Current setup is Denon 4311 with M80's for R/C/L (Emotiva amp powers these), QS8's for side surround, and on wall M3 in the rear surround plus two subs. I want to get the Denon 6700 AVR and add Atmos speakers to the ceiling. I have two bedroom Axiom M2(?) bookshelf speakers that will go on a ledge 11 ft. up and 6 st. to the left of the listening position. I am looking for recommendation for 4 ceiling speakers? The M3 in-ceiling speakers seem to be the only Axiom product and seem more than what I need and a little pricey? Thanks.

A few years ago I went with the M3 In-Ceilings and traded in my Qs8's when I was just doing 7.1. For the wall speakers I have M22 onwalls. I find for Atmos the direct radiating M22s do better than the quadpolar Qs8s did as you don't want the enveloping features. I'm sure you could use other speakers for the ceilings, maybe figure a way to mount onwalls. I do like the directional tweeters of the M3 inceilings to help dial in the sound.

No, wife won't allow anything but ceiling (lucky she is ok with that). I agree, directional tweeter would be good.

I saw the installation video for in-wall/ceiling. It appeared the anchors were attached to the drywall only. Does that mean they do not have to be attached to the joists? And that would not be affected by vibrations (sub)?

The way M3c attach to the ceiling is more than adequate, the wall board has no problem holding them.

That said the M3c is a big compromise and bit of a disappointment sound wise. I may write more on my findings as I'm still evaluating them in different spaces, experimenting with augmenting them with subs, and will try to see if equalization can improve anything.

They may fair better in a ATMOS setup since the low-end is where they fall short.

They also fall short in the mids. M2s are much better.

The in-ceiling also fall short in the highs due to the tweeter being behind the mounting plane.

I have no complaints in sound quality of the M3Cs for Atmos they are the bomb. Even in music mode on my Anthem they sound fine.

I have the M3C's in my garage for music when I am working in there..... I have them in my HT for ATMOS.

For music duty, they serve a purpose in my garage as background, non-critical music. No base to speak of, but I don't care for this application. I think they sound just fine. Definitely better than a boom box, and they are out of the way and don't take up bench space, and no wires to fuss with.

In my HT, for ATMOS duty, I think they are terrific. It's not as if you get a bunch of sound from ceiling speakers in an ATMOS system anyway. They are for objects. They also blend in well and look appropriate for where they are - in the friggin ceiling. I have M3 on walls for surround and rears. They are way-mo-betta than the Q's in the ATMOS application.

And thanks to Nick and Randy for all the help they gave me setting up my HT system!

Another Axiom little-known secret is using VP160v4 with HP driver on-walls as Atmos speakers.

Hi PaulHa,

Any chance you can put in-walls in the ceiling? For full-range music listening they work great.

No, wife already nixed that also. Thanks for everyone's feedback.

The in-walls come with paintable grills. I've seen them blend in very well.

Yeah, when I said low end ... I was including 125hz on down ... I'm still looking at this ... there is also something going on above that. The quick and dirty RTA I did confirmed what I was hearing (done in the kitchen which is a fairly large space). I have not really have had time to dig deeper. I'd like to run it again with a better setup (as the quick and dirty part was sending the sweep over bluetooth and a less then ideal mic placement).

As I have said before, the second biggest pleasant surprise to me in my Axiom journey is the bookshelf M2. The first biggest pleasant surprise is the M2OW.

Axiom has some great speakers. Was listening to some of the albums Andrew suggested somewhere. The M22 / EP500 combo is quite impressive.

On the M2s (which BTW I'm getting solely on your recommendation ... ok, my wife also wanted something small) ... one of the pair has arrived but the other has been stuck in FedEx's Memphis, TN limbo facility since May 13th. I'll tell ya what I think if and when I get it.

The M3ow were a big surprise ... incredibly close to an M3 (which I really like and recommend for anyone who wants a smaller bookshelf without a sub.) The only downside to the on-walls is amiability which might be mitigated with a FMB.

Did you get the bookshelf or OW M2s? I have both.

BTW, the M3 bookshelves were wayyyyyyyy too bloated-sounding in the bass department for my living room (12x22x8 and open to the rest of the house). No matter how I placed them, I had to cut the bass by over 20dB and they still sounded fat.

The M2 bookshelves and OW do not suffer from that problem. And the mids are OhSoSweet.

I take it that ARC is on ...

I usually have ARC Genesis running for most of my inputs. I do go back/forth now and then to compare the differences.

Mojo, only on-wall version I have are M3.

As far as the M3 bookshelfs bass being overblown I just have not have had an issue. For me, the bass bump adds enough oomph for it to stand alone. There is also a subtle difference in the mid-highs between the M3 and M22 ... the M3 is more tamed if you will. As I said before ... it's a very pleasant sounding speaker.

The M22 is more unapologetic and It presents what's its given, ahhh unapologetically, but, as we discussed in other threads, needs a low end supplement.

I didn't need any correction for the active LFRs in my living room. They sounded marvelous. I needed over 20dB bass correction for M3, 6dB for M50, 15dB for M5 and M100s were uncorrectable.

M2OW and M2 bookshelves don't need any correction either in the living room. And they are wall-to-wall soundstage whereas the actives only give me depth and width just between them.

The actives in the basement are a different story. That's another thread. I just spent 3 weeks eliminating position error.

Be interesting feedback to set up your M3c speakers as mains and then compared them with ARC on and off ...

Anyone wanting full range performance out of in ceiling speakers should look at 8” drivers.

Axiom only claims to 70hz -3db. Totally reasonable and in line with other in ceilings.

Vertical null for 8’ ceilings is 70hz first order. 140hz second.

Seated height spells serious issues. Cross to subs for best and best modelled performance.

Trevor, with no volume behind them I never expected to get full-range. I did expect to get an M3 curve from the mids on up ... i.e. something close to the M3 sound. I'm not getting that.

I'm really trying to figure out what is not quite right ... I have not proven that the M3c is not performing to spec (There are other factors which can be in play here). I'm only stating that I'm not getting the sound I was hoping for.

I think for a fair comparison you need to listen to the speakers on the same axis and bandwidth limit the content. Take port out of the equation.

We dont hear frequencies equally from above, nor do pleasing sounds usually eminate from above in nature-especially music. Usually danger.

The goal of distributed audio is equal coverage, and almost always in mono. Not sure if that is your use.

I’ve been involved in a few projects and can say sound from above does not sound the same compared with in wall speakers on the listening axis. Definitive Di6.5r all around in an 5.2.2 Atmos install was one. Sound from above without the aid of subs sounds thin and extremely directional.

Oh, by the way.... my posts are usually direct but I’m not trying to be a dink. Sorry if they read that way. Lol...

Trevor, no worries ... you have some good points. I need to have a listen in a smaller more conventional space. Haven't had the time to set that up.

I really should not have posted anything on the M3c till I had a full understanding of what was going on ... I do think I can safely say that the M3c is a big compromise sound-wise vs a M3 bookshelf or on-wall. If some of that is solely because it is ceiling mounted so be it ... that's part of the compromise.

BTW, I also think your right on in-ceiling mono vs stereo. I can get some imaging in my dining room (9' ceilings) if sitting centered and surprisingly when standing. I might be able to place the speakers if I think about it but I seem to be able to ignore it at the same time.

In another thread, I concluded that in-ceilings are best for ambient sound where aesthetics are overriding factor. I still feel that way. There we also bought up the idea that the QS series might be the better speaker to use for ambient sound if the aesthetics supported it. So, If I was designing a restaurant SQ10s would be my first thought. Here, I'm really trying to figure out if the M3c is worth buying ... over say the less expensive in-ceilings I had in my last ATMOS setup (which BTW is an impossible comparison to do by memory)

Ceiling speakers for stereo are an abomination.

Rich are you going for distributed or immersive audio?

Would influence the choice for sure.

I'm not really trying for immersive as in most cases it's just background music. It would be great if as you raised the volume it became immersive

Pterosaur shrieks from above ignite the limbic response ranging from involuntary bowel movement to running real fast. I know this.

I IBMd 40 years ago when my Kung Fu brother crane-beaked me in the left 'nad.

For the type of sound your looking for Rich. I think the Qs might be a little too dispersed for such effects.
Probably have more emersion with on wall or full bookshelves with the ceiling F.M.B. Can be aimed towards desired locations.

I also have the QS10s they create a great wraparound, I find mine most effective as sides as well. But the design is more for scattered sound. Maybe a couple of us with 10s should attempt stereo configs.

The rooms which have M3c's are rooms where we do not want any speakers showing. Aesthetics are paramount. So no bookshelves, on-walls or QSs ... The main purpose of the M3c's is to play the news, background music, and occasionally to fill the room for a party or just because we want to turn it up.

First I'd like to know how close an M3c is to an M3 bookshelf. So, before moving too far, one experiment I should try listening to an M3 bookshelf though a high pass filter with 70hz at -3 and -6db and see if either sounds close. Then the next step will be clearer.

Not the top project on my list ... but I'll probably try and sneak it in ...

I think you'll be just fine with compromised speakers for news and background listening. Parties too if you inebriate your guests so they can't perceive the notch at 1500Hz due to the tweeter interfering with the midrange. They'll also be too tipsy by the valley between 3 and 5 KHz due to the tweeter being behind the mounting plane.

No, restricted to ceiling only per WAF. The ceiling will only be used for Atmos most likely. The M80's are the front left and right and do fine for music.