Hey everyone. I can proudly say I am part of the growing Axiom family now. I got my M80s last week and GEEZ!!!!! These are by far the finest sounding speakers I have ever heard. I have never auditioned any really high prices speakers since I can't afford them, so I can't compair these to such as some do. They blow away anything I have heard under $2000 lets just say that. One question though. For those who enjoy 2 channel audio, what crossover setting do you use on your receiver to get the best sound from these? They sound great in pure direct with no SW, but my EP500 will be here next week and I would like to see if I can mix that into my music listening as well as HT. Gotto go, the wife and kids just left for an hour so time to turn it up....
Congrats Jon! Generally speaking, the crossover should be around 80Hz to 60Hz. There is no definite rule, though. Play with it a bit and see what you like.
Hello! Newbie axiomite myself... listening as I post. I'm still amazed.. I run my M80's in pure direct (for music) in large mode, with my sub supporting the lower end, and love it. Crossing at 60hz for movies right now. I had never run tests on my present sub (Def Tech PF15), but after some disappointing results I made the additional plunge for the EP500 (due Friday). I'll post how I set it up. Funny, I'm normally very conservative financially.. let's just say I didn't expect to hear what I've heard! Cash is flyin outta my pockets baby! Had I discovered Axiom a few years ago...I'd be in trouble!
Welcome Jon. I keep my reciever at 80, and the sub at bypass, letting the reciever control the sub.
I have 60's and use a 80hz crossover on the receiver with the EP500 in bypass mode also. I also leave all my speakers to small, not large. In my opinion, 80hz is the best overall setting for both music and home theater. For just music, you could probably use 60hz, however, I would still use small on the mains. You will still get killer bass, and be able to really crank it up...
Well here I go with another 'devil's advocate' query, with the quest to fully understand..
If a good sub is part of your HT, why purchase nearly full range floor standers (M80's, M60's), if the best results for music and movies are obtained by crossing them at 60 or 80hz? Wouldn't nearly identical results be obtained by M50's or M22's in that situation (higher cross for M22)? I'm more than satisfied with my choices... just seeking the wisdom of those more experienced than I.
That is a good point, Spoiler. Sometimes you can get a bit more impact out of floorstanders. Sometimes a large room calls for large speakers. Some people will buy floorstanders just because they can. My brother-in-law runs his floorstanders full range with a sub.
No rules need apply, per se. Any which way you look at it, you're gonna get good sound. For me, I would buy the floorstanders and use them full range for two channel music, and then run them with the sub for home theater. This way a lot of the low frequency load is taken off the receiver.
There are many more reasons, and I'm sure others will chime in.
Though the crossover is set to 60 or 80hz doesn't mean there are not frequencies below that point that make it to the speakers. With a floorstanding speaker opposed to a bookshelf there is a fuller sound. This has been reported by most when going from M22s to the M60s and also from those that have gone from M60s to the M80s.
I like to call it the slippery slope.
>>If a good sub is part of your HT, why purchase nearly full range floor standers (M80's, M60's), if the best results for music and movies are obtained by crossing them at 60 or 80hz?
Very good question. If you think about it, though, the big difference between M80s and say M50s is not the bass, but more drivers to handle the higher notes. If you want to play at high sound levels in a medium or large room you need to move a bunch of air even for the frequencies above 80 Hz, and that's where the extra drivers of the M60 and M80 come in.
Let's say the sub covers from 20 to 80 Hz, or two octaves. The main speakers still need to handle the remaining 8 octaves, and there's a lot of energy in those 8 octaves.
Could you make a speaker with all the drivers of an M60 or M80, put it in a smaller box and sacrifice some bass extension, and still get as good a sound in an HT system ? Probably, but nobody would buy it
I guess I'll have to play around with it. I am also getting the new Yamaha RX-V2600 so I'll have to dial that in too. It does have an adjustable crossover as opposed to my Onkyo which is fixed. I am not sure where it is fixed at though. I prefer the sound in pure direct sending full range to the M80's. It just seems something is missing when using the sub on this receiver. The EP500 may change things though as may being able to set the crossover lower. Experimenting is all part of the fun though.
Let us know how things turn out!
Don't know if you would be interested in the THX settings, but my Onkyo specifieds the THX as 80 Hz. That is were I set my speakers.
In reply to:
Could you make a speaker with all the drivers of an M60 or M80, put it in a smaller box and sacrifice some bass extension, and still get as good a sound in an HT system ? Probably, but nobody would buy it
Sounds like a great new center channel!!!
When watching THX movies I set the crossover at 80Hz. But when I am listening to music, I set the crossover at 40Hz. The M80s can go down to 34Hz. I have tried out 40, 60 and 80Hz settings. The overall audio experience is somewhat different depending on the source. I think you can just leave it at 80hz for both movies and music. But it seems a shame to do it for almost full range speakers like the M80s! These days I am using the 40Hz setting.
The other issue with my Denon AVR is whether to set the speakers to Large or Small. I am using the Large setting for all my speakers now. But again, depending on your sound preferences, you may like a different setting! Experiment and enjoy!
I have been an Axiom owner for only a few months. I have been trying out the speakers with different settings and various types of audio and video material. The 4ohm M80s do like a powerful amplifier!
Thanks to Soundstage.com
I'd say a cross over of 80Hz would work well with the M80v2.
As to the graph posted for the M80s, it does appear the 80s start to fall off at around 80Hz. As Ian has stated a few times, as well as others, the NCR chamber is accurate to only 85Hz. The graph does not take into account in room response.
From Soundstage
"One should recognize that since these measurements are performed in anechoic chamber, they will generally show less bass than what you can expect in a real room."
From the Soundstage review. "I’d estimate bass to a solid 30 or 35Hz in my room"
So it would be OK to set the crossover at 40Hz and enjoy the full range of sound from the M80s.
I think an 80Hz cross over point with a 6 db slope would be perfect.
you have your VP150 set to large?
Richie, the disadvantage may be in rolling off the EP600 above 40Hz when in fact it has excellent bass(even better than the M80s)for at least an octave above that. Also, if you're running the VP150 "large" there's some weakness in the area below about 80Hz which the EP600 isn't covering.
I have tried the VP150 at both Large and Small speaker settings. There is a minor difference in the audio experience. I think the Small setting is better for the VP150, while the Large setting is OK for the M80s. I wish Axiom made a M100 or larger speaker! :-)
JohnK:
For movies I do set the crossover at 80Hz. For music, I have been trying out 40, 60 and 80Hz settings to hear the minor differences in the audio experience. I know that I would be happy to leave the crossover at 80Hz! But I like to experiment (and tinker!). I guess I have too much time on my hands! :-)
Since I have the EP600, would you recommend the 80Hz setting as optimal?
I guess I can't make any determination on mine until I get my EP500 and Yamaha 2600 receiver in. I have a Klipsch KSW12 which is a very decent sub, but not anywhere near the quality (AKA price!!!) of the EP500. To me I am missing something using the SW for mucic now, probably a combination of the Onkyo's fixed crossover setting and the sub not being the EP500. I experiment quite a bit and than let everyone know what sounds best to me when all the components are in place. Than once my HT is done and I get to move everything in there....I get to do it all over again. Sounds like a fun weekend to me
Have fun, looking forward to your review
I'll admit it could be because of sub placement (don't have many options), but for 2-speaker music listening, the best combo I've found is to run the M80's full range with a little support from the EP500 crossed at 60hz. I played with different cross settings for the M80's, but by far the best sound (for me) is full range. For movies, I prefer the small setting crossed at 60 or 80hz.
For my stand alone two channel system, I found that the sub set to 50 is just about as good as it gets. I run the M80’s through the sub’s line level input/outputs. Not real sure if that means the M80’s are getting the full range or just the signal above the sub’s x-over setting. I’ve tried it in numerous settings and volumes over the past two years and find that where it is now is just perfect. Any more and a person can hear the “sub woofer” and not the music. At 50, the sub and 80’s blend great and there is plenty of low end. I can hear the boom downstairs very well. I also played with the volume quite a bit. I’ve found that setting the sub’s volume just slightly higher than the speakers is all that’s needed. I like it right at 2-3 db.
I guess I should also mention that I have the Rotel’s tone setting at L1, which is a 1.5 db LF bump.
For my HT, I’m still playing with X-overs and sub volume levels. Just when I think I like it, I play another movie with more/less of a LF sound track and end up running to the sub. I doubt I’ll ever figure this system out……….