Hi. If you had a 12x13 room what would you recommend...m22's with sub or m60's and later add surrounds etc...JC told me that the M22's sound similar to the M60 without much bass of course and that with a sub they would be fine in such a room...what do you think? Thanks!!!

Are you planning to use the system more for music or for movies ? If you are leaning strongly one way or another I think this is a no-brainer -- M22+sub for movies, M60 for "primarily music". If not sure or 50/50, I would lean towards M22+sub because (assuming you get a decent sub) they will do everything well.

Having a decent sub really adds a lot for movies, but IMO the bass response on the 60s is more than enough for any music I play and I still *slightly* prefer the sound of full-range speakers vs. bookshelf plus sub, although I would be hard-pressed to explain exactly what I prefer. I only notice the difference when listening to relatively "pure, melodic bass tracks" so I'm guessing it is something not quite right in level/phase settings or placement resulting in response funnies around the crossover point.

Having said that, I ran with M2ti's plus a big SVS sub (well, with VP100 and QS8s as well) as my primary system for quite a while -- in a 13 x 30 room no less -- and was really happy with the sound for both movies and music. The M2s couldn't quite keep up when playing loud music but the M22s would be noticeably better.

[EDIT] Just to avoid misunderstandings, the M2s worked well for "reasonably loud music" in that sized room as long as I was matrixing the sound to 5.1 and using the center and surrounds as well. You wouldn't want to try to get "loud music" in a room that size from just M2s and a sub. M22s and a sub would be noticeably better, but M60s would be better again IMO. In a 12x13 room, though, it's a different story -- I think M22s and a sub would probably play as loudly as you wanted without crowding their limits.

Just for completeness, the opposing view is that once you buy good stands the price difference between bookshelf and floor standing speakers is not that large.

Also note that if you are going to be expanding the system later, particularly growing into a larger room, you don't want to be getting "just enough sub for now". My personal take is to go with bookshelf speakers and cheap stands if that lets you get a sub that will last you for a while... failing that you might want to go with floorstanders which will last you a long time, and add a good sub some time in the future.

Nobody said it was easy

Okay, this is my situation. I love the M60, my brother in law got them after I recommended them from what I had read. My concern is that the M60 could be too much speaker for my 12x13 room and I say that because they sound awesome in a 24x14x20. Then again, the M22 may not be enough...I listen to jazz with acoustic bass, rock, etc...I'll be mostly listenning to music, 90% maybe but I do want to get into the HT experience. Also, I won't be listenning at high volumes. If I do get the M22's I''ll go ahead and get the VP100, the QS4 and the Sub EP175 powered by a Denon 2807. If I get the M60's I'll stay stereo only with an old Onkyo I already have. One more thing, I tested the Monitor Audio RS6 and the semm to be right in between the M60-M22's and they sounded vety nice too, but I prefer the M60 anyway. Thanks guys for your help!!!

osvi

Wow, that IS a tricky choice for you. If it helps, IMO the only way you can have "too much speaker for the room" is :

(a) you pay more than you have to and don't get much better sound

(b) you piss off the rest of the family by having "those big ugly boxes" in the room

(c) you have to put the speakers closer to the wall or corner than you would if you had a larger room, so close that the bass reinforcement off the walls/corners makes the speakers sound boomy or otherwise bass-heavy

(d) you turn the volume up too high and hurt yourself

Seriously, either system would work just fine in your room. In my case I bought M2s and a sub and was totally blown away with how much better DVDs sounded... so much that I flipped over from being a "90% music" listener to more like 50/50.

M22s will sound about 99% as good, but you want M60s. Figure it out, dude

I had M22s and a sub in a room pretty much the same size and not once did I even wish I had gotten the M60s. While not huge, the M60s are big and unless you stick them right up against the walls or in the corners -- which is highly inadvisable -- they'll take a bite out of your floorspace.

In that size room, M22s + sub will be much mmore versatile, though you will need stands or some other surface to place them on.

Had Please explain, Peter. What's the past tense stuff all about?

New house.

indubitably, my dear Kenneth. Indubitably.


(Sorry. I've had the house to myself for the past week with a very manageable honey-do list, so I've taken advantage by wathcing a TON of Star Trek:TNG episodes. )

After reading every possible audio site-forum available and listenning to quite a few speaker models I decided to order the M60's. I'll post my experience. Thanks to all!!!

osvaldo

Sounds great!

I am sure we all want to hear about your new 60s.

First line stuff or FO?

Ditto

For that room size I'll go w/ m22 +sub.
Hey, you're from PR cool!
I bought my M60 back when I was living down there in Guaynabo, PR 3.5 years ago. Axiom has excellent service, they paid the 6% state tax when they shipped the speakers, no other company would do that.

Nice to see someone from PR...

~Jaime

I got my M60's, next day air, I can't be happier. I've been reading obsessively for around a month. Listen first to the BW603, the best speaker I've listen too up to that moment.A week later Klipsch, Energy and Viennas. Didn't like the Klipsch HT and Energy and Viennas were ok, but pricey, $1500 and up. Next was Jamos and Paradigm, I said wow, very nice too. Then, my brother in law nedded new speakers...I told him, I hadn't listen to the M60's but reviews where great and gave him MY guarateed, "if you don't like them I'll try them, If I don't like them I'll pay shipping back". He didn't have anything to loose. Well he liked them, and me too!!! So, Why was I asking about the M22? My room, 12X13, too small, maybe the m22 it's ok. Well, I like jazz alot, the acoustic bass needs to be clear which it's not easy especially for a small speaker. How does the M60 sound...awesome. One other thing...I gave a listen to the Monitor Audio RS6 and ALMOST bought it. If tested side by side (MA RS6 and M60) I'm sure I would have picked the M60... by a hair. The RS6 is absolutely beautifull and sound great too. So I'm a happy Axiom owner. Thanks to the reply's to my questions, it did help.

osvi

Congratulations on the new speakers. Acoustic bass on the M60s sure sounds good, doesn't it ?

Glad you went with the ones you really wanted

Congrats on the speakers!

Lots of bass in those 60s.

Congrats! Now you can have M60s with sub.

Congrats on the M60, I had mine on a 10x11x8 room for a year or so. I found them bright at first, reading here and w/ some help from Axiom's staff we figure out that the problem was room reflections. I had an all concrete walls and ceramic floor and hardly any furniture in the room.
The m60s LOVES acoustic jazz... I have Peter Cincotti cd , it has one of the best recorded acoustic bass I’ve heard.

~Jaime