M-100 replacement cross-overs

Posted by: Brendan

M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 10:10 AM

Good afternoon Debbie,

I am finally getting around to changing out the cross-overs you sent out to me. I never did ask; do you want the old ones back? I will put them aside for now. Let me know. Now that I have them right out, It looks like the steel core plates of the failing coil have physically shifted. Just curious if you guys have ever seen this before. Have a great weekend, and thanks again for your support!

Cheers, Brendan
Posted by: Mojo

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 02:37 PM

I was wondering when you would blow the shit out of your M100s by driving them with distorted music to ear-deafening levels. Guess what? When you push an awfully large DC component into a speaker, shift happens!
Posted by: bridgman

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 03:10 PM

Probably didn't have his speakers anchored down. Anything over an M80 you need at least two anchors, preferably into bedrock.
Posted by: MatManhasgone

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 04:30 PM

Once you get into the LFR1100 you need a graviton beam to anchor it. Play them too loud and it will adjust the rotational direction of the Earth.
Posted by: Brendan

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 05:21 PM

Thanks for replying everyone. Just posted this here because my last 2 emails went un-answered. This was meant for the folks at Axiom. So far, they have been quite helpful.

Mojo : Axiom has no issues with what I am driving them with, or how hard at this point. My max measured peak dc (using an oscilloscope) never surpassed 1.188v. Thanks for the snarky response anyway.

Have a great evening.
Posted by: bridgman

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 08:46 PM

Might be worth a quick phone call to Axiom rather than email, especially now that we all piled on to your thread smile
Posted by: Mojo

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/27/16 09:24 PM

If I was Axiom, I wouldn't argue and would give you a new cross-over. I wouldn't want to be known in the industry as having speakers that "blow". It's simply not worth arguing over especially since it is a relatively rare occurrence.

However, from what I read before, you have a need that you feel can only be answered by high sound pressure levels. Your Sherwood amp may not be enough for you and as a result, you are driving it to clipping. The harmonic distortion likely isn't a problem for the M100s but given your high power levels, the subsonic signal that is generated from the clipping may not only damage your cross-over but also the woofers. The suspension may be getting distorted and the alignment of your driver may be affected.
Posted by: Brendan

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/28/16 05:52 PM

Thanks for all the info / comments everyone.

Mojo: can you shed a bit more light regarding the possible clipping. I don't know how else to measure this other than what I have already done. In regards to the Sherwood amps; I think at this point they are handling what I am asking them to do, but I am aware that I am pushing them near to their design limits. I am currently using 2 amps, one dedicated for the lf portion, and the other for the hf portion and the centre channel. If you can suggest taking measurements with different equipment, I am all ears.

Thanks again everyone for all of your time and support.
Have a great evening.
Posted by: Mojo

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/29/16 12:05 AM

I thought you have one 7-channel Sherwood amp.

It is pointless to attempt to measure distortion or power levels without the proper equipment.

The highs should sound very fatiguing highs when clipping. The mid and woofer drivers may also be moving in a funky, distorted way.

You might want to try measuring the C-weighted SPL, 3 feet away from one of your speakers. If you measure peaks of 115 dB with 2 channels driven from that Sherwood 7-channel amp, it's reached its 220W/channel (2-channels driven) into 4 Ohms limit. If the amp is older or has been stressed, it may not even be able to reach that limit.

The M100s should be good to about 118 dB (in room) according to the sensitivity and power handling specs.
Posted by: Brendan

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/29/16 05:47 PM

The sound is not fatiguing at all (the axiom gear sounds pretty sweet). Yes, 2 of these amps; just to distribute the speaker load, lessen the strain on the amps. I will purchase an spl meter, any suggestions as to brands? I would very much like to take some readings for everyone. And just so everyone is clear, the cross-overs didn't fail, it was only one component on the LF side of the card (heating issue). Everything else was a.o.k. Left a message for the folks at Axiom today, hope to hear back from them soon!

Have a great night everyone
Posted by: Mojo

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 11/29/16 11:56 PM

You have some choices for SPL toys:

A. If you have time and money: https://www.trueaudio.com/rta_abt1.htm

B. If you have less time and money: https://www.amazon.com/Galaxy-Audio-CM13...eter+c+weighted

C. If you have no time and no money and an Android phone - the efficacy of this one is very debatable:
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.gamebasic.decibel&hl=en

The cross-over did fail because that one component is on the cross-over and the cross-over needs it to work right otherwise it wouldn't be there and you wouldn't have published this post.

As for the "heating issue", let me tell you how that works. When a difference in electrical potential energy (voltage) is applied to a wire, a portion of that energy causes the electrons within the atoms that constitute the wire to experience a re-distribution. The re-distribution causes one portion of an atom to be electron-rich and another portion to be electron-poor. This re-distribution liberates electromagnetic energy we perceive as light.

The light is liberated from the interaction of two fields - a matter field and a force field. The matter field is the electron-positron field. The electrons we "count" are excitations in this matter field. The force field is the electromagnetic (EM) field. Both fields are states of space. When the excitations (electrons) in the matter field re-distribute, they perturb the EM field giving rise to EM waves. These waves carry packets of energy we count as photons. The waves fall within a frequency band we label as the thermal spectrum.

To sum up, matter jiggles, the EM field that bathes all matter jiggles as well and we perceive the EM jiggling as a change in temperature. In other words, you turned up the volume too much and burned the damned thing out!
Posted by: Brendan

Re: M-100 replacement cross-overs - 12/02/16 05:57 PM

I will go with option B. And thanks for explaining the 'heating issue'. I suppose this dumb electrician will need to go back to school and ask his theory teacher why 'jiggling' was never covered ... ... maybe I was sick on that day.