I have M22s and an M2 center and am pretty happy with them.

For surrounds I have two small speakers that sell for $10 occasionally at best buy. How important is it to get good surrounds? To get sound matched (Axiom) surrounds?

I am considering some Athena AS-R1s instead of Q4s (the grill is the same color and the reviews are decent. Price for two could be as low as $130.

Small room (10x20 feet approx) used 90% for music, 10% for video/dvd. With the layout of furniture (not negotiable) it is more like a 10x10' room.

Really, my room is so small that surround sound is almost a joke, but I like it. But $400 more for QS4s for what kind of improvement? With all the starving people in the world and future budget needs in the family....

For HT cheap surrounds are tolerable... you will lose some of the ambience effects of the QS4s but will still get >80% of the enjoyment. Just remember if you're going to go cheap go really cheap so you can still buy what you really want later.

I ran with cheap surrounds for quite a while and still enjoyed the system a lot when playing DVDs. No worries...

If you're going to want to play music in 5.1 then cheap surrounds are a waste of time and money... you're going to find that playing in stereo sounds better than 5.x

The $10 speakers don't sound too bad in the treble region. I think they are completely missing bass of any kind, but they don't seem to detract at present.

Do surrounds "need" to match? I have heard that is not as important as the front line since they often play different sounding notes anyway.

I did briefly try some bose 301s at surround (someone gave me when they moved) and they sounded better, but did not meet the WAF standards. (For once the wife was right but for the wrong reasons)

By the way, thanks for the advice Bridgman.

I guess I am hoping you are not right about music, but you probably are.

Luckily:
1) Having never heard a good 5.1 system I won't notice
2) Having some high frequecny hearing loss - maybe I won't notice
3) If I do notice - The Athena surrounds will match my bedroom B1s and might someday be used in a den if I ever move to a bigger place.
4) I can afford a $120-130 mistake - especially with #3 above.

Hi,

As usual, Bridgman is correct, although I'd add that the closer the timbral (tonal) match of surrounds to the front speakers, the more seamless the presentation of ambient effects with music or movie soundtracks.

Using a well-recorded multichannel DVD, SACD, DVD-A, or even a CD decoded through DPLII or Logic7 and QS4s or QS8s, the walls of your small room can "disappear," and you are acoustically transported to the space of the original recording.

Regards,

alan and bridgman

Sorry - this is kinid of a ramble. Any more advice is appreciated, as was the previous advice.

Actually with the cheap surrounds that were unidirectional - I liked all five (point one) speakers better than 2.1 or 3.1. I haven't heard a complete matching set of axioms - so I don't know what I am missing.

One day when I can justify it to myself, I will probably get Qs4s. For now these athena surrounds will do fine. (Bridgman's idea of going cheap to be able to afford better in the future). It is a question of what I can afford at present, along with what I can feel comfortable investing money into. Long run - yes a good all around system seems like a wise investment. Short run - $120 for decent surrounds seems fine to me. They don't match but with my ears (or my education of said ears) I don't think I will notice.

(Next week - I hope I am not back to wondering how to afford QS4s)!

My small room does seem like quite a bottle neck to a good sounding 5.1 system. There is only one place the sub can go - whether it sounds good or not. I might experiment by moving the sub to where I sit and then moving my ear around the room. But I think it would be frutiless with a 2 year old running around the apartment trying to stand on the sub, and a wife with some sense. Heck, even I can't think of another place I would want to see that sub. But I should try.

Also, the center is back about 4 feet behind the left and right speakers - I have adjusted the receiver, but still it seems a bit weird and maybe off. The center actually should go right where the window is - so it is a few feet off to the side as well.

And the tv is right under the left speaker due to the window and the couch (only reasonable place for it in the apartment). Luckily I am not that picky on movies - sounds ok like it is as long as the movie is good.

These Athena's are tri directional - so they should be an improvement over the KLH speakers.

Anyway - quite a few issues with speaker placement in my apartment. I kind of wonder if they would ever "disappear" but then I don't have much to compare them to. Just my new Athenas and some old Paradigm Titans. The M22s are much superior to either.

I am using a Onkyo 501 - if that makes any difference. That I could upgrade if it didn't cost too much. But, I hear it is a pretty decent receiver.

The aprtment is small and awkward to place speakers in - but the rent is free! I live where I work.