hello all.

I purchased a vp180 to replace my vp150 a couple months ago and have been completely satisfied. I still have my vp150 and have been unable to sell it. I am planning on picking up a emotiva xpa5 amp soon and it got me thinking. I could run the vp180 off the amp and the vp150 off my marantz sr6005. Allowing me to run the vp180 below and the vp150 above my 50" dlp. Is there any negatives to this? I'm thinking it will make the vocals sound more centered on the tv (height wise). I know a lot of people have upgraded to the vp180, has anyone else though of this?

Darren back whenever I bought our VP180 I wired it with the VP150 via a parallel connection having the 150 above and the 180 below our 73" screen and the combination didn't work well at all for me. My thought was the same as yours regarding planting the dialog onto the center of the screen but the 180 did such a goodl job on it's own that the 150 simply disappeared in the mix, you can try it but I certainly wouldn't expect any improvement whatsoever.

Having a couple of VP180s as dual centers like JC has would be a hoot I bet.

If you are using the preouts on the Marantz to an external amp for the center channel, you can't also use the AVR's speaker terminals for the Center Channel at the same time. You would have to wire the speakers in parallel as Rick mentioned, which would lower your Ohm spec for the total of that channel.

Given the size of your monitor and the fact that you already have the 180, it would be pretty much overkill. I must admit though, from my own experience, if you can possibly get the VP180 above the monitor and tilted toward the listener, it would sound better than being below it, however, because of its size, I am assuming here this may not be possible. Matching possible differences in volume level between the two could be an issue as well. I, personally, never liked the sound of any center channel that I have ever tried, regardless of size or configuration, below and in front of the screen of an RPTV.

I would NOT recommend combining your VP180 with a VP150. The VP150 has a horrible off axis response hence why Axiom is quickly replacing it with a VP160. Using both centers at the same time would result in significant off-axis shifting of sound. I can't see why you would need anything more than one VP180.

I have a M2 over and a VP150 under. The M2 dissapears sonically, but I believe that there is "some" benefit of helping to anchor the sound towards the center of the screen, but I don't get a lot of improvement. I agree with above statement that there would be much more lowering of ohms between a vp180 and a vp150. Much more than a vp150 and an M2. I don't think I'd try it.

Now I'm wondering how JC has his 2 VP180's hooked up. I'm guessing he is using the center pre-out to drive 2 mono-blocks, but I'm only guessing here.

LOL. The VP150 has been around for at least 7 - 8 years and the VP160 is still in "pre-order" phase...

You make a good point though. Any benefit noticed while "on-axis" would be gone once hitting "off-axis".

I have a VP180 here and the VP150 that it replaced. I have been trying to figure out what to do with it ever since I got the VP180. I should have put it on the Auction for a super low price and used the Axiom bucks for the VP180, but I didn't and now I have no idea what to do with it either.

There were mentions of things like a plant holder if you take out the speakers from the VP150, up to using it paired up with some M2s or M22s for a TV...

Here was my thread on the subject...
What to do with my VP150 if I get a VP180?

Hi JBall, Axiom is not replacing the VP50; it is adding another center speaker model to its line-up. The number of positive comments which we receive from VP150 owners far exceed the few negative ones. Using one VP150 with one VP180 is not recommended; it would be like using one M22 and one M80 as your front main speakers.

LOL That's a good way to compare the two JC.

There have been a LOT more than just a few complaints about the VP150. I had one in my system for a year wondering why dialogue was so unintelligible when I sat away from dead center. I replaced it with a Infinity Primus PC351 and WHAT a difference!

Too bad the VP160 wasn't available at the time but I can't imagine anyone buying a VP150 when the much better VP160 is available for only $100s more. Me thinks VP150 will quitely go away in short time.

I personally doubt it, I think a market for a smaller box, and on-wall variety of VP150 will still be around. Not everyone needs to satisfy a wide off-axis audience. Myself, for instance. But the VP160 will be a much better choice for those that can work it in. I've been much pleased with the output from my VP150. But since I can work in the in-cabinet model of VP160, I've decided to pre-order one of those.

Jball likes believing in troll comments over on AVS. I used the VP150 in my theater for many many years and there is no off-axis problems.

Try measuring a VP150 30 deg off axis and then come back and make that statement.

Get your flame suit Jball, everyone everywhere that doesn't sing the Axiom praise is a troll. They don't believe in science or your fancy measurement type stuff.

VP150 was the reason I went with another brand, couldn't fit the VP180 and VP160 was too tall. Dialog was hard to understand even sitting dead center or maybe even slightly to the left or right perhaps only 10-15degrees.

Thank you, Ken, for doing everyone else's homework!

Shareholder in the Making? Phooey! Defacto Axiom archivist and historian.

To some degree, I would have to admit that there is some drop-off with the 150 sitting off-axis but this can really only be determined by putting a "pink noise" signal through it and measuring that signal in that frequency range with an SPL meter. Realistically, when measuring in the same manner, there isn't a horizontal center channel speaker out there, regardless of price, that doesn't have some drop-off to one degree or another when moving off-axis, that is just the nature of the beast and the compromise of the center channel design. Believe me, I have tried and measured several brands. The only one that didn't have this issue was the now discontinued expensive Omnipolar channel designs from Mirage. Their particular tweeter design and positioning in the cabinet provided a pretty consistent signal as much as 80-90% off-axis, quite unique.

Prior to the introduction of the VP180, I was looking for a large center channel and tried one from Elemental Designs, the large A-6T6 5 driver behemoth from that company. Unfortunately, it had, by far the worst, off-axis performance of any that I have used, 2 and half to 3 db drop-off in level moving as little as 10-15% to the left or right of the sweet spot. Of course, it was returned almost immediately.

Now that I think about it, one of the reasons I prefer the VP150 over the VP100 is I can hear the center channel much better with the VP150. It's the VP100 I had an issue with off-axis listening.

Aren't there medications available for this type of behavior? Doc?

Nice find Ken.

I say give it a whirl. You'll need two separate amps though. Run a Y-connector from the pre out to the two amps. That is how I have my over/under screen center's wired. I have two, M22's running parallel under my screen, and one VP150 above my screen. I love it, and it does center dialog. There was about 1 db difference is sound between the VP and the M22's. Not enough to matter much. I have a VP160 on order, and I'm quite curious to hear how it plays with the VP150. I suspect it will play just fine.

Jball, my room is 30ft x 30ft x 9ft, it is very wide, and never had off axis issues. Show me your science on how you determined this, maybe GTP can assist.

I've always heard that there's not much benefit to surround rear speakers. But since I had it anyway, I stuck it on the back of my couch.

I would not recommend spending money for rears since the QS8 surrounds do such a good job, but then I already had the 150.

So I'm running 6.1 with 150 doing the surround rear duties.

I would think that's a better use then mating 150 with a 180.

If I wern't sworn to be so stingy with 'em, I'd give you a smiley face for that one, Randy!

I found that my VP150 performance varied (as would be expected) from one location to another. In V2 of my theater (when I first got the Axioms), I had it mounted above my 104" screen. Sounded best there pointed downward towards the listening area.

In V3, it was put under my screen and pointed slightly upward. This was mainly because of a height limitation in the dedicated room of V3 vs the open "general use" area of V2. Anyway, the dynamics of the room changed, and the speaker worked well with a little tweaking and room treatments.

Best speaker ever? At the time it was Axiom's best, but they keep improving, and I am so excited to try out my VP180, but the VP150 was far from "junk".

As for Randy's "Troll" comment, I don't think that he called JBall a troll, he was saying that a lot of people at AVS are trolls about products that they don't like without any 1st hand reasoning outside of utter egos. That happens over there a LOT. Not just Axioms. Heck, my new JVC RS45 I got gets occasionally bashed by someone who thinks that Panasonic is #1, or Benq, or Sony... I weed through the crap at AVS, find the nuggets of useful information, and move on.

Thanks for all the input guys!

Also thanks "SirQuack" for letting me know i cant use the pre-outs and AVR amp at the same time, i did not know that, and that would prevent me from setting it up with dual centers anyways. I would not bother with a separate amp. Hmm now what to do with this VP150? I tried aution here and canuckaudiomart @ $220 and still havent been able to sell it. When i build a second system it will be 2 channel only anyways so i have no need for this VP150... ARGH

Firing tweeters at opposite ends of a cabinet causes severe lobing issues. It's like taking a two-way speaker and turning it horizontally. Not a good idea and hence why Axiom is the only company doing it. The VP150 off-axis measurements were shown on a thread on AVS and you can see once you exceeded 15deg off axis, severe frequency response shifts were present.

I am sorry you didn't have the same experience as me, but since I dumped my VP150 and got the Infinity, vocals are much clearer and I am enjoying my home theater more.

I still don't understand the VP150 design as it doesn't match any speaker in the Axiom lineup. Personally, I'd like to see a VP160 offered with the ports to the rear to cut the cabinet width down a bit. Anyone placing a center in a cabinet can simply plug the ports. There is little need for a center with bass response below 70-80Hz anyways.

Have you tried a full range speaker as a center? There is just as much content if not more mixed in the center channel. The added impact and realistic male vocals is great.

You wouldn't just need to loose some width on the VP160 for many people to still be able to fit it inside a cabinet/stand it is also quite tall at ~11", not to mention if you loose the width then either the depth or height would need to be increased to maintain the same internal volume.