Ideas on the noise I'm hearing from my new 500?

Ok, as most of you know I got my new 500 yesterday.

I can't even describe the WOW effect I'm experiencing. Movies rock my world and music comes to life in new ways I've never heard before. That is the good news...

Before I tell you about the news that scares me a bit, I'll tell you a little about my current environment. I installed the rubber pads versus the spikes, didn't want one of those darn things dropping on my foot like Bridgman

I don't have carpet installed yet in the basement so all my speakers are sitting on concrete. I do have some carpet remnants through in the area to make it more comfortable for now when watching movies. I plan on placing the sub in the left corner to follow what some of you described as being the best placement for starters. For now I placed it along the shorter right wall, where my 350 was sitting just to test it out.

Below is a picture when I only had the 350, this is where the 500 is currently placed.

Anyway, now for the nervous news. I'm hearing noises coming from the port below the woofer. Not sure if this is similar to what NEW2AXIOM described recently and had to get a replacement? Anyway, using the SPL meter and test tones from my Denon 2805, sitting in the prime position, I set everything to approx. 75dB's by adjusting the levels on the receiver as the pink noise cycled around the room. What is interesting, the level on the 500 had to be set to -10dB on my receiver to achieve the 75dB reading. I have the volume on the sub currently set to 9'o clock as the manual states to start, and I have the trim setting to Flat mode, as the manual explains for a larger room, and bypass on the crossover.

Anyway, I took a variety of music down tonight to test cd's. I brought The Doobie Brothers Greatest Hits, Chicago 17, and George Strait Chill of an Early Fall. These CD's have many songs with good low bass. Anyway, I started with the Doobies, and was singing my heart out, dang it sounded so good when the 500 kicked in....then I moved onto Chicago 17. I don't remember the song, but I thought I was hearing a vibration. So I turned off the main speakers and just had the sub jamming out the low freq's. There were certain low notes that when played, I would hear a vibration. When I got down on my hands and knees I could tell it was coming from the port below the woofer. It seemed when I place my fingers in the port and applied some light preasure the vibration diminished or stablilized. So then I moved on to George Straight's CD, this has lots of low bass, I experienced the same thing. There were certain low notes that gave me the same vibration.

So what do you think guys and gals? It is not as easy to hear when you have the 60's rocking along with the 500, but I'm a little concerned? Maybe I need to set a piece of scrap carpeting under the rubber feet to simulate when I get a carpet and padding? I would think the rubber feet would be enough though as some people have hardwood floors under their 500. Can having it close to the side wall make internal vibrations? I have it about 3-4" from the side wall currently. This is temporary until I get everything setup and move it to the Left side. I checked all the fasteners and they all seem snug....

Thanks, Randy

If someone else with a 500 can play some music with a lot of lowwww bass, and turn off the mains so you can only hear the sub, do you hear this same internal vibration coming from the port? I just clicked my "Front" speaker button on the remote to cycle to the "B" channel, which I have nothing hooked to that, but it allowed me to shut off my 60's on the "A" channel.

It seemed to be more apparent when I increased the volume to around -10 to -15 dB's on the receiver...

Randy

In reply to:
I have the volume on the sub currently set to 9'o clock as the manual states to start,...

This could be part of the problem. The manual actually says "VOLUME: Set this midway to the 9 o’clock position for initial setup." You could possibly have the 500 volume set too hot. The off position of the volume knob is around 4 o'clock. So, "midway" between 4 o'clock and 9 o'clock, would be halfway between 6 and 7 o'clock. I found that was still too hot. I ended up with the volume knob set about half way between 5 and 6 o'clock. At this setting I could match the rest of my speaker's SPL with my receiver's sub setting at 0 dB.

However, the fact that you could reduce or eliminate the port noise by holding the port could mean the port itself is loose. If you feel that's the case, by all means, give Axiom a call and discuss the problem with them.

Thanks Jack, I'll have to experiment some more. My interpretation of that sentence, was 9'oclock is the midway point of the highest setting. I think they left a comma out, it should have said "Set this midway, to the 9 o'clock position for initial setup." I could be wrong, but if they intended to say midway of 9 o'clock, why would then not just say put it at 6 or 7 o'clock for initial setup? I'm just curious.

I guess I don't understand why they would even have a volume control that goes much higher if it would cause problems?

Randy - You mention setting the subwoofer to "10 dB" on your receiver. That usually means "+ 10 dB" ... back the receiver to "0 dB" for its output and increase the volume on the back of the subwoofer until you achieve 75 dB again.

You may be clipping the DACS in the sub.

Well, I'm not saying moving the volume on the 500 to a lower setting will solve the problem, but let us know if it has any effect, will ya, Randy?

If you look at my original post I said -10dB's. I placed the sub at 9 o'clock as I understood the manual to read for initial setup. After using the pink noise test, I had to turn my receiver down to -10dB's for the sub to get the meter to read 75dB's. I just figured since the 500 had a bigger amp compared to my 350, that is why it had to be so much lower. It just suprised me as Alan has always said to put the receiver on 0dB's and adjust the volume on the sub to reach your desired settings.

I'm no expert, believe me...

thanks Jack, I'll have to try again tomorrow, the rest of the family is in bed right now, and I don't think the wife would be to happy.

Got it - I missed the "-" on the line above the 10 dB. You are keeping the Dacs from clipping by doing this. Call customer service tomorrow - you should be hearing nothing from the port.

Man I hope it is not an issue of having to get another replacement.

I think I pulled something hauling this bad boy downstairs, ha ha.

I'm no speaker expert, but to me the port is made of some form of plastic, not sure of the thickness? I would think there could be the potential of vibrations at real LFE's? Obviously the ports on the 350 were of a different material.

In reply to:
Alan has always said to put the receiver on 0dB's and adjust the volume on the sub to reach your desired settings.

That's just what Craig is saying to do. Enter your receiver's speaker setup menu, and set the subwoofer output to 0 dB. Then use the volume knob on the 500 to achieve a 75 dB reading on your meter. I ended up with the volume setting on the 500 set approximately midway between 5 and 6 o'clock.

And, remember that these settings are NOT etched in stone. Like you, I'm still in the evaluating and tweaking stage with the 500. At the moment, I actually have the 500 set to about 78 dB. It may, or may not stay there. The point is, don't be afraid to experiment a little. I also run my center about 2 dB hot. Begin with everything set to 75dB, but set your speakers so they sound good to YOU!

I agree with you on the center Jack. The pink noise test with meter, or the receiver built in setup mic, always puts my center about 2dB's below the mains. Heck, you can't even hear the voices in movies at that level. I always bump up the center 2-3 dB's above my 60's. I wonder if it has anything to do with being a 6ohm design versus and 8ohm, like my 60's.

I'll have to keep playing with the sub before I deside if there is an issue. I still think it may have something to do with being on concrete versus on pad/carpet.

You should hear no noise from the port. If it sounds like a "paperish", "metallic" like rattle, it should not do that. My EP500 sounded great, BUT HAD THE EXACT SAME ISSUE. AXIOM Customer Service was exceptional as always and sent me a new one. I also initially had my sub at 9:00 and the volume on the receiver at -10. I moved it down to about 6-7 and run it -2 on the receiver which is still a bit "hot" and frightens my wife as well as my crotchety neigbor....:)

Call Axiom. They will take care of you.

Guys:

My EP500 was doing a vibration-type noise coming from the port. I am not sure is exactly what you described, but in my case, I did pulled the driver out and tighten all the screws I found inside (I dont remember as I did this months ago, but I think it was at least 3 wood screws that can be tightened a little more), checked the internal brace above the plastic port for vibrations, and the tighten the port screws, including the ones at the back of the sub (amp plate). That solved my vibration-type noise coming from the sub.

I live in an apartment, and yes, as you mention, the sidewall sometimes does vibrate, at very low frequencies and at a moderate volume. Positioning the sub and adjusting the levels help reduce the vibration but it does not disappear completely, at least in my room. Positioning was the main factor helping to reduce the vibration.

I run an ICBM with my EP500. I use it to fine tune the sub levels (among the other things the ICBM does for the x-overs), so I can run the sub around 7-8 o'clock and the preamp setting at -5dB. The ICBM subwoofer volume knob is around 9 o'clock. Actually those are very conservative levels because the neighbors in the apartment complex, if I could go louder I will!!!

Good heavens, is EVERYBODY having this problem with their EP500? Sounds like someone dropped the ball on this thing if that be the case. I only ask because with being ill, I have yet to really test my 500 out, and with my second EP500 arriving tomorrow, this is NOT giving me a very comfortable feeling. Just curious to know if everybody is having this problem or similar one with this sub?

Sutter

I did not hear that on either of the EP500s that I have heard.

Randy sorry to hear about the noise problem. I know it will be taken care of either by you or Axiom. At least now I know where to start at. Crossing my fingers and toes hoping that I will not have this problem. I am just a little concerned now that this has happened at least twice in such a short time.

I have beaten the snot out of a 500 and 3 600's with no noise at all. Axiom is starting to sell a lot of these subs - so yes, there will be more problems. Give them a couple months, and this will taper off.

Randy, what does the noise sound like. Can you describe it. Mine was like a distorted rattle comming from the port. It sounds like Axiom may have a problem with a batch of the EP500's.

Just wanted to let everyone know that I've been working with Brent and Amie via email. They have given me a few things to check tonight, so I'll keep you posted.

NEW2, I would not call my issue a distorted sound, but everyone describes things differently. I basically sounds like a vibration in the port when it reaches certain pressure levels. My guess is that something is touching the port inside (wire from the driver) or maybe just something that needs slightly tightened.

I don't think Axiom has any bad batches. If you look at the percentage of subs going out with no issues, I'm sure it is around 99% or so. In my experience with Computers and AV equipment, it is most likely something very simple.

Randy

SutterCane,

For heaven's sake, relax. Everybody is NOT having a problem with the EP500, nor did anyone "drop the ball". Please.

The EP500 puts out a prodigious amount of low-frequency energy, and it may excite other objects in the room into resonance, or (rarely) a screw or wire inside the EP500. Sometimes a wire may shift in shipping and vibrate, or a screw may loosen and need tightening.

Sometimes I think there's a kind of "phantom" resonance, like a poltergeist, that develops in the frequent posts on these boards. I've moved my EP500 around, taken it apart and re-assembled it at least four or five times during product development, replacing and exchanging prototype amp boards and I've never heard any vibrations (other than those in my living room!) emanating from the EP500. Which isn't to say that in the odd case, it may not occur. Hey, we sell a lot of EP500s!

But no need for panic.

Regards,

Alan, I know you are very knowledgeable when it comes to anything that has to do with Home Theater. I have learned alot from you and have great respect for you. With that saiid, I just have to get this off my chest.

I dont like the way you tend to dismiss any kind of problem when it comes to axiom products. Kind of like with my problem you tended to dismiss the EP500 problem and stated that it was most likely a sofa or blinds. lol. And just now you stated, "there is a phantom in the frquent post on the boards". That strikes me the wrong way. Its almost as if your implying that me and sirquacks problem may be made up in our head. Im sorry if I took this the wrong way but it just didnt sit well with me and being from New Jersey I always speak my mind.

Again I have all the respect in the world for you and axiom, just wanted to point that one thing out.

By the way, my new ep500 works perfect. the problem was with the sub and no it wasnt my blinds.

First, you'd be doing me a favor if you called me by either my first or last name, not both.

Second, I am relaxed. I was just asking a question, sorry. Next time I won't ask anything at all.

It seems as if I can't post at all without somebody going off on me in one way, shape or form.

I'm sorry to ruffle feathers. That was never my intention. I had a concern, so I thought I'd ask about it. As it turns out, that proved not to be such a good idea. Again I am sorry.

Sutter

thanks Alan for your input. One other thing most of us don't think about is the weather changes these speakers experience from the manufacturing/shipping/destination. It is possible that the internal wiring repositioned itself during shipment. Or when you go from a very cold climate to a warm climate, and start pumping juice through these subs, it is possible for the wiring to relax a bit and possibly touch the internal baffle. There are really lots of reasons. In my case, yes I am hearing vibrations form other locations in the room; the adjacent wall is rattling, the canned light in the ceiling is rattling, and yes there is something within the baffle/driver assembly that is producing a rattle/vibration at certain frequencies. I will trouble shoot the issue this evening and let you know my findings. I'm guessing one of the cables from the amp has repositioned and is vibrating against the inner baffle assembly. These things are built in a way that there is not much that can go wrong internally, it usually is something simple.

Sutter, I don't think Alan meant any harm by using your member name on these forums, isn't that what you have above your avatar?

Randy, I know man, and I didn't mean it quite the way it came out. I was just saying he'd be doing me a favor to call me by either my first or last name. Using both sounds too formal to me. lol

My words seldom ever come out right. They're taken out of context way too often. I try ya know. I mean just like with that, I didn't mean for it come out the way it sounded. I was just saying he'd be doing me a favor. Or at least that's all I was trying to say regarding that part of it.

Sutter

Hey Alan called me Wid before

j/k Sutter.

Hi,

I am not dismissing the problem, I am dismissing the notion that EVERY EP500 is having an issue - that is not remotely true, not by a long shot.

Or course, problems occur at times, but they're rare, and of units returned or replaced, we often find nothing wrong with them when we test them at the plant. But we do absolutely stand behind all Axiom products and will go to uncommon lengths to ensure customer satisfaction.

Regards,

Hey Wid, sorry for calling you Ricardo the other night....

That's ok but don't let it happen again Randy

Guys, Alan isn't the only one who thought that comments about "EVERYONE having problems with their EP500," and "bad batches of EP500s" was just a bit over the top.

There have been 3 problems mentioned in this thread, and one of those 3 problems was solved by the owner simply tightening a few things on his own. How many EP500s would you think have been shipped?

Also, consider this. The subs are assembled in a heated factory, then placed in an unheated truck (in CANADA yet) and are driven to a heated shipping center. Then they're put on a nice chilly plane, then into a heated sorting center, then on another nice cold truck to your home. Now, consider the handling, bouncing, dropping, shoving, and other gentle care the sub endures during it's journey to your home. Is it so hard to understand if something comes a little loose on a journey like that.

So, there is nothing wrong with bringing up, and complaining about, a problem you encounter. But, you might think before you translate that into "EVERYONE" having a problem, and "bad batches" of products.

Alright, I've been trying to bite my tongue, but I've got to speak out on this.

Jack, first of all, I never made a statement about EVERYONE having a problem with their EP500. NO, in fact, I said nothing, but asked a question instead. I ASKED if everyone was having a problem with their EP500. I asked because it seemed like a good question at the time, going off what I had been reading. I made no claims that EVERYONE was having a problem, and anybody who thinks differently is full of it, because I did not. I asked a question, plain and simple.

Now granted, I could have worded my question better, perhaps then this thing would not have got so blown out of proportion. But be that as it may, I NEVER came out and said nor did I imply that EVERYONE is having a problem. I asked, and there is a BIG difference there.

Now if people want to slam me for asking a question, go right ahead if makes ya feel any better. I'm an easy target. But I'm not going to stand for people claiming I said one thing, when in fact I said nothing. I asked a question.

Again, I never meant to ruffle anybodies feathers. That was not my intention and I'm sorry for doing so.

Sutter

It's all Cool Sutter..

It is very hard to understand peoples intentions via a text post. I think part of the confusion came from using all CAPS, in your statement, followed by the possiblity that someone may have dropped the ball.

Dude, both of us know that Axiom would never drop the ball, otherwise Amie or Ian would pick it back up again and slam it home from the free throw line...

In reply to:
Dude, both of us know that Axiom would never drop the ball, otherwise Amie or Ian would pick it back up again and slam it home from the free throw line.

lmao, that was good man. You could have a career in comedy.

Heeheehee, I liked that.

Sutter

Kurt, "asked" or "stated" doesn't matter. You're just splitting hairs. I quote "Good heavens, is EVERYBODY having this problem with their EP500?" (with EVERYBODY in caps for emphasis, no less). That appears to be a rhetorical question, or were you actually looking for an answer? Do you really think it's possible EVERYBODY is having a problem. If not, why ask the question at all?

From Wikipedia.com

"A rhetorical question is a figure of speech in the form of a question posed for rhetorical effect rather than for the purpose of getting an answer. ("How many times do I have to tell you to stop walking into the house with mud on your shoes?").

A rhetorical question seeks to encourage reflection within the listener as to what the answer to the question (at least, the answer implied by the questioner) must be. When a speaker declaims, "How much longer must our people endure this injustice?" or "Will our company grow or shrink?", no formal answer is expected. Rather, it is a device used by the speaker to assert or deny something."

Though probably not intended, it appears you were asserting something. The point is you elevated the problem, yes, in the form of a rhetorical question, from 3 incidents to EVERYBODY. Sorry, but I find that unnecessarily excessive.

Whatever Jack, no sence in debating with those who thinks they know it all. I'll stand by what I said, and I don't care if you agree or disagree. I asked a question, plain and simple. If you want to make it into more, go right ahead, that's fine.

Sutter

Ajax, what I was saying is that since there have been a few port specific problems come up lately that maybe there was a certain batch if you want to call it that that was made with a flaw.

Anyway, I dont really care. My new EP500 sounds perfect so that is really all that matters.

Ya gotta luv Axiom Customer Service, they are truely second to none.

I understand what Jack was trying to say, and I'll admit I worded a lot of things poorly. That I take full responsibility for. As I said, I never meant to ruffle anybodies feathers. I meant to ask a question and didn't use good judgment in the choosing of my words. Instead of asking if everybody is having a problem, I should have stated it as how many people has had this problem or something along those lines, and defiantly should not have used all caps. Be that as it may, lesson learned. I know better next time.

Lets try to get this thread back on track. Randy, what tips or tests did Brent recommend you try?

Sutter

Well I had no port noise or vibration in my port or otherwise just the lose RCA connection on the AMP. And my new AMP should be arriving tommorow =).

Understood, Jay. No problem. I just wanted to point out that Alan wasn't the only one who thought there was a bit of an overreaction to the situation. I know that nobody intended any harm. Neither did I.

Ah the joys of trying to interpit internet posts. I bet virtually every sub company has such issues on a regular bases, but then again not every company allows an open forum to allow customers to talk about them openly.

Will toss in my .$.02 on the quality control at the Axiom factory. Yes Axiom does have what most would consider an assembly line, but its not what most would think of in the usual term. John and I had the full tour and one of the things we had the advantage of seeing and understanding is how the 500/600 amps are assembled. These units are had assembled, no robtics here, and all componets are checked several times as the process moves to a completed unit. Once the amp is placed in the cabinet, it then goes through another test as a complete unit.
Now having a full understanding of how the subs are produced, I can understand how so few defective units every reach a customer, then again, there is the shipping issue. Once packaged and out the door from Axiom they have left the controlled enviroment, and anything is possible.
Am I saying that Axiom can not send out a defective product, of course not. But as for quality control, I will say Ian has assembled a great team, all take pride in the products they make. From being with Ian for a day I can see he is a very laid back owner, and all working at Axiom really enjoy being there. Axiom has one of the best quality control systems I have seen in my life.
So having two ( I think) 500s have issues in a short period of time is a rare accurance since I have been on the forum. Is it reasonable for a customer waiting for the next 500 to be concerned, perhaps. But getting a defective product from any other company can always be a concern as well. Things are not perfect and things go wrong, this is nothing new, and should not be a surprise if it happens to you.

Thanks for the insight to the assembly process Dennis. I so wish I could have been there for the tour. I love seeing the behind the scenes, "How does it work?" type stuff.

Yes it is not a perfect world, problems happen. But what Sirquack said is true, we all know it is...

In reply to:
Ya gotta luv Axiom Customer Service, they are truely second to none.

And that is something you don't easily find with many companies that you deal with, especially online.

Bravo Axiom for making such wonderful products, and bravo again for providing service at an unsurpassed level.

It's so rewarding to obtain such a product as fine as this, with service that emphasizes what is truely important to your company, the customer.

As for port noise, it's a matter of what you have been feeding your sub. My port exhibits excessive noise and vibration, for example, after eating a bean burrito from Taco Bell!!

Fortunately, the port noise associated with subwoofers in not accompanied by nasally detectable airborne byproducts of digestion.

Peter, you're on a roll here lately. What gives?

Peter, only the silent port disturbances are nasally detectable.

The loud ones are for your audible enjoyment!

I'll keep you posted, I've been busy using my computer troubleshooting skills to diagnose this issue. I'm narrowing in on the cause and hope to find a solution soon.

If you don't find the a solution and Axiom sends a replacement, perhaps you should have it sent here and I can test it out here and save you some time.

Yeah, like you need another sub.. ha ha

Need to try to stay in the running with Jakeman & Craigsub ya know.

You probably have already done this, but when I first set up my 600 I didn't insert the feet. After 2 hours of trying to figure out where all the vibration and noise was coming from (by running my ear up and down the cabinet) I figured out it was coming from the footholes. Of course it stopped as soon as the holes were plugged.

Thanks John, don't think I've talked to you much on these forumns, I'm suprised, Dennis holds you in such high regards...

Anyway, yes I put the rubber feet on while it was still in the box, so when I flipped it over and slid the box off it was good to go....

I'm surprised Dennis holds me in such high regard too

. I think we have chatted at AVS a few times usually about Axiom. Since buying the 600 I've been spending more time at this forum.

Just curious what electronics you are using with your sub/speakers? Have you tried taking out the control unit and tightening every screw you see inside and outside?

In reply to:
Peter, you're on a roll here lately. What gives?

My family arrived last night. My wife was seeing the house for the first time in person and she said I did a fantastic job on the furniture arrangement.

Yep, my first thought was the speaker wire from the amp to the driver was bouncing around on top of the port, so I secured it with some electrical tape. I also noticed the negative (black) post on the back of the amp was a little loose. I assume the nut on the inside of the amp case didn't get tightened fully during mfg. bug I didnt' want to crack open that amp at this point. I also secured it down with electrical tape to rule it out.

I've been working with Axiom and tonight will verify that no air is escaping around the driver or amp seal. The slightest bit of dust or mdf chips can create a escape route for air and can cause these vibrations...

I've been doing some beta testing for Tom Cumberland on the control unit and it is very simple to remove. I would take out the unit and look inside with a flashlight for any loose screws and especially check the port from the inside. It may be a simple problem to solve.

Believe me, I spent hours last night doing all of that, everything checks...

Hey buddy, have you had a chance to really rock the house yet?

Sutter

Have not had a lot of time to really crank it up yet, from the time I get home from work, feed the kids, read/homework with the kids, put them to bed.....yada yada yada....then it is to late to really crank it up..

That's totally understandable. I was just curious.

Sutter

In reply to:
Hey buddy, have you had a chance to really rock the house yet

You will!!!!

Today my son was watching SWII and I was in the middle of the house. I could hear the rattles on one side of me and then the other as the wave moved through the house. I wonder if it will crack the grout in the tile floor.

I hope things will tame down a bit once I get carpet and furniture down there. Now it is like I have one huge subwoofer. A couple of my canned lightings are vibrating, and a few other locations I haven't identified yet. Not to worried about it since I have a ways to go until completion.

Kinda hijacking my own thread, but have a question for those that have used RealTraps CD. It goes from 10hz to 300hz in 1hz increments, so obviously the test is designed for your mains and sub. Do I use it in Stereo/Direct modes and not have the Qs8's turned on, or do I run the CD to all 7 speakers to plot my graph?

I most likely won't do this until I have everything completed and moved into my new HT, but just jumping the gun I guess.

Good question. I would start with just mains and sub (actually I would be tempted to start with just sub) since in general as you add more speakers the ups and downs will be smaller but there will be more of them.

I think Mark was just using mains and sub but we should check. Maybe if he runs all 5 speakers the graph won't be so ugly.

In the past I don't think there was much LF on the center and surrounds but that seems to be changing recently.

Now there's a word I haven't heard in a while, barfy!

Sutter

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. I edited it out while you were reading it

Randy where do you now have the volume control set to on the sub?

Haha, heck that word brought back some memories of the 1980's. lol

Sutter

Hey Sirclyde, I'm still experimenting a little, however the Axiom handout that came with the 500 says to put it "Midway to 9 o'clock" position for starters. That sentence is misleading, I originally took it to say that 9 o'clock is the miday position, which it is halfway of max. After talking to Tharkun and Ajax, they say your supposed to start around 4-5 o'clock which would technically be about the midway point of 9 o'clock.

Anyway, you really need to run the pink noise test and set all your speakers to 75dB's for starters using the receivers level adjustments. The first time I did this when having the sub at 9 o'clock, the receiver had to be at -10dB to achieve 75dB on the meter. I thought that was interesting as my 350 sub was more like 0dB with the volume knob at 12 o'clock.

Then I tried it again and turned the 500 volume down to about 6 o'clock and reran my pink noise test to set all speakers to 75dB. This time the sub on the receiver was more like -2dB to achieve the 75dB reading. Alan at Axiom has always said to leave the receiver setting at 0dB and adjust the volume knob on the sub until your at the appropriate reading.

Now this does not say you can't crank it up a bit higher, it is just a starting point to get all your speakers calibrated correctly, then you can go from there. Also, I always bump up my center a few notches from what the meter says to hear the voices better.

Also on the 500 you have the trim setting. Flat is for very large rooms. For medium I think the handout says to use half or cut modes, you may want to experiment. Then you have phase, this one most people can't tell any difference. Pick the setting that gives you the best and full sounding bass signals.

I would use the sub/mains combo with the tones. Also, 1hz increments is a little overkill for the average person in my opinion. You will drive yourself nuts with that many tones. Check out the snapbug.com website. You will get a lot of advice on how to do the readings and on which hz increments to use.

In reply to:
from the time I get home from work, feed the kids, read/homework with the kids, put them to bed.....yada yada yada....then it is to late to really crank it up.

Somebody needs a dedicated home theater room to be finished!

Hi everyone, I hope to provide an update very soon WITH pictures. I can't come up with any words as to the adventure your about to experience.

I will say this much Axiom Customer Service is first rate.

Looking forward to it.

*Disclaimer* The following photos are NOT being provided as evidence to show that Axiom Audio is in any way, shape, or form, to blame for my current mental state. In fact, I am 190% crazy with the support and customer service I have received from Amie, Ian, Tom, and Noreen. They have maintained a superior level of customer service during this time of need, and for that I am forever grateful. Axiom Audio is the utopia of speaker manufacturing and customer service.

Now, for the FedEx idiot that dropped and ran over my new 500 amp that was shipped Friday in a crate, I want to wish you a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year. We are supposed to love our neighbors and forgive dumb a$$ people that smash our belongings. Whoever that redneck is from Memphis, I hope your monitoring this post.

Ok, wow, I feel better. So here it goes. As you know I discovered a strange noise that happened occasionaly during certain low bass notes of a song. At first I just assumed it was something in my room rattling. However, once I turned off the A channel on my remote and only listened to the sub perform, it was obvious it was coming from the sub.

So, after visiting with Amie, who visited with Ian and Tom and others, I started my troubleshooting. Keep in mind, Axiom was ready to ship me a new 500 whenever I gave the word, however I was willing to try to diagnose/resolve the problem. Below are the steps I took:

1) Checked all of the fasteners on the driver, amp, and port to make sure they were all tight. All seemed just fine, however, I went ahead and gave them all about a 1/4" turn to be sure. This did not resolve the problem.

2) Removed the driver to make sure all looked good on the inside. At first glance I noticed the speaker cable from the amp to the driver was about 2ft long, and was hanging down a bit, and possibly resting on the top of the bass port. I took a small piece of electrical tape and secured it, making it slightly shorter. I also noticed the negative (black) wire post on the back of the amp was a little loose. The wire itself was tight, but the male post that was coming from inside the amp was a little loose, so I also secured that with some electrical tape to rule that out. I placed the driver back in position and tested for the noise again. Sorry to say, these few steps did not resolve the problem either.

3) Again, I played some various CD's with low bass, and I noticed when I crawled around the back of the 500, it seemed the noise was louder near the back by the amp plate. I could push with my fingers on the "CE" logo, and the noise would get a little louder. After talking to Amie, who discussed the issue over a nice dinner with Ian one evening, Ian said it might be possible that some air is escaping around the amp plate. This can happen if a small amount of sawdust or small chips of MDF from the manufacturing process get trapped between the routed edges and the plate when tightened. So the next night I removed the Amp and the Driver, just to make sure I didn't overlook anything. It all looked very clean and there was no evidence of any sawdust or other debris. This does not suprise me, as Axiom has great CNC equipment, with top quality dust extraction systems in place.

4) After spending a few evenings last week working on the above 3 steps, I could see I was not resolving the vibration/rattle. So I called good ole Amie and told her I was sorry that I was unable to pinpoint the source of the noise. Axiom was now convinced it had to be something from within the amp. These amps are built like tanks, and it is very rare that this type of issue would arrise. The fasteners on the amp plate are a star shape with a center post, I think they are called Torx? I did not have these screwdrivers/bits in my arsenal.

Anyway, Friday Axiom sent me out a new amp for my 500. Since we were pretty sure it was coming from within the amp, it made more sense to send a replacement amp instead of an entire new sub. I was very excited.

Like my other speakers, I had Axiom mark the shipment "HOLD for Customer Pickup". My work is only a few blocks from Fed Ex, and it is very convenient to just drop by on the way home. Today when I checked the tracking number online, I was very suprised to see it showed "Out for Delivery". I called Axiom, and they confirmed that they did in fact place the HOLD stickers on the exterior, so they called Fed Ex and had the package returned for pickup.

Here is where the story takes a terrible Twist. You guys thought "American Beauty" was full of twists, I don't think so...

Ok, first of all I would like to show you what the wooden crate was supposed to look like when I picked it up. Thanks Tharkun for showing me this after the fact.

I just assumed it would be in a cardboard double boxed package like their speakers are shipped.

I like your cat Dennis!

This is what my package looked like when I picked it up from FedEx on the way home. I guess I should have questioned why there was a board taped to the top with the shipping label?

When I opened the box I was at a loss for words.

With closer examination, I realized this was not an early April fools joke. The pieces of MDF that were supposed to be protecting the amp, were all just thrown in the box, and the amp was not pretty. ;(

Here is a closer look at the 500 amp, you can see the crack in the plastic body. Also, notice the packing list on the left board that was thrown in this box, hmmmm something is starting to smell fishy about all of this...

Here is a picture will all of the contents layed out on the floor. Every piece of MDF that used to be the crate was seperated.

The next two pictures show one of the corners of the amp was bent. This baaaaby really went for a ride somewhere.

This picture really makes me sad.

After talking with Dennis tonight (Tharkun), it is my best guess the crate was dropped and then ran over during shipment. The person or persons at FedEx that I mentioned at the top of my post, then placed everything in a box, taped the piece of the crate that had the shipping info on it to the top, and sent it on it's [r] Merry Christmas[/r] way. The reason I think this happened in the Memphis Hub, is because the unmarked box has a mfg stamp from some company in Memphis, TN..

In summary, I've talked with Amie this evening and she is already working on a resolution. I understand this is a very busy time for Axiom and they are trying to make a lot of you Newbies happy before Xmas. Since I do have a working 500, it is not a big deal if we wait until things calm down a bit. I'm sure FedEx is just as busy and these things happen.

Hope you enjoyed my little story, and I'm sure things like this won't happen to you, but they always seem to happen to me.

PS: Jack, since both of our 500's went out about the same time, I really think you have my Amp and I have yours, please verify your S/N#.

Maybe some day I'll be able to provide a picture of me lifting my leg.....................

HOLY MACKEREL!!

Geez, Randy, I don't know what to say. . .

Maybe the Fedex guys thought you wouldn't notice the giant crack, the bent eges, the "extra" pieces of the shipping crate, the road grit. . .

I mean, c'mon, you really have to get close to notice these things. Like with a magnifying glass, or the Hubble Telescope.

Okay, my sarcasm is probably not helping.

Randy, I sincerely hope this mess gets straightened out. I'm sure it will, but looking at those pictures makes me want to cry for you.

A rare occurrence SQ for sure.
A poster here, hasn't posted in awhile (jbzngowest) works as some mid-southern manager for Fedex. They take these kinds of mishaps quite seriously.
File a formal complaint.

OMG!!! Bud, wow, I don't want to say either. I've had somethings come in bad shape before, but never that bad, and always from UPS, not Fed Ex.

Well, at least you can rest assure that Amie and the rest of the awesome folks at Axiom will take good care of you.

My word, those pics are going to give me nightmares. lol

Anyone else wonder where, exactly, the big ol' 12" woofer with the massive spider went? I don't see it in any of those pics... That hurts, man.

probably playing in the back of someones car in Memphis! Good Lord, if I didn't know better I'd think it was some sick April Fools joke. That is just too sad...

Randy, actually Jim(jbz...)is in Olive Branch, MS, a suburb of Memphis, and might have some sort of authority over the clown who committed this foul deed.

SPEECHLESS!

(for me, a VERY rare occurrence.

)

Thanks Chesseroo, I'm sure FedEx will do an investigation as their tracking system probably shows more info. than what we see. Anyway, I believe Amie is checking with the FedEx rep that calls on their company...

It is ok Ken, the only that was shipped to me was the Amp, not the 12" woofer, my 12 inches is just fine....

Thanks John and Chesseroo,

I sent Jim a PM, but he has not posted since September. I'm not expecting him to get involved since Amie has hired Clint Eastwood to hunt this scum down.

I'm sure he'll enjoy the story anyway...

Randy

For those jumping in on the end of this thread, you really need to check out page 8, that is where all the fun started...

Randy I couldn’t imagine how you felt opening that box, hell it pisses me off to see such a blatant disregard for others property.

Page 8? It's on page 4 for me. (I upped my posts per page count in my preferences...)

But as to your mangled amp, my god!

Thanks Peter, I forgot about that setting...

Good G*d, man!! It looks like it was accidentally sent to Underwriter's Lab's(UL)!!

Or to Ilkka

In one of the phone converstions with Randy yesterday, I metioned he could post the pics showing what an Axiom amp could look like after Ilkka had it at his place to review.

YIKES!!!

I don't know how FedEx is supposed to address this kind of problem. But packing it back up and sending it to you, in hopes no one would notice? It's insulting. I'm sure Amie has FedEx hot on this one as they ship enough merchandise that they should get some personal attention.

I'm sure Axiom is sending you another amp? And FedEx should throw in a partridge in a pear tree.

Funny that just the other day we were defending Axiom in that a loose wire or loose screw could result in shipping. Now I think no one would argue

Thanks for the pics Randy. It certainly was a story worth telling. Let me know which night I can catch the Dateline Investigation. Best wishes on getting the new new amp.

Thank God it was something that was replacable. those pictures are like faces of death for home theater equipment. hope you get the new amp before the holiday.

Wow. I've never seen anything like that. At least you can be certain that Amie will take good care of you.

Oddly, of all my shipments from Axiom via Purolator, I've had two of them damaged... one they managed to crush in a corner of a carton (and the corner of a speaker), the other they jolted a QS so badly it damaged a voice coil.

And it's not due to Axiom's packaging. I just get the feeling that the courier companies aren't taking the care they should.

I've had some luck recently with DHL for shipping. Time will tell whether or not they're truly any better than FedEx or Purolator.

Bren R.

What you are going through blows. I hope this will be rectified quickly, and FedEx won't give Axiom or yourself too much trouble. At least it didn't resemble my experience. I bought pair of Energy 2.4i in May 2005 on Ebay which was packed by the UPS Store and trashed by UPS. Neither of the speakers are functional. I'm still waiting to get my money back.

I starting using FedEx as a result of this; so far so good. Hopefully, what happened to you is an rare occurrence.

For those who want to see why I'm so passionately anti-UPS Store and Anti-UPS, here are some pics, mostly because of their poor customer service.

Whoa. That's really nasty Randy and quite obvious it wasn't a simple mistake...that's a heck of a mess somebody made. Good luck on the next shipment and the sub!

Here's the second of Jinhan's pics.

Thanks Jack for getting my back. I'm still getting used to putting pictures on the forums.

You guys are gonna make me cry.

Looks like the next set of Axioms I get are gonna be picked up at the factory.
Or with Axioms CS , maybe they should start their own mail service.
Probably put FedX and few others out of business.

I have heard a lot of complaints with UPS. The number of complaints I have heard with FedEx has been a lot less. I wonder if this is secondary to the volume of shipments delivered; does UPS have higher volumes? I also wonder if the risk of damaged goods is worse during the busy Christmas season.

I have realized that this is a risk we face with buying from internet direct companies. The small (and I do stress small) risk of damaged shipments is just part what we have to accept as consumers. Fortunately for us, companies such as Axiom are very customer service oriented, and will go out of your way to make sure all is right if the speakers are damaged. It may cost us a small amount of inconvenience, but it won't cost us any money. I bought my speakers through E-bay, so unfortunately, the experience has been way more painful for me.

I'm sure that Sirquack will be well taken care of.:)

Glad to help! What happened to your pics has happened to me a number of times. If you have multiple pics in a single post, the forum software creates a simplified code for all of them. The src" and ">, found before and after the second url in your post which didn't produce a pic is part of that code. Then if you go back in and edit or change something it screws up that code, and you usually get only the pic you edited or changed.

When you do an edit of a post with multiple pics you must be sure to clean all that extra coding out from your post so it looks like it did when you created it the first time. Maybe someone who understands the coding will be able to better explain this phenomenon, and offer a better solution.

Everybody, back away--Jack is getting technical on us.

Who knew?

Sounds like shipping is a problem not only with Memphis, but with Nashville Tn. as well!

We used to send some of our jet engines to Arnold Engineering test center near Tullahoma Tn. for altitude testing in their wind tunnels.

I was scheduled to spend a few days there on one occasion back in the early eighties, but at the last moment was notified to just show up for the afternoon.

I arrived there to see that someone had run a forklift about 1/3 of the way THRU our engine!!

Update, my new amp is on the way for a Friday delivery. Hopefully the weekday FedEx employees aren't as drunk as the weekend employees that ran over my first amp.

Just in time for Christmas!

WOW Randy sorry to hear about your luck with the 500. I think it is a sign from the SUB GODS. The 500 is not the right choice for you. Go ahead and get the 600.

I was hoping for all the troubles I would get Santa to bring me a 600.

No actually, everything has been just fine, Amie and I have worked out everything. Since my current 500 works, it is all good.

Merry Christmas to all.

I am glad to hear that all will be fine. I just watched Stat Wars it my 500 rocked and rolled. I was only listening to it at -15. I can't wait til the wife wakes up so I can really cranks it.

Which Star Wars episode Clarence? I thought 1-2 and 4-6 had better LFE than 3, not sure why...

There were some interesting waterfall plots of Episode III of the LFE track of III at AVSForums. Long story short, for whatever reason, the LFE channel was not heavily used in this movie. There were a lot of complaints about the lack of bass in this movie.

Just checked the tracking, it was just released from Memphis customs, should be here tomorrow.

Just to let you know, the new Amp came in, I just installed it and I think the problem is resolved, so far I have not been able to recreate the vibration. I'll be posting some pics later of what a good crate looks like when it arrives in tact...

Applause for another great Axiom Customer Service story.....

Great news. Let 'er rip!

Merry Christmas.

you bet I will, tonight there is going to be some serious LFE going on, not sure which movie yet...

Great to hear the new amp is in place, now go enjoy the 500. !!

Just got done putting some polyurethane on some more doors, really stinks down there...

"What a long hard trip it's been!" I'm so glad you got things resolved before the holidays. Now you can sit back, put your feet up, and DRIVE YOURSELF CRAZY calibrating and tweaking.

You got that right Jack, I'm pretty anal when it comes to tweeking things just right, especially the picture on my projector. Sound is a differant animal...

>>you bet I will, tonight there is going to be some serious LFE going on, not sure which movie yet...

If War of the Worlds doesn't make things shake and rattle then you can stop worrying.

In reply to:
Just got done putting some polyurethane on some more doors, really stinks down there...

Stay down there long enough and you'll be dying to watch The Wall or Tron or Beavis and Butthead......

fire FIRE

he he, he he, he said fire, he he

Uhh huh huh.

Shut up, Beavis...

Well I can tell you the vibration/rattle/noise whatever you want to call it, is gone. Tonight I watched Finding Nemo with my 7yr old son, OH MY, this 500 puts out some serious energy.

The Darla Tap scene was unbelievable, I felt like I was in the aquarium, it made the hairs on my legs stand up. My other favorite scene is when Bruce the shark spits out the torpedo and it explodes the underwater mines, WOW, I felt it in the chest.

Totally awesome folks. I'm sure the other 500/600 owners can relate... I think it was Rick (BrotherBob) that mentioned I'm going to have to relive all my movies, he was 100% accurate.

Randy

So do you like your new 500

In reply to:
WOW, I felt it in the chest

Crap.

Now I have to get one. Or, have Tom fly out here to beat me on the chest.

I think getting the 500 would be less complicated.

You have 2 350's don't you Mark?

I believe Mark just has one 350 but in order to save on pixels he drew two locations he had tested recently on a single diagram.

In reply to:
Now I have to get one.

I feel it in my bones. Mark's caving in! Bring on the 500!

You know, Mark, I was thinking exactly the same thing when I read Randy's post.

I am somewhat more versatile than the EP500, but it is a far better value.

You'll love it. Go buy one. You'll never know unless you try it. You can always send it back if it's not like butter. You know you want it. You work hard - you deserve it.

Maybe ply LightinJoe with drinks and get him to order one for you.

Now where is Subliminal Wid when you need him? What do you think Rick, Mark needs some upgrades....

Oh I do think Mark needs to get one of those Ep 500s that is getiing all the praise. Some M80s running full range might help smooth out the bass reponse too

<<Oh I do think Mark (get a 500) needs to get one (get a 500) of those Ep 500s that is getting all the (get a 500) praise. Some M80s (get a 500) running full range (get a 500) might help smooth out the bass (get a 500) reponse too. >>

Not subliminal, but obuious!!!