You always remember your FIRST TIME!!!!
Okay, I would like to order my FIRST HT set up. But herein lies many problems, queries, etc! Hysterical CONFUSION sets in! Here is my room setup and dimensions, RM is approx 12 x 15; open on one side into kitchen, glass patio door on opposite side, 9 ft ceilings.TV, Mitsu 36 inch. First question: M22's( must be on stands) vs M60, are the 60's overkill for me? Quest 2: VP100 vs VP150, is there an ENORMOUS diff here? Or is one paired better with either fronts? Ques 3: QS4's vs QS8 (either would HAVE to be on stands)? I see many diff matches via the preset systems, I am also looking into an SVS sub that would go with these. And any setup recommended would be paired with probably leaning towards the HK AVR 525. Unless someone prefers the Denon 3803, I'll hear them out on this. Lastly are the stands sold thru Axiom of a quality equal their speakers, or are there better stands for the buck? Please refer other stands if you have an opinion. Well there it is, sorry if it's alot, but I have done my research, and Axiom SEEMs the best bang for the buck. Since I may be ordering these separately, not packaged, will Axiom offer a discount also? I would like to get this done before the week is out. Also any recomm on wires? Which is the better gauge for these. I really don't subscribe to the COSTLY wire syndrome, but? That's why I am here, picking the brains of present owners. What better way to get info. Thanks in advance, I look forward to all your insightful opinions. System would be used for Music, as well as Movies, TV viewing.
Davey, I'll try a few of your questions. I've never heard an MTM center that works as well as a vertical center as similar as possible to the mains. In Axiom terms, I'd suggest an M2 to go along with M22s. The unique configuration of the VP150 apparently avoids the MTM problem and should be the choice over the VP100 if a horizontal center is used. In your room the M22s with a good sub should be plenty of kill, although I wouldn't term the M60s "overkill".
On a receiver in the price range that you're considering I'd suggest the Pioneer 53TX with its automatic MCACC speaker calibration and equalization over either of those you mentioned.
In your size room, unless the speaker wire paths are unusually indirect , standard 16ga lampcord is all you need.
As for your question about the stands, do you have small children or pets? I had the M22s (on SS16 stands) for a while and I found them to be a little too top-heavy for my comfort with a small infant in the house--at least that's the argument that worked on my wife to allow me to upgrade to the M60s
If my argument hadn't of worked, I was planning on filling them with ballast (the upright tube could have held some steel shot or something) to try and make them more stable.
I also think the M22s would be more than adequate. And, even though I stuck with the M60s, I would have been just as happy with the M22s sound-wise (thought the M60s seemed too fill my 13'x28'x7' room a little better).
I have the SVS PB1-ISD, their smallest "box" sub and have been very pleased with it.
Gosh, JohnK always beats me to recommend the Pioneer Elite receivers! Yes, I second his suggestion of the 53TX.
The QS series surrounds can easily be wall-mounted, and they come with a special wall-mounting bracket.
As for the subwoofer, I suggest that you also look at the Hsu subs, particularly the VTF-2 and the
new STF series.
Although 16-gauge speaker wires are likely sufficient for your run length, I would be super-conservative here and go with 14-gauge or above.
PartsExpress.com has quality wires at better prices than my local Home Depot or RadioShack.
Davey,
I agree with a good deal of what has already been said:
My room is 13 x 22 - I started out with the M22s but decided I wanted floorstanders and upgraded to the M60s - however the M22s paired were MORE than adequate for my room size - they never distorted at ear-bleeding volume levels.
I have the VP150 and am VERY happy with the natural sounding vocals and power capabilities. This forum is loaded with posts that recommend the VP150 over the VP100, whether with the M22s or M60s.
I did not want to initially wall mount my QS8s so I use the specially designed Axiom stands. I believe they are of excellent build quality - they are very stable (come with carpet spikes if you would like to use them), have great wire management, look great once set up with the speakers. You actually have to use them if you are not going to wall mount due to the driver on the bottom of the unit.
In the receiver realm, I agree with John's recommendation of the Pioneer Elite 53TX - I own the 45TX (recommended to me by sushi) and couldn't be happier with it. For someone like myself - new to home theater - the MCACC calibration utility is amazing and incredibly accurate. The Pioneer's power handling capabilities, learning remote, and versatility will ensure it a place in my home for many years.....or until "upgrade-itis" becomes more than I can bear. I must warn you that all of the helpful advice you will receive in this forum only supports that disease!
Enjoy your audio journey - this is an amazing line of speakers.
Mark
Okay, I have narrowed my speaker search down to Axiom's, just settling on the specifics, center/fronts/surrounds. Next is either SVS sub, or HSU. Now the big question, the receiver. I thought I had settled in on the HK AVR 525, now I read, and have been directed towards the Pioneer Elite 53TX. I liked the idea of the self calibration on the elite. Now everyone is waiting for the new Yamaha's. But these seem way out of my price league, as does the HK 7200. I don't see that much of a diff between the 53TX or the 55 TXi Elites. Now while I don't want anything to become obsolete, I don't want to OVEREXTEND. Whatever I buy today will probably stay with me for quite a while. I enjoy music/movies as a hobby. The only thing I may have to upgrade is my TV if they come out with the HDTV, and that I would have to be forced to do. I personally don't see EVERY channel only offering this as a sole option. So would I be equally content with the Elite or HK. Which is the better bang for my buck, and limited capacity in this hobby
Well, if you want a more "future-proof" receiver, go for the 55TXi. It is currently one of the VERY few $1000-ish receiver that supports the i.Link/FireWire digital connection for the SACD/DVD-A players. I would comfortably predict that most, if not all, AV receivers AND universal disc players will feature the i.Link within one or two generations.
The only significant difference between the 53TX and 55TXi is the i.Link (others are so minor, such as the USB audio and a slightly better remote). But it may well worth an additional $200, if you plan to keep it for a long time.
Davey, a little more comment on the receivers. The new Yamaha 2400 and 1400 coming out this week are certainly within your price range(list $1,000 and $800, street probably less than $800 and $600). As to whether the iLink on the 55TXi is worth the extra money(street seems to be running about $300 more now)it depends on what if any extent you'd be getting into SACDs and DVD-As and whether you got a player with an iLink connection.
I'm happy pushing my M22s, VP150 and QS4s with my HK525. Receivers seem to be the most upgraded part of a system. Given that refurb 525s can be had in the low $500s shipped, I can't see spending more than that unless I'm leaning towards separates.
Frank
Dave, I too am interrested in a set of M60's and the appropiate center,surrounds/sub to go with them as well as a new receiver. You mentioned that you were invetsigateing the Denon 3803 but it appears that others have steered you in other directions. I'm looking at the Denon AVR 2803. It puts out 90W instead on 110W but is also $400 less. I spoke with "Joe" at Axiom today and he said that he's demo'ed the M60's with both of the Denon's and both sound fine. Like yourself, this is all new territory for me. So my question to you is: Have you made a decision and if so, I'd like to hear your selection and comments. Thanks in advance.
Bob
Yes, I also called and spoke with an Axiom Rep. The info provided me was the following: Fronts; the suggestion was to go with the M60's due to the fact I have 2 kids 7 & 11 around. The M22's on stands are a bit top heavy and may or will toppple if "hit". Next was the center. The suggestion was based on rm dimensions, and viewing distance to TV, I would be able ti utilize the VP100. Any user comments from the forum on this? The rears they suggested the QS8's.
Now for the receiver, I had it narrowed to the HK AVR 525. Then I got some info on the PIONEER ELITE 53TX or the 55TXi.
The 55TXi is MUCH more costly, has a few more extras. BUT, both of these have MACC. Which auto calibrates the system. This would help me. The only drawback to the Pioneer's is they do not power 4 ohm speakers. This only comes into play should I or anyone look into using the M80's. So with all this vast info, research, I hope to make a final decision and order by this week.
Hi Davey,
I faced a similar "active child" problem vis-a-vis the mains. There is certainly nothing wrong with the M60s! But if you want to save a little bit of money, here is another alternative that I have found to be extraordinarily sturdy: the M22s plus 20" Atacama Nexus stands filled with shot. The Atacamas are available from Audio Advisor. One regular-sized bag of regular-sized shot will fill the main post of both stands; blue poster-tak holds the speakers to the stands with suprising force. My stands have been violently jarred many times and have never fallen (knock on wood). The advantage of this arrangement is that it will save you a bit of money: $400 (M22s) + $125 (stands) + maybe $12 for the bag of shot, as opposed to $800 for the M60s. So you'd save around $250.
At this point, one relevant question (which I cannot answer, having never heard the M60s) is whether the M60s are "$250 better" than the M22s, given your needs. I'd be interested in other listeners' opinions on this question, as upgrade fever always lurks in the background.
I noted the CSF? (child safety factor) above and ultimately went with the M60s. Are they worth the extra $250? Well, one reason I kept the 60s is that I felt they filled my room a little better (nearly 30' long) but that's only part of the story. I think the main reason I kept them, and I KNOW its why I'm glad I made that decision is their stereo performance!!
I initially set up my HT system for something like 90% DVD 5% TV and 5% music. But, after experiencing the M60s in stereo!!, everyday I am trying to find more and more ways to spend my time down there listening to plain CDs and old vinyl. Well, that's my 2c.
Davey, the Pioneers have no problem with 4ohm speakers.
In reply to:
Davey, the Pioneers have no problem with 4ohm speakers.
Yup! Been there, done that... with my 45TX.
Davey..I am about the same place you are on deciding on a receiver purchase. The forum guys here have been extremely helpful and understanding of a non-sudiophile's question...although I've always understood the only dumb question is the one that doesn't get asked...I've looked at the Pioneer 45tx, 53tx and 55tx and compared it to the new Yamaha RX-V1400 at Sushi's suggestion...on paper I'm more impressed with the features of the Yamaha than anything in my price range including the H/K, Denon, Okyno, etc.
My .02, the i-link feature on the Pioneer's is a big plus. Having to purchase and connect 6 separate interconnects for DVD-A/SACD is a pain in the butt (not to mention expensive!)
That's the one thing I really wish my Rotel gear had. One cable for DVD-A/SACD would be sweeeeet!