I am in the process of setting up a room for my home theater and am preparing to go BIG! I like the Epic 80-500 set up and may even add an extra set of m3ti for the fronts (my receiver can handle the nine speakers) One of the problems is that all this is going to cost a bundle and by shopping through the factory outlet I could save 15%.

My questions are:

Obviously my main concern is sound quality. Is there any difference in sound quality with these discounted speakers?

How noticeable are the blemishes? Can you really notice or do you have to look closely?

I have little kids who will have access to this room. If the only thing wrong with these speakers are minor, if at all noticeable, blemishes then I'm thinking this could be a winner. I hardly ever get to put the first scratch on any of my stuff anymore!

>>I hardly ever get to put the first scratch on any of my stuff anymore!

Congratulations. You're the ideal candidate for the factory outlet

I just bought my first Factory Outlet speakers (QS8s) after buying M2, M60 and VP100 "normal". The blemish seems to be a thumbnail-type ding in the edge of the enclosure -- enough that you would be a bit bummed if you had bought the speaker new but nothing compared to what normally happens to your speakers over a couple of years.

I bought my fronts (both pairs, don't ask ) new because I wanted to keep them pristine if possible. Would have bought the center factory outlet except the wait was real long at the time I ordered. Figured surrounds are going up on the wall and nobody will notice a little ding anyways.

The FO speakers are tested to the same standards, sound the same, and have the same warranty. They just have little dings in the cabinet finish. Some people never find the dings -- most find them after a careful inspection.

Mine happened to be a bit more obvious but well within what Axiom describes.

>>and may even add an extra set of m3ti for the fronts

If you're planning to run both fronts at the same time you might want to not bother unless you have some special processing for them (are these the Yamaha "presence" outputs ?). Otherwise you just muck up your imaging a bit...

If you have M80s there isn't going to be much else you can put up there that's gonna help

Yes, I was planning to use the Yamaha presence feature. JT suggested that might be an option. Do you think it is a waste with the m80's up front? I'm pretty much an amatuer at this, so maybe I wouldn't even notice the difference.

I honestly don't know. My first thought would be to go with 7 speakers rather than 9 so you can play with both 7.1 rears and the presence speakers and figure out if you get much benefit in your room.

I *think* the pattern is that the extra speakers make more difference in a larger room, but I'm not 100% sure about that. How big is your room anyways ?

One other thought -- M2s are a closer match to the M80s sound-wise, so they might be a better choice than the M3s. On the other hand, M3s are supposed to be slightly better without a sub if you decide that 9.1 wasn't for you and wanted to wire them up in another room

I would go 7.1 with M2s (based on other's posts, only have 5.1 myself) if your room is big enough. The Epic 80/500 should be a fantastic system - only caveat is that the 80s are pretty big and don't like to be crowded against the wall, so if your room is only average size you would probably get better results by skipping the back speakers and giving the 80s enough space around them to sound their best.

The room is about 3800 cubic feet which is why I'm looking at such a large system. I think you are right about the speaker selection - it was m2's.

FO is great i ordered an epic 60 FO with VP150 as center nothing wrong except one qs8 very tiny rub on the back side where it would be against the wall. look for my upcoming post "FO Is A Gimmick". for more info.

i bought my speakers new cause i wanted to get them with custom cabinets. but, i know many people have bought the FO and there is NO difference in the sound or quality of sound, than with the regular speakers. they simply may have small blemishes that make them unable to sell them for full price.. but, most people find it very hard to even locate the blemish. so, i would definitely go with FO if you are looking to save some cash.

bigjohn

cormit,
As many others have stated, the blemishes tend to be rather minute.
I posted pictures on this years ago but the links are likely dead and i cannot find the thread.
Here is a small collection of early photos to show the meagre blemishes on my FO VP150 and QS8s.

If you would like to see some better high resolution images, send me a PM, but it should be obvious that the blemishes are barely, if at all visible. Axiom guarantees the sound quality is unaffected. Any speaker that does not meet the sound standards is dismantled, not sold.

chess- i remember those pics.. very minimal damage.

but my next question is, how big was that fish? looks pretty decent. and is it a burbot fish? i have never heard of that.. looks like a catfish, but with a very unique pattern.

bigjohn

Technically no difference, same guarantee, same warranty.

I have the M60's VP150 EP350 and 4-Qs8's from the factory outlet in Mansfield Beech, and have yet been able to find even one blemish, they are perfect.

bigJ,
The fish is indeed a burbot, aka ling cod aka Lota lota.
A voracious piscivore typically inhabiting northern waters. It is an ugly, ancient looking fish that the local bands hunt for its fatty liver.
We catch them with long lines through the ice in early spring.

Mine were all flawless - still haven't discovered the imperfections 6 months later (I also stopped looking, though)

Cormit,
I'll chime in on "No Worries" on the FO stuff. My M2i's, 150 & EP 350 all came from the outlet, and I was only able to find one tiny scratch on the bottom of one of the M2's.
As to;
"Yes, I was planning to use the Yamaha presence feature. JT suggested that might be an option. Do you think it is a waste with the m80's up front? I'm pretty much an amatuer at this, so maybe I wouldn't even notice the difference"

I just bought one of the new Yamaha 2500's and be aware that you have to choose between the front presence and rear surrounds. You CAN have both hooked up at the same time, but you CANNOT run both at the same time. The different channels use the same amp. I choose to use the front presence, as
A; I have nowhere to hang rear surrounds, and
B; I love the front presence effects on CERTAIN kinds of music. (Only about 10-15 % of my listening, but after weeks of weighing the differences between the Yam and the Denon I decided that I did not want to give up even that 10-15%)
As to the smearing of the soundstage, and screwing with the imaging issue that many are concerned with when using the front effects speakers, I have found that it is easily controlled by several things.
1; I keep the levels on the effects speakers a bit lower than the mains.
2; I keep the delay on the effects set to the lowest setting possible.
3; I have decided that, despite what Yamaha tells you in their set up tips for the speakers, that placing the front effect speakers INSIDE (and above obviously) the front Mains does quite a bit to keep the imaging and spatial characteristics of the mains as they should be. The outside edges of my Front effects M2I's are lined up even with the inside edges of my M60's, and are mounted on stands on top of my shelf system, with the bottoms of the M2i's about 3 feet from the top of the M60's. Both are toed in at the same angle (very slight) and both are the same distance from the back wall. After years of experimenting with the placement of the front effects speakers in various rooms, I have found this to be the most pleasing, and most natural, by far.
All that said, I still only use them for certain kinds of music; Jazz recorded live in a small room, All of the Buena Vista Social Club stuff that all sounds like it was recorded in the same small, boxy studio, where you can really get a sense of the room acoustics where the recordings were originally made, and some other live recordings made in a Hall type setting. I virtually never engage the Yamaha DSP's when listening to studio recordings.
So, if you do not listen to that sort of stuff, you may find that you do not need/like the front effects for music.
But, I also find that I quite like the fronts for expanding the depth and size of the (apparent) soundstage/room when watching movies. Then again, I have never been in a space where I could take advantage of the Rear Surrounds in a 7.1 system, and that might make even more of a difference. I cannot say from personal experience. I would love to hear from someone on these pages who has been able to do both, and see what they have to say.
Of course, one of my justifications/rationalizations for buying the M2i's for the front effects was that I would have them in hand for when I am able to mount rear surrounds for 7.1.
So, as with all of the wonderful opinions that are offered on these pages, YMMV!
But, in my opinion, you have a no lose situation if you have the room to mount them for 7.1 rear surrounds, and room in your budget. Try them up front, try them out back. See which works better for you. At the very least, if you find you do not need either, you can send them back, or you have a fantastic set of spare speakers for another room!
Win, Win all around!