any thoughts from everyone..? the good, the bad,.......emotiva and m-80's.....4 ohm load. emotiva xpa-2, and xpa-1 mono block. reviews, recomendations,......HELP>........

Lonnie who designed the xpa amps recommended that I consider 2 xpa1s after an xpa2 failed to drive 2 m80s without going into protect at normal volumes. Pretty sure the setup would work and sound good, but at that price point there may be better options that are less unwieldy.

Lonnie had me try bi-amping my m80's using the extra monoblock amplifiers in my MPS-1, I think I got maybe a few extra dB's before it shut down as well. Some others have not had issues with some of the other Emotiva amps, but I'm not sure if they tried driving them to the same levels.

so the emo stuff cant drive the m-80s'?? or were they damaged amps. would you purchase asgain if you knew they worked. was the sound good, clean, soundstage,..? im considering buying, and would like inout from you guys...appreciate your time n help

i have some of the first series of m-80's, they have some hours on them,...hopefullt the amps will fair pretty well with the m-80's i hope nothing shuts down anytime soon, as love the loud sound of Paul Gilberts guitar,..Racer-x!!!!!!!

I drive M80's with Emo's DMC-1/MPS-1 combo and have no (more)issues - see post in HT. Good clean soundstage, great imaging, but that probably has more to do with the speakers. I'm actually considering their new pre-pro but waiting for reviews. I actually have no need to replace any of my HT equipment. I'm quite happy with my system.

Scott

Run a search for Emotiva. There are numerous discussions about this very topic that have occurred very recently.

Summary: While it works well for some (maybe even most), there is no question in my mind that you run a far higher risk than normal of having problems by combining the two. They just don't seem to play as well together as other speaker/amp combos. If I was buying today, I'd be looking at other options.

Jason

I was really thinking about getting an XPA-2... but after the comments from some who have (with the m80's ) I decided its not a good idea.

The sound was awesome, but it kept shutting down, even when watching movies with explosions, etc.... rediculous. I tried 2-3 replacement amp modules for the MPS-1, even bi-amped two of them to one m80, same thing. Not sure about the newer amps they have, this was a year and a half ago.

Hi all,

I'll tell you one big power amplifier that won't shut down driving the 4-ohm M80s or even lower impedances to 2 ohms, and that's Axiom's A1400-8. Yep, it costs more than the Emotivas, but what sort of bargain is a power amplifier that overheats and shuts down when you drive it hard into a 4-ohm load?

Regards,
Alan

I have an MPS-2 driving 2 M80v2's (and nothing else atm) and it works flawlessly. MPS-2 modules rated 300 watts @ 4 ohms, 200 watts @ 8 ohms.

I plan on adding a center channel and two surrounds shortly, hopefully this won't cause me problems.

Bring on the 1400-2

Yeah, I really am finding myself wanting an A-1400 amp these days... I think I will spring for an ep800 first though... allthough It may be a year or so before that happens.

I have the A1400-8 driving seven speakers with two M80s being in the fronts. Even with full power into the 80s (i.e, no subs), there is no clipping whatsoever at volumes that most would dare not to subject their ears. The clarity and dynamic headroom with this amp are superb, and I have the sense that it is not even breaking a sweat, even when I was trembling while testing it at high levels.

You might want to invest in some hearing protection if you listen to very high volume levels. It only takes one time to do serious damage. You have a very nice setup BTW:).

I haven't been able to find any sort of ceiling either, although I chickened out at 107 db. It didn't seem like the amp was even beginning to work hard, i.e., there was a lot more clean usable gain from the preamp available but I was just not in the mood to pull the trigger (i.e., for experimental purposes only, 90-100 db is normally as loud as I go when I want to go loud).

OK, what do you mean by "very high?" I thought with loud music (as opposed to rocket launches) it was a question of not exceeding a certain number of hours per day, as described in a chart like this: Loud Music and Hearing Damage

Listening to heavy rock music at 110dB's or higher for 3+ minutes can start to damage your ears. That is why I like 130dBs.

i drive 2 m80's vp150 and qs8's with a xpa5 .....never had a problem.... and when i drive the 2 m80's in stereo they just get better!!!!

Your best bet is to get an SPL meter and measure otherwise you would have no idea how loud your listening levels are.

If I was and I quote "trembling" while listening to music at a very high volume, that is my built in SPL meter in my body telling me to turn the music down ;).

im w/ you ma, maybe there was just a couple problems with an amp or 2,...ill stick with my emp amps, and just enjoy thgeir ultimate rich warm uncolored sound.

OK, let me see here. You are asking about the Emotiva amp to buy one or to legitimize a purchase you already made.

Something here doesn't make any sense.

No other comment... I just liked that quote....!

That caught my eye too.

I have nothing against rotel 1090, powerful and just a awesome presence of sound, but im upgrading to the xpa-1 mono blocks.

and the price of the mono blocks is FORCING me to sell......i hate to see ole bessie leave, but a sacrifice must be made somewhere. and im not selling my krell ksa 250 or my QSC PL340 for anything! so the rotel muct go.
The QSC blows the doors roight off the krell and rotel 1090-more accurate and the soundstage from the QSC is almost 180 degrees,...PFM (pure fu**in magic) yes, ive been uying audio gear for 15+ years, and no other amp had quite caught my ear like a lonely little 3.5 incg QSC pro amp. just magical soundstage, effortless as can be, no sweating at all, no matter the load or duration of play. I know what your th9inking,..a pro amp...yeah right,...well dont judge a book is all i have to say. best lil big amp i think i ever owned,..maybe besides the small 100 wpc mcintosh i ought in the late 80's--that was a nice comfortable sound, never was tiring to listen to at any volume.

Yes I just bought 2 xpa-1 mono blocksand am forced to sel;l my beloved rotel 1090 hulk. but the service is better than rotel is now out of warranty.

im sure these twin hulks will perform just awesomely.

maybe some guys just dont like the emotiva stuff, or they feel its cheap stuff, your opinion dudes,......im sure the xpa-1's will give me a lifetime of purity of sound and a nice warm fuzzy feeling while Judas Priest runs at 177 decibels

I wish you all the best with your amps. If you like them then that's all that counts.

It is not that we don't like the Emotiva stuff, I was first drawn to their price point, quality of components, build quality, etc. However, there is something wrong if monoblocks can't drive the efficient m80's that don't dip below 4 ohm. Your mileage may vary and hope you have better luck than the many people from AV123 and Axiom that have not.

no m-80's have ever been run by xpa-1's they just came out this week. only ones would have been the 2 ch xpa-2,..with 500 watts @ 4 ohm, hard to believe they couldnt drive m-80's is all. maybe a first gen xpa-1 w/ flaws, which have now been fixed.

I was not "trembling" for fear of damaging my ears but for fear of damaging the speakers (wrong order of priorities, as usual). I was nervous about driving the amp and M80s to levels that I had not before. I don't routinely listen music or watch movies at high levels (above 75-80 dB). I am an internal medicine doc, not an ENT, but I think comments here on hearing damage are correct. Concert volumes can reach 120-140 dB and even some headphones can reach 115 dB. Exposure to sound at these levels, especially beyond several minutes, can indeed be harmful and should best be avoided.

...now back to the discussion on Emotiva...

Dammit man ... I wish somebody would combine at least two of these three dang threads regarding the Emotiva amps, it's getting to be a pain in my old tired backside trying to keep up with where to post a reply.

laughing.....

Strangest threads I have ever read.

Ditto

Is there an echo in here? Wid, I love your state.

I'm glad you do

Would that be the state of blizzard?? Sounds ... FUN!

The state of frozen for sure.

A balmy 14 degrees here with snow flying. I think I'm heading south.

Come down here, it's warmer at 22F.

Heat wave. I should so I could pick up my speakers. I guess I'll have to bring the smoked cheese though.

Darn right.

Bring those new 80s with ya Edward, we'll keep 'em warm for you and I also love the smell of fresh vinyl covered MDF first thing in the morning.

I'm looking forward to that smell in the house again. Wish I could get down to Florida. The wife was there a few weeks ago at Disney and my brother is on his way there tonight. Soon it will be my turn.

Sat, I don't have any comment on this absurd amplifier question(or is that a comment in itself?), but as to permissible sound levels to avoid hearing damage, the source that you quote appears to be too permissive. Standards adopted by the EPA and World Health Organization for "community" levels, not those suggested for workplace exposure where some hearing loss is considered acceptable(by some), are those which are advisable for listening in the home, and as shown in the third table here are substantially lower than the workplace suggestions.

Thanks John, are those numbers in minutes, so if I am reading the 3rd row right, it recommends limiting exposure to 85 db to 47 minutes per day, exposure to 95 db to 15 minutes per day, and 105 db to 1.5 minutes per day?

Yes, minutes.

Getting down to -20(4 Fahrenheit) here on Monday. Bring them up here and we'll take them for a ride on a snowmobile

That's not many minutes at 85 dB. It's good to see some conservative numbers as well to keep in mind when blasting the Axioms. I wouldn't have ever thought the safe limits were that low.

Jason

Too cold for me Cam. It's supposed to get below zero here tonight. My speakers are in a town about an hour away from here. Maybe I should hop on a snowmobile and go get them.

You're in Wisconsin right? I'm sure my friends and I could throw some skis on the front of my wheelchair and I'll come down and we'll make a trip of it (Dumb and Dumber style ). Just no peeing on me!!

I appears the EPA numbers came from their 1978 EPA Report No. 550/9-79-100. A quick skim of the report (available on the EPA site) shows that it 1) is very old, 2) is concerned more with public nuisance / protection rather than the individual creating the noise.

It also appears that their numbers came from a much more conservative unlimited exposure of 70db, rather than 75db (actually they admit is is overly conservative because the report says 71.4 db should be the starting point... They rounded down for additional margin). The exposure durations are then cut in half for every 3 db gain.

my friend Tom is in a wheelchair, were in the process of attaching a small strero to the chair, w/ brackets, we made for the back of it. its pretty cool, we have it set up so when hes home he just plugs into teh 120 wall, but on the move, were trying different setups, car batterias, and marine batteries and such. havent tried a samll generator yet,...its cool, we have a erector set stlye frame drilled to the back frame of the chair, whick we made slamm shelves and have the mian unit mounted , almost like a mini rack system, and the speakers are on 22 inch pieces that extend strsaight up from the sides of the chair and are mounted firing towards th eback of his head,.....its pretty coool!!!!

You will definitely have to send me some pictures if at all possible!! I've thought about trying to get some suggestions on the forum. With regards to portable power, what about portable power boxes like this or this .

links do not work, asking for a passcode. I use a Deep Cycle marine battery to power my 11' Telescope goes for weeks on end. Pretty heavy though. It has 130+ amp/hours

bettyer off with a marine battery, can be recharges 1-2 times before garbage. i dont have a camera to take a picture, sorry.
it looks like an erector set on the back of his motorized wheelchair. we dont know how to incorporate the exhisting abttery w/ a powr supply. were still in the experimental stage with this,..........i think he wants bigger speakers, well see what we can do???? will be fun tryin

That would be pretty cool. Come on down. We're having a big chili cookoff at a local bar. We can fill up that bandolier and do the the day up right.

Sorry about that, try this and this

Those are interesting numbers John. Here in Ontario, they lowered the number where hearing protection is required to 80db about 1.5 years ago.

When I did my extended listening session at Axiom, I found 75-80db to be about as loud as I wanted to go. I probably usually listen at between 70 and 75db.

Isn't a vacuum cleaner like 89 db? Of course I misplaced my shop hearing protectors. I guess I should use an spl meter to check out my car audio, I'm running a JL power amp 300/4 plus a 250/1 to power four V1s and a 10 inch JL sub. I used to listen lower but I've gradually drifted toward higher volumes, may have to reign that in some, at least in terms of daily exposure.

Obvious question, the Emotiva XPA-1 single channel monoblock amp 500 watts RMS x 1 into 8 ohms, 1,000 watts RMS x 1 into 4 ohms. Would I need two of them to drive my M 80's?

yes

and it would still shut down.

Has anyone tried 4 of them? Hehe

Yes. A single-channel or monoblock amp would only drive one channel...i.e., just the left speaker, or just the right speaker...

But not two per M80. Unless you want to go nuts and spend a whole lot of extra dough.

I have the XPA-3 and it doesn't shut down. I have it for 3 weeks now without any trouble.

What speakers are you driving Orc?

M 80's

K, then you need one mono-block per speaker. Or, you could run a smaller set of speakers in parallel, with mono output.

I just received a Xmas card from Emotiva employees and family. Pretty nice of them considering I sent back my amps almost 2 years ago.

How much better would the sound be from the XPA-1 vs XPA-3?
would it bring the m 80's to life? Don't get me wrong, they sound great now, but I feel that they have more to offer.

Jovan

Amps don't "sound" anything, they amplify. With that said, I've been told the 80's really open up with gobs of power, I would not have any idea of this.

You'd need two.

Jovan, only one way to find out, order the XPA-1, well a couple of them and let us know. Although I suspect the XPA 1 may have the same shut down problem as the XPA-2, as I remember reading the XPA-1 has the same protection circuitry as the XPA-2, but I could be mistaken and thinking of a different brand altogether.

Jovan - more power would mean they'd "open up" more at (extremely?) high volumes. If you have a big room and like to press them to the max, you'd probably notice a difference. If not, it's less likely. However, like Jay said, order up a pair and let us know.

Jason

Well that's what I meant. When they open up and fill the room, the sound changed, for me at least. 2k just to try it hmmmm. Coal all around for Christmas!

Red, what you are desribing is how I desribe the differences between the M60 and M80; when the M60s are driven hard they open up and sound more like the M80s do at low volumes. Now I am intrigued as to how the M80s sound when driven hard, well, harder than I can with my 3808.

I have the Onkyo 806 and the Emotiva XPA-3 it sounds fantastic! I must say that I have not driven it to the max ,...yet. So I should try that before even thinking of the XPA-1's.

Yes, Jovan; if you haven't used the full capability of the amplifier that you have now(and if you value your hearing it's unlikely that you ever will in reality), getting an amplifier with an even higher maximum power capability is just a waste of money. Unused power capacity is simply that: unused.

Ah, but it is good for bragging rights

Not at all, WOW--talk about loud and clear--xpa-1's are just vicious wicked, clear, tight, soundstage is EVERYWHERE, ran them wih the axiom m-80's for ohhhh.....bout 15 hours for my poker night, sometimes loud and sometimes just a whisper, and sound was justthere and awesome, puts to shame: rotel 1090, krell ksa-250, parasound, mcintosh 501's were outclassed by the authorative xpa-1's. these are a definate keeper, im very impressed, never had this kind of soundstage or just outright SLAM in any of the above amps, well maybe the Classe mono blocks are a bit better, but were talking about a multi thousand dollar difference here,....so i will say the xpa-1's are above and beyond any amp I have used. WOW is all I can say. believe it

that is good news glad you are enjoying the XPA with the 80's, should be a killer combination.

177 decibels?! Drink the 21+ scotch and enjoy. HEY!! how bout some pics of the amps and scotch doood? You got enuf scratch left for a camera?
Awright!!!

Glad the XPA1s are nailing it for you, I suspected as much from the sound of the XPA2, which I thought was great, except for the shutdown issues, which in my case nullified the impact.

Cheers,

177db isn't possible but I know what you mean. Glad it is working for you. Keep it cranked to '11'

For those interested 177db would require 14,263,715,295W at 3m away into a 95 db speaker with 10db headroom, according to Crown's amp calculator. If I drop the desired level to 167db you only need 1,426,371,529 to cover the 10db dynamic range.

Funny, I plug in 100db and it comes back with 285W and I get ~230W out of the Denon and I have measured ~100db in my room which is as loud as I can get it. I think the calculator is pretty close, considering the RS meter is most likely off a few db etc.

bad news, im forced to sell my beloved m-80's for bills. times are hard on us, and i am forced to sell the axiom speakers and my parasound amp to have cash for upcoming rent & bills,.....sad days!!! Ill pick up a little less expensive pair in the BIC America speakers lots of good reviews, and price is right. sound not as good as the old axiom warhorses, but good enough til im back on my feet and can get a better pair. maybe save for some B&W's or Vienna acoustics Beethoven's.

Okay, this is the second time that I've had a problem with a fuse blowing in my RPA-1, can somebody please give me some insight as to how this is happening.

It's the M80s and you must be running that amp in bridged mode, remove the bridge and sell the M80s, pick up some M60s and all will be well

That's good Jay , you would be a good tech support representative.

"YOU DON'T LIKE MY ANSWER??? I KEEELL YOU!!!"