 Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,490 Likes: 116
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 10,490 Likes: 116 |
Bayne,
A single QS8 will work very well. I have watched Blade 3 which is recorded in 6.1 with both of my rear QS8s as well as a single QS8 and there is no difference that I can hear. My room is much wider than yours.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,420
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 10,420 |
All I can say is that even with my poor corner lay out, the sound improvement from 5.1 to 6.1 for HT was very noticeable and I wouldn't have wanted a direct radiating for the rear as the QS's spread the sound so well.
Jason
M80 v2
VP160 v3
QS8 v2
PB13 Ultra
Denon 3808
Samsung 85" Q70
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654 |
Bayne, there're two advantages spoken of for using two back surround speakers, even if there's only one(or no)back channel: a well-established psychoacoustic effect in which sounds intended to be imaged directly behind the listener appear to instead come directly from in front of him; when applying modes such as DPLIIx to 2 or 5 channel material, a stereo back signal results which can give both a left and right rear effect. It's said that using a single very wide dispersion speaker such as the QSs can make the reversal effect less likely. You don't explain why the back speakers couldn't be separated more than about 3', but unless you have one both to the left and right of the listeners, the stereo advantage won't be present and one QS might be a better choice.
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 283
local
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OP
local
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 283 |
Here's a quick photo of the back of my room. The yellow line represents the centre of the room. As you can see rear speaker placement is limited, however after doing some number crunching I believe that I can ceiling-mount two M2's and have close to 5 feet between them. Next spring I'll be getting four home theatre recliners, but the centre two seats will be used the most. I'm leaning toward two M2's for the rears becasue they're mounted sideways on Axiom's ceiling brackets. I'll tilt them down and in a bit. From the speakers to the seating position will be about 5 feet. [image]  [/image]
"Not throwing my hands up or my dress above my ears don't mean I ain't awestruck." Al Swearengen
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,654 |
Probably 5' separation and 5' back should work well.
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37 |
Quote:
Quote:
Why do many of you guys go with direct radiating speakers for 7.1? Is it just cost? If you take cost out of the equation, what is the sound difference from using QS8's or M2's as your 7.1 speakers?
The thought around using direct radiating speakers as back surrounds is basically centered around multi channel music, not so much for HT. From my experiments with my set up, I had to point the M3’s to where I usually sit for them to sound ‘right’. When they were pointed straight ahead something was just off. If my room was deeper I suspect they would not need to be pointed to the listening position. Even though they sound great at the main listening position, other seating areas suffer. Doesn’t matter much in my room because no one but me notices but it might in larger rooms with more seats. I went with M3’s because I was planning ahead. I had planned to use the M3’s for another room and buying a set of Q’s to replace them but just haven’t gotten around to doing anything with that room. If my room was anther six feet or so in depth, I’d leave the M3’s up and not give it a second thought.
I don’t think it’s as important to which speaker you throw up behind you until you start running out of realestate. When your backs are getting closer than around 8’, that is when you should consider going with Q’s over directional speakers.
Not many people have heard discrete 7.1 sources, because there is very small number available and they ain’t movies….they’re PS3 games. Even though I’m not a game player, my son is and I can tell you that discrete 7.1 sounds way cool. Discrete 6.1 sounds pretty friggin cool when that sixth channel get’s sent to both rear surround speakers too. I have a few 6.1 Blue Ray disks and they sound downright amazing. After hearing this discrete channel coming at me from directly behind me, I’d be Jones’n for it if I suddenly lost those back channels.
OK, I'm back. I listen to multichannel music on my big HT system, so I took JohnK's advice and picked up a pair of M2s for the back surround position speakers and used my QS8s as the side surrounds. Didn't like it. Swapped the M2s for a pair of modded Michaura M55s laid on their sides. This worked much better.
Nevertheless, I'd say that a single QS8 in the back would be a wonderful choice for either music or HT.
What really surprised me was how excellent the phantom Virtual Matrix 6.1 works - excellent back speaker performance without any speaker! Top that!
BTW, here's a picture of some M55s in a fooling around 2 channel system.
[image]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/2x6spds/AXIOM.jpg?t=1186631847[/image]
what?
[IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/2x6spds/AXIOM.jpg[/IMG]
Guess I forgot how to post a picture. [image]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v192/2x6spds/AXIOM.jpg[/image]
Last edited by 2x6spds; 08/09/07 04:27 AM.
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441
shareholder in the making
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shareholder in the making
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 16,441 |
Quote:
so I took JohnK's advice.... Didn't like it.
The veils be thin.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37 |
pmbuko, I see from your profile that you have a pair of M22s and some non-axiom surrounds. You've been free with your advice to folks here about the various Axiom speakers and how well they perform in various positions.
I have M2s, M3s, QS8s, VP100, Merak MC634s, MC6Hs, have had M22s, M50s, and convinced various friends to pick up M60s. I have Michaura M665s, M66s and M55s.
I took someone's advice about the M2s without even asking whether John ever had a pair, or auditioned a pair in the back surround position he recommends.
Nevertheless, I took a chance, picked up a pair of M2s, replaced a pair of Mission DS77 surround dipoles, and can tell you without reservation that the Missions performed better than the M2s in the back surround position for both music and HT.
You can keep giving people advice based on your limited experience but enormous audio engineering background, and you can keep sniping at my posts.
But I don't think you know what you're talking about, and right or wrong, my impressions are based on my experience of these Axiom speakers at work in varous systems.
So, keep up your stalking ... but I don't think you're helping this fella with his audio questions.
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37 |
 Maybe this picture will work - M55 on its side. OK, OK, M2s retired from back surround duties.  M665s with Frankencenter, Merak MC634, Axiom 6.5s" and Reference 3a de capo mm tweeter  More Michaura M55s with modded T-Amp 2 channel, Titanic 10" sub, yadayada  So, some pix, show and tell
Last edited by 2x6spds; 08/09/07 05:51 AM.
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.
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Re: One more time... 6.1 or 7.1?
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37
connoisseur
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connoisseur
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 3,749 Likes: 37 |
 Thiels, Frankenhorn center with twin Axiom 6.5s, Merak horn loaded tweeter, 3 Yammies an Onk, the DTC 9.4 and Toshiba SD9200, some supertweets
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.
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