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#151964 - 11/24/06 10:36 AM I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall
minnichs2 Offline
regular

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 7
I finally made the purchase….an Epic Grand Master 500 In-wall/On-wall system in Boston Cherry from the outlet. I am set to move into a new home on December 4th. I had the family room, 20 x 22 x 9, wired for the system and am getting a Pioneer 5070 plasma to be the center piece. I also ordered a Yamaha RX-V659 to drive the system. I know that it lacks HDMI but with all the potential bugs at this time I figured I would go with a cost conscious receiver and upgrade later; hopefully, a component connection will provide the same quality of video reproduction. The only other potential downside is that the security system installer, Guardian, would only use 16 gauge wire and the builder would not allow me to go with another company. By the way, this is not my first post as in the moving transition I lost my Axiom password and the email account associated with it, so I reregistered. Thank you to everyone that has responded to my posts and questions and I hope to help out others that are considering the Architectural Series by posting pictures and reviewing the system.

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#151965 - 11/24/06 11:18 AM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: minnichs2]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13344
Loc: Iowa
That is great man, I'm excited for you. You will have to post some pics of your Architectural speakers when up. There are lots of people that keep requesting pictures.

That is to bad about the 16 AWG, and really rediculous that the company would not use a thicker gauge, I would have insisted. Anyway, below are the maximum lengths for 16AWG for various rated speaker ohms.

8 ohm speakers - 48ft max length run
6 ohm speakers - 36ft max length run
4 ohm speakers - 24ft max length run

so, your Qs8's and W150 are 6 ohm speakers, as long as your speaker runs are not longer than 36ft each, you should be fine. Also, did they run a Sub Coax cable for you?
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

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#151966 - 11/24/06 11:30 AM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: SirQuack]
minnichs2 Offline
regular

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 7
Thanks for the info regarding the maximum length for 16 gauge wire. I even offered to buy the wire and pay them the same amount as if it was purchased from them. The length for the 16 gauge wire will be close to 36 feet but should be under. What types of problems can I expect if the length is over 36 feet and/or just from the smaller gauge wire in general? I forgot to mention that it is a 7.1 system so I have four 6 ohm speakers with 16 gauge wire running to them. The w150 only is a few feet away from the receiver so that should be OK, hopefully. Yes, they ran the sub coax cable. Again, thank you.

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#151967 - 11/24/06 11:43 AM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: minnichs2]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13344
Loc: Iowa
Well, if you use a thinner gauge wire, higher resistance, than what is recommended a few things could occur. Power could be lost in the wire, and the speaker would not play as loud. So you really don't want to go beyond the length specified.

Here is a great website that explains all of this, the wire table and the next few paragraphs explains in more detail.

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

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#151968 - 11/24/06 05:26 PM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: SirQuack]
minnichs2 Offline
regular

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 7
Thanks for the sight; it has more information on speaker wire than I will ever need. I think the surround runs will be slightly over 36 feet but the back speakers should be fine. I guess I will just need to hook it up and test it when the speakers arrive.

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#151969 - 11/24/06 05:36 PM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: minnichs2]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13344
Loc: Iowa
well hopefully you'll be ok, funny, wouldn't you think the wiring contractor would know about these things for running HT wiring, oh well. good luck and look forward to the pictures.
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

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#151970 - 11/24/06 11:23 PM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: minnichs2]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10411
Minnichs2(since you're so closely related to the original minnichs you don't qualify for a new welcome),I'm sure that you'll get great enjoyment from those excellent speakers. As to the gauge of the wire, Mr. Russell's highly informative article and table don't describe absolute limits, but rather, good guidelines that shouldn't be greatly exceeded. What you have should be fine.
_________________________
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#151971 - 11/25/06 12:15 AM Re: I Did It..Epic Grand Master 500 In-Wall/On-Wall [Re: JohnK]
BrenR Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 12/10/03
Posts: 3602
Loc: Winnipeg MB Canada
As always, bless you Mr. Russell.

JohnK's got a point - suddenly at 50ft, 1 inch... you're not going to suddenly be disappointed with your 16ga in-wall.

All literature is going to tell you something different, Crown amps, for instance, suggest that a damping factor of 500 is good for home hi-fi (and you can get away with 75 in live event audio)... your setup (consulting their nomograph) gives a damping factor of 20, which they'd suggest is good enough for panhandlers and micing the Farmer Says. Not surprisingly, they tried to sell us an IQ System along with our Com-Tech 1600 & 800 amps to help make this dream a reality, so take that all with a grain of salt.

Oh, and consulting the nomograph, they'd have you using AWG#2 wire at 50 feet.

Bren R.

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