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#214378 - 07/04/08 11:04 AM Are my M60s over powering my EP350
geoffthemonk Offline
frequent flier

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 11
Folks I am relatively new to this forum and I am a new Axiom fan. I purchased a pair of M60v2s and QS8v2s a little while ago. Have totally fell in love with the them. But for movies I was missing the low end frequencies. So I decided to add a sub. I have purchased an EP350 (older model) but now it seems to me that my EP350 is having trouble keeping up with my M60s. I am driving my M60s with Yamaha RX-V663. The sub is connected to my receiver through an RCA cable (from my receiver's sub out to sub's line in). The speakers levels on my receiver are as follows
FR=0
FL=0
SL=1.5
SR=1.5
Center (which is a VP150)=2.0
Sub=10
Even with this setting, I can not hear a thumpy bass. My room is 15 x 20 x 8. X-over is set to 80 on my sub and X-over on the sub is turned up all the way (it is 120 Hz I believe on my model). Unless I crank the volume up all the way on my sub, my bass is fairly muted (or thats what it sounds like to me), both for movies and music. The bass is there but it is not strong and powerful (its not boomy though). My M60s sound like they are over powering my sub even with them turned down to 1.5.
The sub is on rubber feet and sitting on carpet. Currently it is right next to the couch which is in front of main speakers about 12 feet away. Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

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#214382 - 07/04/08 11:16 AM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: geoffthemonk]
SRoode Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/20/08
Posts: 1200
Loc: Fishers, Indiana, USA
Have you tried putting the sub in the corner of the room? I have my EP500s at only 6:30pm setting, and the AVR is set at -5db for the sub. Something does not sound right.

Do me a favor and temporarily set the front's at +3db and tell me if you perceive more "thump".
_________________________
2 M80s, 1 VP180, 4 QS8s, 2 EP800s, 4 Algonquins, 2 M3 VaSSallos

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#214383 - 07/04/08 11:47 AM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: SRoode]
geoffthemonk Offline
frequent flier

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 11
Hey SRoode, 6:30 is 12 o'clock or 6 o'clock?

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#214386 - 07/04/08 12:11 PM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: geoffthemonk]
SRoode Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/20/08
Posts: 1200
Loc: Fishers, Indiana, USA
6 o'clock. A little over the bottom of the dial.
_________________________
2 M80s, 1 VP180, 4 QS8s, 2 EP800s, 4 Algonquins, 2 M3 VaSSallos

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#214391 - 07/04/08 12:44 PM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: SRoode]
SRoode Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/20/08
Posts: 1200
Loc: Fishers, Indiana, USA
Going to be heading out soon for the block party, but before I go, try this:

1) Move your sub. I assume next to your couch means about the middle of the room. This is a bad placement. 1/3 off side wall or corner is best.

2) Once moved, turn the sub level down to about 9 o'clock. Should be right for your room with one EP350 sub.

3) Reduce AVR sub setting to 0db.

4) Bring AVR FL and FR up to +3db.

See if this works. The "thump" that people perceive is the attack, and the M60's will handle that since it is in the >100Hz spectrum. The sustain (<100Hz) is handled by the subs ("room energy", "shaking", etc.) and the EP350 will handle that fine.




Edited by SRoode (07/04/08 12:57 PM)
_________________________
2 M80s, 1 VP180, 4 QS8s, 2 EP800s, 4 Algonquins, 2 M3 VaSSallos

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#214394 - 07/04/08 01:11 PM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: SRoode]
Hutzal Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/26/06
Posts: 2102
Loc: Hollywood. (Canadian @ <3)
you could very well be sitting right in the middle of a bass null and not even notice it.

I would suggest doing the "Alan Sub Crawl" technique to find the optimal placement for your new sub.




Edited by Hutzal (07/04/08 01:14 PM)
_________________________
Producer | Composer
www.robbhutzal.com

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#214396 - 07/04/08 01:52 PM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: Hutzal]
geoffthemonk Offline
frequent flier

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 11
Great Stuff guys. I am work right now but will try it all out as soon as I get home. By the way, if someone could tell me how post pictures on this forum, I can take 'em and post 'em. That will probably help everyone understand the layout of my room.

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#214400 - 07/04/08 02:14 PM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: geoffthemonk]
St_PatGuy Offline
axiomite

Registered: 03/07/05
Posts: 7395
Loc: Glendale, Arizona
You need to upload the to a site like photobucket. From there you simply create a link.



Edited by St_PatGuy (07/04/08 02:14 PM)
_________________________
***********
"Nothin' up my sleeve. . ." --Bullwinkle J. Moose

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#214434 - 07/05/08 01:01 AM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: St_PatGuy]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13321
Loc: Iowa
I had one of the original 350's which had a different dial representation compared to the 500 or 600's. Normally, to have it balanced with my old m60's, it would have to be around 11-12 o'clock, pointing straight up.
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

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#214751 - 07/09/08 11:02 AM Re: Are my M60s over powering my EP350 [Re: SirQuack]
geoffthemonk Offline
frequent flier

Registered: 07/04/08
Posts: 11
..sorry guys, I was away for a bit. I have not had a chance to take pictures yet but to me it feels like the issue is not over powering M60s, but more like blending of my EP350 with my M60s. I think the sub is fairly balanced when it comes to music (though I have to have it at like 3 o'clock volume rather than 12 o'clock) but for movies my sub seems to be not fully blended in with my mains. It seems to be in a little bit of a "world of its own". I have tried playing with the phase, I will change cross over to 60hz today and see if that helps. Do you guys think it is a good idea to change mains to 'large' if I change x-over to 60Hz?

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