[Sorry for the cross-post, but I only received one response in another forum, and I thought I might do better here. I am not trying to stir up trouble, I'm just looking for some alternatives to research before I buy.]
Alrighty...
I'm new to this forum, and Axiom, for that matter. I was brought here by the glowing comments at hometheaterspot.com.
I'm trying to justify replacing my baby Onkyo speaker system. (The trouble is, it sounds fairly decent to the family. Sooo, I've got to find something that is clearly much better, and for not a lot of money. Thus, Axiom.
However, it isn't in my blood to buy anytihng without doing a LOT of research, and listening to a lot of experienced advice.
I have some size constraints for ceiling-mounted speakers (can't be taller than 12"), so I need to go with M2's. I talked with Brent at Axiom, and he recommended the system in the subject for my room and needs.
What I need is some discussion regarding the competition. What *are* equivalent speakers to this setup? Paradigm also gets rave reviews, but I can't figure out what speakers I would want over there... too many choices, difficult site to navigate.
I also see auidoholics "recommended" satellite system is the RBH CT-5.1... he seems to be in love with these.
So, can someone give me some viable alternatives, so that I can make an informed decision and feel good about buying my Axioms, er, the right brand?
Here's my current setup, if it helps:
Room: 15x19x8=2280 cu ft
Onkyo 502 (75w/ch)
Onkyo HT-22 Fronts & surrounds. (65hz-20khz)
Onkyo ??? Center (pretty small)
Sony low-priced sub
(The onkyos were part of a home-theater in a box system)
What I *want* is clarity. I am a bit deaf in one ear, and need excellent voice clarity for HT.
Thanks very much to anyone with the patience to have read this far and/or respond!
Hi Allen,
I'm sorry you're not getting the kind of response you'd like. Most regulars read all the forums, so I don't think it was the placement that was the problem.
Obviously, the people here are going to be able to give you better feedback about Axioms than about the competition. But I do get your point.
That is a decent size room, and I don't have a full understanding of why you are constrained to very small-sized speakers. Perhaps a picture would help. Mounting speakers on the ceiling, even if you point them down, is not going to give you the best clarity and imaging.
Now, I think you'd get fabulous results with the M2, but only with a competent sub. I have no knowledge about your Sony, but many people really like the value of entry-level Sony subs. You'll probably still get a LOT of improvement by replacing the main/surround/center speakers first and then upgrading the sub later, if you decide it's worth it.
I guess I'd advise you to figure out your budget for this implementation (M2/VP100/QS4 = $845, only $760 if you buy from the factory outlet). Then, go and listen to some other comparable speaker packages in that price range. You may find it difficult to locate a "package" that is comparable; it seems like most manufacturers' products in that price range include the sub (the whole 5.1 not just 5.0), so you'll have to try to compare apples to apples.
I very seriously doubt you will find anything that can perform like your proposed Axiom system for that much money. The surrounds, in particular, are fantastic. They might seem expensive, but the design and quality of the surround experience is really quite amazing.
I also think you will be astounded by the improvment that the VP100 will make in your HT experience.
Then, after you've auditioned and researched yourself to the point of exhaustion, if you cannot find a nearby Axiom audition, order just the M2's and see what you think. It would not break the bank if you decided that you had to send them back.
I agree with you about the total unintelligibility of the Paradigm site, btw.
Thanks. I left the sub out of the discussion because I've pretty much decided on a STF-1 or STF-2.
Excellent choices. I have an SVS PB1-ISD and love it. They just released a PB10-ISD for $399, so you could give that a look, too. Some folks are disappointed that it does not have an adjustable crossover, but I think your Onkyo 502 would take care of all that anyway. The Axiom subs are fine, too.
You might consider the Hsu Ventriloquist system; it seems to get good reviews. But I would be concerned that it would neither fill your room adequately, nor provide sufficient upgrade from your current setup as to warrant the expenditure. Worse, you would probably have a difficult time auditioning it, too.
So, is form factor the driving force here? That is, you really need the mains to be fairly small boxes?
Pretty much. The two doorways that sit directly to either side of my television don't leave room for floor-standing speakers, and a speaker that hangs lower than the door frame would not get past the wife.
How about a
Mirage Omnisat?
I know nothing about them, but they look cool and they're pretty small.
I was waiting for that one to show up.
Exactly the kind of responses I was looking for. Thanks!
Those Ominsat's are a little weird for me. But the Ascend's look pretty comparable. And, about the same price and this year's reviewer's choice...crap...I was hoping to make this choice easier, not harder.
Anyone done a side-by-side with the Ascend Acoustics
CBM-170 / CMT-340c?
(If this is getting too far away from Axiom's purpose for this board, please let me know, and I'll find another forum for this. It's just that you guys seem to *know* things, and are nice.)
If you search on this forum and the ascendforum.com....and the various other forums, you should have enough comparisons to make your head spin.
Yes...this board is very nice.
Curtis and Spiffnme are the two who have done comparisons. Curtis has 340s, Spiffnme has M60s and M2s, and has owned M22s. They should be along shortly...
Don't worry about comparisons like this. As long as you remain civilized, we will too!
I also have 170's.
The bottomline......as always......best to listen for yourself, and you won't go wrong with either.
Will do some more homework tonight.
So, I'd like to find three top contenders that I can put in front of the wife. So far, it looks like (all paired with an STF-1 or 2):
Axiom M2/VT100/QS4
Ascend CBM-170/CMT-340c
Paradigm ???
RBH CT-5.1? (Anyone heard these?)
Curtis, do you have 170s at each corner (x4), and a 340 center?
Edit: Never mind...just found your profile. The 340 sides would be too big for me... whatya think of the 170s as L/R and rears?
I used to have 170's as mains. Four of them at the corners would be excellent....especially for multichannel music.
If what you are looking for is a small system that sounds really good do take a look at the HSU Ventriloquist system.I have this system in a 20x15x7.5 room and it does sound great for the size and cost.As amatter of fact they are running a special on this system with the STF-2 for $559.00
Sound and Vision mag just did a positive review on it also.Check it out.
Sensible Sound also has a very nice review of the Ventriloquist System in the latest issue.
Might alsm want to check out the Rocket Extremely Luscious Theater system at www.av123.com. I have heard some nice things about it. Price is higher though.
Curtis gives excellent advice. I had actually considered mentioning the Ascends but mistakenly thought they were larger. My bad.
Personally, I am seduced by the Axiom quadpolar surrounds. I used to have direct-radiating surrounds and I find that the Axioms are amazingly immersive by comparison.
However, if you intend to delve deeply into multichannel audio (SACD/DVDA), then you might be well served by having identical speakers at all positions.
I still think those Omnisats look really cool, especially if you have to mount something on the ceiling.
Like Curtis said, there is no substitute for listening with your ears, preferably in your room. Good luck!
why not start with just the axiom center... vt150. Since it's the most important part in dialogue and clarity in HT. I was blown away with the difference it made for me when watching movies... if your not impressed send it back. If you are buy the rest of the setup.
Awesome advice all around! Thanks!
You bring up a good point about multi-pole surrounds. I just finshed listening to Floyd's DSOM and Alison Krauss on SACD, and I must say that DSOM is simply awesome. So I do like 5.1 music quite a bit as well. You think much detail is lost when not using direct sound? I think I will get the HSU next week from CompUSA, and try to decide if I'm gonna get just the center for now or go for the "home theater" discount by ordering 5 pieces. My current setup simply doesn't sound too bad, really.
My problems mostly are voice clarity and low-end. So a new center and sub may be the way to go.
I don't completely buy the Ventrilquist's method of using the center to fill in the sides. The freq ranges it fills in are quite directionally audible, and I have to believe that there's got to be something left out of many parts of the sound stage.
Anyone actually heard those Omni's?
Also, if the Ventriloquist system is $559 with the stf-2 ($399), then they're valuating the 5 speakers at about $160 or so, which scares me a bit, I think.
If I were looking for real small speaker for an HT setup...I would jump on that Hsu package. But I am at an advantage, I have seen and heard them a few times.
I've heard the Omni's at a local Tweeter and wasn't that impressed with the sound. Mind you, it was up against some floorstanding Mirages and Boston's. It was also a while back. I didn't do a critical listen against other small bookshelf types. So I guess my remark is useless.
I do agree with Curtis the Hsu system is on heck of a good sounding system.You get 6 speakers with it not 5.I think you will be quite suprised on how good it actually sounds.Like I said before I do own it and it did suprise me.
My main 2 channel speakers are Axiom M80's and dual Hsu Vtf-2's, by no means does the VT-12 sound as good but for the size and money it aint bad.