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Posted By: GregM What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/17/14 03:15 AM
About a year ago I upgraded my surrounds to QS-8's and added an HSU Sub. My front three speakers were M22's and the center channel a VP-150. I really like the sound but wonder what I would gain from going to M60's up front and the VP-160 center. If I were to only go with one of the two which would be better to start with? I am really looking for more what I call mid-base. Not room shaking LFE but more the sound you seem to get in action movies when someone fires a machine gun (usually it looks like an AK-47 that has that blunt but low frequency report as opposed to the sharper crack of an M-16). I am sure that either rifle has the sound added in as foley or whatever but this is the area I'd like to see improved.



My room is not real large. A family room maybe 15' by 15' with 9 foot ceilings it is open in the back to the kitchen. I'll post a pic if I have one online.

All speakers powered by a Yamaha RX-V675 or maybe a 677.

Greg
Posted By: brwsaw Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/17/14 03:29 AM
I haven't tried it but I'd upgrade to a 160 and go from there.
Posted By: jakewash Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/17/14 04:51 AM
Tough decision. You will gain that upper bass you seek going up to the larger speakers, I did the same upgrade many years ago, only went to the M80. I think you would benefit more from the VP160 upgrade first if you watch movies more than listen to music considering how much info comes through the center during a movie. If it is a more music than movies situation I would go with the M60 upgrade first.
Posted By: exlabdriver Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/17/14 07:42 AM
I have a pair of M22s for L & R with a VP160 CC (that I upgraded from a VP100).

Because there is so much more content mixed into the center channel as contrasted to several years ago, all you really need is a VP160. It is excellent in that role & digs deeper than most CC speakers out there. Furthermore, its driver placement on the front baffle is closer to ideal than the VP150 (or so they say!).

My Audyssey hears both the M22s & VP 160 at 40 Hz in my room so I have mid-bass in spades. The previous VP100 was heard at 80 or 90 Hz if I remember correctly.

The M22s are no slouches & are just fine as L & Rs as long as you have a quality sub or two to tie it all together. I don't think that M60s would give you any more performance but a VP160 definitely would...

TAM
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/17/14 01:38 PM
Thanks.

Decisions, decisions . . .

Christmas is coming as mom used to say.

Greg
Posted By: CatBrat Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/17/14 04:36 PM
I use M22's with the VP160. The VP160 added some of the upper bass I was missing.
Posted By: CV Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/18/14 12:01 AM
My vote is for the VP160, too. Also, that room likes a great place to unwind.
Posted By: fredk Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/18/14 12:02 AM
That's a really nice room Greg!

I'm going to agree with others on the VP160 instead of upgrading the mains.

When I bought my gear I had a chance to do direct a/b comparisons between the M60 and the M22 + sub. They were almost identical in sound except for the subs lower extension.
Posted By: bridgman Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/18/14 02:45 AM
One more vote for upgrading the center speaker first.

What frequency are you using now to cross over to the sub ? Might be worth bumping to 100 Hz to see if that makes any difference (and making sure the crossover on the Hsu is set to maximum).
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/20/14 02:45 AM
Thanks everyone. It sure would be nice to get a random $250 discount or so to help me make up my mind . . .

Thanks for the compliments on that room. It is a family/home theater room but works well overall.

Greg
Posted By: JohnK Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/20/14 03:17 AM
Greg, I don't know if what you were referring to by the "$250 discount" comment was the email sent today to owners, but it in fact offers a $250 "Gift Card" discount good until December 1st. It can be applied toward a speaker purchase of $500 or more(not Factory Outlet, refurb or B-stock), so this would be usable for a VP160, for example.
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/20/14 03:37 AM
Originally Posted By: JohnK
Greg, I don't know if what you were referring to by the "$250 discount" comment was the email sent today to owners, but it in fact offers a $250 "Gift Card" discount good until December 1st. It can be applied toward a speaker purchase of $500 or more(not Factory Outlet, refurb or B-stock), so this would be usable for a VP160, for example.


That is exactly what I meant. I wasn't sure if everyone got the discount so I was trying to be subtle.

I had to have a custom riser made for my VP-150 and have asked the guy who made it to price me one that will hold the VP-160. If anyone needs a tv riser to house your center channel PM me. All the guy does is TV risers and they are top quality and fairly priced.

Greg
No. not everybody got an offer. I've not been a long standing customer but have dropped in excess of $5000 in the past year with Axiom, so it can't be based on sales amount that they cut people from the list.

I might have picked up a sub or something like that with a nice offer like that, but there is always another year.
Posted By: fredk Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/25/14 10:11 PM
You can always call Axiom and ask. I never got the offer either, but I don't think they have a valid email addy for me any more. I would expect that this is why you did not receive one.
Posted By: JohnK Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 11/26/14 04:32 AM
Fred, I'd agree that those owners who didn't receive the email should check directly with Axiom if they're interested in taking advantage of the offer. One point that indicates that this wasn't intended to be narrowly limited is that the email states that if the recipient can't use it, it can be "gifted to a friend."
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/06/14 01:24 AM
Well I used my $250 coupon on the M60's. I did so as those are the fronts I have wanted for ten years. I really enjoy listening to music and that helped make the decision. In addition, the new VP-160 is quite the massive speaker and I really like the slim look of the VP-150. If I still think the front channel needs more punch, I'll pony up for the 160 after the 1st of the year. Birthday in January and I need to celebrate somehow . . .

Greg
Good on ya. You will love them and I dare say that is plenty long enough to ponder and wait for something that will bring such pleasure. Enjoy your new speakers smile
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/19/14 02:55 AM
Watched Godzilla last Friday and want to say I noticed a pretty big difference in sound over the M22's. That could be wishful thinking. I'll do more testing this weekend. The M-60's certainly have an awesome presence in my room.

Greg
Posted By: fredk Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/19/14 03:52 AM
Greg. What version are the M22s? Where are you hearing the difference?

When I did my comparison at the factory with V2, I was surprised at how much the same the M22 and M60 were in the mids and treble: virtually indistinguishable. Obviously the M60 has/had much deeper bass, but add a sub to the M22 and that advantage disappeared.

I wonder if what you are hearing is improvements in the mids and tweeters? I always wanted to compare a V2 directly to a newer version.
Posted By: bridgman Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/19/14 12:30 PM
In my case the comparison was between M2i and M60ti, both crossing over to the subs at 100 Hz to go easy on the M2s.

I thought the sound was surprisingly similar at moderate volumes, but all of my friends thought there was a huge difference and the M60s had much more "presence" (yeah they used the same word as GregM).
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/20/14 12:07 AM
Here is a picture of my sad, bachelor's Friday night. Watching a movie on my new M60's all by myself with just the bear to keep me company.



Greg
Posted By: brwsaw Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/20/14 02:29 AM
I'm up for a movie but you're a little too far (+/-800 miles too far) away. Next weekend?

The bear looks happy.
Posted By: fredk Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/20/14 04:36 AM
You sure you're a bachelor? That room is suspiciously well decorated.
Posted By: chesseroo Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/20/14 04:52 AM
Originally Posted By: fredk
You sure you're a bachelor? That room is suspiciously well decorated.

Not nearly enough nicknacks to be anything but a bachelor pad IMO.
That rooms actually looks easy to vacuum and dust!
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/20/14 03:31 PM
LOL.

YOu should have seen my last house. Clutter everywhere. I moved into an apartment in August 2013 while I figured out where I wanted to move and my next career choice. Well I found a great deal on a brand new house in Monroe, WA. I am out in the sticks a little ways but having new everything was pretty awesome. I vowed no more clutter. I also had to have my dog put down last summer so with no kids or pets and me taking my shoes off every time I enter the home it stays really clean. Mind you my house does not have a "hands off" old lady feel, just tidy and well organized. Also built an awesome garage storage wall to keep the garage neat as well. If you need ideas for garage storage, PM me and I'll send you a link to the one I built. It was very simple and space efficient.

Thanks for the compliments.

Greg
Posted By: GregM Re: What will I gain with these upgrades - 12/20/14 03:34 PM
Originally Posted By: chesseroo
Originally Posted By: fredk
You sure you're a bachelor? That room is suspiciously well decorated.

Not nearly enough nicknacks to be anything but a bachelor pad IMO.
That rooms actually looks easy to vacuum and dust!


LOL to your comment as well. I have noticed the ladies like to accumulate just that, knick knacks. Not to mention the female obsession with candles. Why must women insist on an open flame in the house????? Crazy fire hazard if you ask me.

Greg
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