Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners 7.1 surround versus 5.1 with 4 m80s

I understand the qs8s are quite highly regarded, however, after auditioning the m80s the obvious occurred to me: how would a 5.1 system with 4 m80s (2 m80 fronts and 2 m80 surrounds) stack up against a 7.1 system with 2 m80s and 4 qs8s (negligible difference in price between the 2 systems). For SACD or DVD-A playback, or HT (most important).

I'm overthinking this, I know, but would appreciate any feedback from anyone who may have tried this or have relevant knowledge.

thanks,
SK

IMO, not much comparison for music, the 4 M80s are the way to go. I think it is mostly a personal preference as to which way to go for HT. I think the QS's enveloping sound is better, at least for side surrounds. I would still try to run M80s as the dual rear center channels, especially in large rooms.

SK, I found this article helpful in resolving what to buy initially (QS8s) though I haven’t completely given up the M80 surround idea.

http://www.soundstage.com/surrounded/surrounded200307.htm

Jason, do you have M80 surrounds or have heard home systems with towers all around. At first I thought this would be the way to go but the more multi-channel audio I get the more I find that most of the information coming out of the surround channels seems to be ambient sound. Only exceptions I have right now are a Dark Side of the Moon SACD and Quaudiophiliac. Also do you have any suggestions on good multi-channel recordings with more than ambient sounds coming from the surrounds?

Dean

My feeling is that M80s as surrounds would be overkill for most processor modes and listening situations. There just isn't enough full-range sound that is sent through those speakers to take advantage of what they're capable of.

The exception would be if you primarily listen to 2-channel music in 7-channel stereo mode (which I do from time to time). In this mode, all speakers get a full-range L or R (or L+R mix) signal pumped through them. In this case, surrounding yourself with M80s would be nothing short of awesome.

For most home theater listening situations though, I would prefer the QS8s because of the enveloping surround they provide. I'm not sure you'd get the same feeling from the 80s alone.

Although not M80's, for quite a while I did use towers all around when I upgraded to my M80's (fronts)from Paradigm Monitor 9's. I had my Paradigm Monitor 9's for sides and rears and I VERY much prefer Qs8's in place of the towers as they give a much more enveloping sound for movies. For music it was a treat but overkill in my 20 x 24 foot room.

Cam

I did try the M60s as surrounds with the M80s when I had them all together and I did find them to be superior with music, but I also had a weak sub at the time so that might have colored the outcome a little. I only have concert DVDs for use as I have never bought SACDs nor DVD-A discs.

I use 4 M80's in my set-up and don't feel the need to change anything. The sound is awesome.
Mel N.

Qs8's do great for music as well, in my opinion. You could get 2 Qs8's for the side surrounds, and bookshelfs for the rears for multi music.

Just so there's no ambiguities, I have no complaints with the Qs8's and music here. I will say that I find them more aesthetically appealing than towers (looks and size), for surrounds. That being said I am envious of your setup Onn.

Braggart.

I've been called worse. I'm just used to having a 4 speaker setup (since 1979), you can't teach an old dog new tricks.
Mel N

Quadruphenia, huh?

I like music to hit me from all sides.
Mel N.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences everyone. I am leaning toward 4 Qs8s because the primary purpose will be HT and the tradeoffs for music don't sound all that bad; I may still have to explore the bookshelf idea.

Part of the reason I am still waffling is I can't quite figure out how I am going to install the side surrounds. The room is in the middle of the house, with a lot going on, 4 internal doors, 2 external doors and an open transition into the dining room on one side. The side Qs8s might have to be on stands, how stable are they? I don't know how to do computer graphic drawing but I may have to draw something by hand to get some advice, it's a bit complicated.

I was thinking about towers on either side of the couch as left and right surrounds so they wouldn't tip over (7-year-old daughter, 1-year old cat who likes to fly through the air whenever possible) but that's probably not a workable solution either because there is no basement and wood floors so there would be no way to run the speaker cable in an unobtrusive manner. On the right side of the couch there's a square pillar in the middle of the room, on the left side you have a door to the outside and then a fireplace so the surround would have to be a bit high up. Ideally you want the left and right surrounds at ear level, do you not?

To boil it down, I guess the questions I'm wondering about at the moment are: 1) I could put the surround on the left side of the couch on top of the fireplace which is 59" tall, is that too high? 2) The pillar on the right side sits just in front of the couch, is that too far forward (i.e., 2-3 feet in front of the listener once the listener is in a lounging position)? 3) Do the left and right surrounds need to be directly across from each other?

SK

Not at all. You probably want both surrounds and rears fairly close in height so that panning is even but the QS speakers are very forgiving in placement. Also make sure to leave a few inches for the up and down firing drivers.


It’s not ideal to have it in front of the listener but if you have no other choice. Also the QS speakers are going to be more forgiving with this sort of placement than towers or bookshelves.

Not perfectly but I think they could sound unbalanced it they aren’t. maybe someone who has them like that will comment.


Actually most recommendations are to place them at least slightly above ear level to get wider dispersion and surround effect for HT. For audio having all the tweeters at ear level is probably more important. I found that all my speakers including M80 mains sound better elevated so the tweeters are about a foot above ear level including for audio. Seems to give much better dispersion to all of them.

It there a reason you can’t ceiling mount the surrounds and rears? Many people prefer them mounted higher up. Again the QS speakers are ideal for this.

Ceilings are 12 feet high, don't know if that matters. It would probably be easier to mount them on the ceiling, I guess I thought they would sound better if mounted on the walls.

Considering all speakers are calibrated for the same output at the main listening point, it doesn't really matter where they are positioned. I have my QS8's a few inches below a 8' ceiling.

I also believe with level matching you'd be happier overall with them mounted on the ceiling, especially considering all of the complications you have with ear-level placement. Granted though, those are some tall ceilings.

The stands do have weights you can put in the bottom of them, but even so, with a young one and cat, I'd be worried about them toppling (not to mention the difficult problem of hiding the wires).

I can't remember off hand anyone here who has ceiling mounted them with that tall of ceilings, hopefully you'll get a few more opinions in the next day or two from folks in a similar situation.

Jason