely thrilled with it.

The only real issue that I've discovered while researching Onkyo is heat. Onkyo's run hot. It's apparently completely normal and by design. There's even a sticker on the 876's chassis that warns of the heat. You just need to make sure that it has a reasonably well-ventilated place to live in your AV rack. If it's going in an enclosed cabinet, you will likely need a fan of some sort.

Reddragon, meet Zimm. He's a gift, really!



Zimm, even though I did not read that 'first 500 post' requirement in the FAQ, I am well on my hand wringing way.

Red, though the hand wringing/ waffling psychosis is rampant here (prime offender here), if it is not your nature, "Step AWAY from the cliff!" It's like being on drugs. The highs are so good, and the lows (not to be confused with great LFE!) are, well confusing and frustrating. Chances are that you are one of 'us', but if not... save yourself!

Zimm, we only need to plan out TEN years?? Crap, I'm attempting to plan out TWENTY FIVE years. Ten years I could do in my sleep! Pffhhht! And stop being so modest...

Better decisions or more expensive ones? (then i guess you'll get one better)

My final PJ choice will partly depend on the room I end up sticking all this in, and how much budget I have left (and if I am not too house poor.) Also might depend how long the hunt takes and when the actual move and build-out takes place. There may be better choices in either features or price then.

In the plenty of money left category, I'm thinking about the JVC DLA-HD750 which can currently be found for a bit under $6k. In the not so much money left category, I might go with something like the BenQ W5000 which is more in the $1800 neighborhood.

Butweiser, welcome(some of the resident beer aficionados are probably hoping that isn't a reference to your favorite). I use M22s with the EP500 and that combination is excellent except in huge rooms. The 906 is also an excellent receiver, but unless one of its added features is something you really want, I'd suggest that you consider the 876 instead, which is available as a factory refurb for around $850 and is a terrific bargain at that price.

Thanks for your thoughts. I will check out the 'hearing things' forum and see if there might be someone close to me that I can listen too. I had heard that the Onkyos run hot. I have an audio stand that is open in the front and the back but adding more heat to my house when it gets 115 here in the summer is something to think about.

I just want to say to Reddragon and Olderbutweiser


WELCOME TO THE FORUM!

Thanks John LOL the I suppose the name would make it appear that I enjoy that brand of beer. Really I just thought it was a rather fun play on words. I am older for sure and perhaps wiser who knows. Yes the NIC is something I am interested in, I have 1000's of Wav, MP3s WMA files that would be nice to stream when my wife and I are doing projects around the house and yard. For serious listening we get the CDs, DVDs or even our old albums out and sit and listen. Thats the one really smart thing that I did when I was younger. When I bought a LP it got played once to record it on cassette and then was put away. Almost all my LPs are in pristine condition. The network is a convenience thing for us.

Thanks Dr House

My first thought was to get the Epson Home Cinema 1080 then I considered the Panasonic PT-AE3000U, moved up to the JVC DLA-RS20 and now eyeing the Epson Home Cinema 6500UB as an interim solution until someone can actually make a projector right. Everything has it’s plusses and minuses for me but also a deal breaking issue. Which likely means I will go lower end as an interim solution until someone makes something really good that also doesn’t have any deal breaking issues. Well any way, you know life’s good when one of your biggest worries is what HT projectors to buy.

Hi Peter...yeah from what I can compare between the US and Japanese sites for the 3808CI & 3808A are much the same, but I did notice the US one states THX Ultra2-Certified but the Japanese one didn't. Hmmmm???? very strange..the UK one also omits THX as well. I wonder if it's a type o on the US site?
In reply to another post I saw later here..I was very set on the Elite SC-07 (which is called SC-LX81 here. It's a great receiver and is kick ass but also carries a price difference of US$1000 more then the denon. So after reading post on Axiom and comparing features that I was interested in, I moved towards Denon. I admit though most of my listening test have been on Pioneer and not so much the Denon, well not the 3808 anyway. So now I well spend more time listening to the 3808 and try to make a informed decision.

Thanks for the welcome davekro. I was surprised to be only a day away from my PC and came back to see 38+ posts here hehe
Feels great to be welcomed like this.
Actually I've always liked Denon but could never afford the models I liked back home because prices are like a blow fish being over inflated (much like Japan really), but at least if you wait long enough the prices drop much faster here. Earning Yen helps to.
NZ is a nice country to visit or even settle down in if you want a relaxed life. For me it's was so relaxed I felt dead , so here I am in Japan. Australia is a great place to. More variety of things to do there, then in NZ. Now's a good time to travel because the NZ $ is down. Something you can take advantage of maybe?

Hi Zimm, funny you should mention the M60's....I had actually picked the Epic60/500 as my HT because I was concerned with the 4ohm thing of the M80's and the room size issue. I still have a few weeks before I move to somewhere else, so the final room size will help in decision making
Thanks for the welcome.

On that note, my Denon (AVR 3300) was recently moved from closed cabinet to open air AV shelf. I was able to remove the fan i had been using to keep it cool in the cabinet. That was fine during the winter, but this weekend the heat got to the Denon. It was strange, but a long day of mid-volume listening caused the volume to self-spike, and refuse to stay put! Thank God I was near the receive when it happened or I might be buying an entire HT system. I thought the remote going haywire, but after removing that from the equation and doing a hard reset on the Denon, I figured out it was the heat. Once cooled, all was fine.

I put the old fan back on and ran it for another 6 hours without a problem. The point you ask; even the mighty Denons can run too hot for their own good. Don't exclude the Onkyo on that basis alone.

Welcome Olderbutweiser
I also haven't heard the Axioms but what sold me on them was the positive professional reviews, the vast background knowledge of the Axiom team(also very helpful), the great pricing, people on this forum and of cause the 30 day money back offer from Axiom. Seams like a winning combination to me
Ask lots of questions on the Axiom forum...because there is so much knowledge here from all the HT owners. I'm sure they will guide you in a fun direction.

Hi grunt I probably past you in the street at some stage. I live in Wellington for 4 years around the same time before moving to Auckland. Yeah the water around NZ is always cold, even in summer. Most kiwis just hang out on the beach and look cool(try too) , but there are the crazy ones that will swim any time of the year. Ah no I'm not one of them.

Thanks Dr.House

Thanks Reddagon, Yeah I have spent alot of time reading professional reviews as well as personal ones about the Axioms. I sent Brent a fairly detailed schematic of the room we use and he suggested that the Epic Grand Master- 500 would work very well in that area. I think thats a good start I can always upgrade to the 60s later on when the budget permits. How come I wasn't born wealthy? Now I'm just hanging out in the forums when I have some time to see what else I can learn. It always pays to do your homework.

Did you ever do any roleplaying games. I ask because of your screen name. There was a game shop I used to go to on a side street off Lampton Quay if I remember correctly. I did a little gaming with a group of guys I met there. RuneQuest and Traveler is what we played AFAIR.

Red,
Well since I am blowing all my savings on speakers and HT gear, I won't be travelin' down under for some time. But it is fun to dream! (Like I dream my speakers will arrive tomorrow... 2 1/2 weeks early!)

Hi Adrian thanks for the welcome

Thinking about it the Grand Master would be all I need as well but guess I have a soft spot for floor standing speakers.
On the "born wealthy" note something to think about.....we are all born at the some level of wealth as individuals, what makes the difference is the choices we make in life to make the next step (also having rich parents is a good kick start, which I don't have ).

I'm not much of a gamer, though I do play PC games from time to time. I just like dragons and the color red, but the movie Reddragon sparked to idea....haha and no I don't set fire to people and push them down the street in a wheelchair