I'm a long time Axiom owner who has been thinking of upgrading my system slightly. I currently own High Gloss Cherry M60's,VP150,QS4's,and an HSU STF-3.

I've been looking at both the EP500 sub and the M80's. I can only afford to upgrade one but not sure which I should do. I tend to be 60/40 movies to music. I love the look of M80's but I'd have to get them in the standard black as I wouldn't be able to afford the HG. I'd probably have to put my 60's up for auction but not sure what I'd get for them.

Then there's the sub. I've looked at a bunch of others but they are all in the U.S and I'm in Toronto, Canada, so by the time you add shipping, taxes/duties, I'm either at the same price as the EP500 or higher. If I put my current sub up for auction not sure what it would be worth.

Any opinions?

Have you considered upgrading to the VP180? that would cost less than the other upgrades your looking at even with the HGC finish and according to many who've switched to the 180, it may give you more bang-per-upgrading-dollar.

My suggestion would also be to upgrade the center as Adrian previously mentioned. Or if possible adding a third M60 as a center. I think this would be the biggest bang for the buck with your current set up.

If your only considering upgrading the sub another option for us aside from Svs or Axiom here in Canada is Funkywaves. They're located in BC and they build custom subs which will rival just about any commercial sub..IMO.

Just a thought...

I think everyone want v3 M60's now a days and that would hurt your resale value.

Are all of your speakers HG Cherry? If they are than you don't want to mix in black.

You never mentioned what you felt was deficient in your current system.

The VP180 is definitely out. No room for that or anything else for the center. It's eitehr the M80's or sub. PLus I have no problem with my VP150.

I checked the Funkywaves site but they are way out of my price range.

Yes all my speakers are HG cherry. Nothing is really deficient, just feel like upgrading something . Well, I've always wanted the a better sub but initially could only afford the STF-3. But I love the look of the M80's. I may be able to get them in HG Cherry but it's really stretching the budget.

Dan, if you're thinking of just upgrading "slightly", you probably shouldn't bother. Looking at your options, it does appear that nothing stronger than "slightly" would apply.

Possibly use some income to buy more movies and music to enjoy the fine system that you have now. You might even(gasp!)spend it on something that's more important in life than audio equipment.

thought so too...but he worked within my set budget...you have nothing to lose by opening up a line of converstion with him.

fwiw...pricing on the fw10.1 start @ 500.00 and there is 12" version as well that he could do http://funkywaves.net/catalog.cfm?item=fw_10_1

I also think that your best upgrade would be the center but since it's not an option and if you really want to upgrade, I'd go with the sub, specially since you do more movies than music. JMO.

lol I'm shocked that you guys are actively discouraging me lol

I have some extra cash and want to use some of it for the speakers. Let me ask the question this way, which improvement would I notice more, the sub or M80's?

Without question the SUB...but it really depends on how much you spend...

WEll the amount spent is the EP500 max. I guess the question is will the EP500 be a noticable upgrade over my HSU STF-3?

I'd get the M80's in High Gloss cherry. It's only $300 more than black. The M80's would also provide a little more bass capability with the larger cabinet.

Okay, Dan; you just have to spend that "extra cash"(I've never had whatever that is)and don't want my suggestions for 50 classical CDs. "Slightly" would also apply to the sub change, but better than a different one would be getting a second of the same and positioning them(mid-points of opposite walls or diagonally opposite corners)so that the bass response in your room is both stronger and smoother.

I've compared the stf3 & stf2 at elecrtronicforless. At the time they were pitted against the Svs pb10 and pb12 and I bought the pb10. I've since moved on to bigger and much better sub with my acoustic elegance custom build and it was a major improvement. Sorry, I've never heard or auditioned any sub from Axiom but I'd have to say yeah the ep500 should be

I thought about an extra sub but I really don't have any more room in my condo for another. I'm not in a rush and don't "have" to buy something. I just had some extra cash from my taxes and thought of upgrading either the sub or to the 80's as I've always wanted both. I'll be sitting on it for another month so. If I hadn't already booked my trek through India in May I would have used the extra cash for a safari in Botswana.

I don't think you would gain much switching to the VTF3-MKII but there's a HG Black one available near by. The price seems a little high. I bought mine brand new years ago for $650+tax the HG was a couple hundred extra.

If you could find the room in your condo the 2 would work really well together.
CanuckAudioMart - HSU
I would jump on it if it was standard finish to match my current one.

Thanks for the link, but I definitely don't have room for the additional sub. You're right, I don't think I'd gain much going from the STF3 to the VTF3.

IMO, you wouldn't gain much going to another sub period, your Hsu is a very good sub. The best money is now spent on upgrading the center or Mains, not that you will here much of a difference there either but it would be more noticeable; too bad the VP180 won't work for you.

If you must change something (I just noticed you are running QS4's), there is a noticeable difference when moving to the QS8's from the 4's, so perhaps this is where you could improve your sound, or did I miss the reason for not being able to upgrade them.

No reason on the QS8's. Just not sure how much difference I'll notice. I mean the rears are only used minamally when watching a movie. If I turn up the volume on the QS4's will I still be missing much on the QS8's?

My QS8s were a great improvement over the QS4s for music, at least. TV/movies seem better too, but that's harder to say.

I don't think turning up the volume on the QS4s has nothing to do with the difference with the QS8s. All speakers should be compared when playing at the same level.

When I was looking at the Q8's or the 4's...I was told the 8's just play louder and better suited for larger room. I have the Q4's in my living room ~2700^3 and they sound great...IMO.

The QS8s have the ability to play louder than the QS4s. It isn't that they are over-all louder.

I did a little testing today and played both Iron Man 2 and War of the Worlds Blu Rays. Overall I am really happy with my system. Sometimes I just feel like I could get more bottom end but...my sub's pretty darn good!

I think the main reason I was looking at the M80's is because those are what I initially wanted but couldn't afford and so went with the M60's. I've always had a sinful lust for the 80s I guess...

I know Dan did an A/B comparison with QS4's and QS8's and it was mentioned that the 8 just sounded better. I had originally ordered 4's and went up to the the 8's (but this was back when the 4's had a different tweeter) and the change was very noticeable. I would imagine you would notice the 4 to 8 change the most while listening to music in multichannel as the 5 1/4" drivers all have the same tone for a perfect match.

Or order up those M80s and get your secret decoder ring

Just to add my 2 cents...I recently purchased M80's. I'm adding an amp because my AVR didn't satisfy me with 4 ohm loads (aka M80's and the VP180). However, many here that have no problems with an AVR running M80's but that has not been my experience, YMMV!

Adding an amp can be an expensive option and you've said your budget is limited. The M60's, and the rest are 8 ohms which are easier to drive with an AVR...Hell, now that I think of it just get an amp! When you get more tax money upgrade to the 80's, Problem solved!

Seriously, since you can't do the center...I had the 150 and while it's very good the 180 is just better period...and you want better bass then the EP500 may do it! The 80's, while great, won't do anything that your sub isn't doing already.

Personally I'd upgrade the QS4's to the 8's and yes, there is a difference!

Thanks guys! I'm going to think it over. I'm not in a rush.

Just don't wait too long... . It amazes me how well we often do when spending other peoples money... .

Upgrade your TV. It's much too small. LOL

So do semiretired hair metal bands!

You can do better, but I suspect you would need a very significant upgrade like the EP800. If you are not in a hurry, save your pennies and upgrade to the EP800.

This is the situation I am stuck in. My appartment gives me a big low end boost so my EP350 plays flat to 20Hz. To hear an improvement I would need a sub with significantly more displacement, like the EP800.

LMAO!

My neighbours would absolultely love me if I got the EP800 lol. Actually I suspect if I got the EP800 my whole building would feel it.

Actually my tv has burn it! I think I have it on CNN far too often. I have the CNN logo and ticker area burned in. Eventually my tv will be replaced, perhaps next year.

Just curious, if I were to put my M60's and QS4's up for auction, both of which are High Gloss Cherry, what do you think I can reasonable get? I was thinking I may be able to swing to the High Gloss Cherry M80's and QS8's depending on what I can get.

I remember seeing Axiom offer free upgrades to High Gloss Cherry years ago. Do they ever still do that?

Does Axiom still offer a trade in program. I know last year some time they did but not sure if they are still willing to do that.

No, it has been replace by the auction site.

If I put my HGC M60's and QS4's up for auction and I don't get what I'd like, am I still committed to selling them? Wouldn't want to get lowballed...

If you put a reserve on them, you'll be fine.

or just put the bidding starting at the minimum you're willing to accept.

Any idea what the HGC M60's should go for? I haven't the slightest clue.

How old are they?

You know I'm not even sure how long I've had them now. I think it would be approx 2-3yrs. They are in mint condition except for the grill covers which I've had off and lying around somewhere. I think the cloth on them is a bit rough in places.

My guess(that's what it is) would be somewhere around 60-70% what you paid for them.

The grills are really pretty cheap to replace. I don't remember how much I paid for my M80 grill, but it was definitely much less than $50.

I'm going to see if my friend wants them first...as soon as he comes back from vaction next week. If not then up for auction they go.