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#23258 - 12/19/03 01:05 PM Re: Speaker cable
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16273
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
Interesting link golfdawg (http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/page7.htm). Would anyone with more electrical knowledge than me care to comment on it?
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#23259 - 12/19/03 01:15 PM Re: Speaker cable
chesseroo Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 4829
Loc: western canada
No electrical knowledge is required.
Just common sense.
How does a single electrical signal from the receiver carrying full frequency info magically get split into 2 distinct signals carrying separate frequencies within the same wire?
The wire has no intelligence, no circuitry at the split point.
However, the crossovers in the speakers do because that is what they were designed to do.
So how does biwired wire manage to accomplish such a feat?

The concept of biwiring exceeds the laws of physics, period.
Merry Christmas.
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#23260 - 12/19/03 01:24 PM Re: Speaker cable
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16273
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
Just speculation, but would the crossover circuitry (which when biwired is separate for the woofer and tweeter sections) affect the current on wire?

In other words, since the wires are actually touching on the amplifier end, wouldn't the current favor the less resistive path?
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#23261 - 12/19/03 01:24 PM Re: Speaker cable
spiffnme Offline
axiomite

Registered: 04/01/03
Posts: 5214
Loc: Los Angeles
Here, here Chess.

I had a salesman at The Good Guys tell me that the speakers he was trying to sell me were bi-wireable. "That improves the sound 40%!". I told him I did believe bi-wireing improved the sound, and asked where he came up with the 40% number. His response was the it indeed improves the sound 40%..."everyone knows that".

What a putz.


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#23262 - 12/19/03 01:38 PM Re: Speaker cable
chesseroo Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 4829
Loc: western canada
In reply to:

In other words, since the wires are actually touching on the amplifier end, wouldn't the current favor the less resistive path?



And if it did, what exactly would that do to the sound quality of the driver being fed the lesser signal b/c it has the more resistive path?
If anything, it would colour the signal such that the driver would not play appropriately (these are analog signals so signal strength matters, not the digital type where signal strength would not matter).
Now who the hell wants that?
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#23263 - 12/19/03 01:44 PM Re: Speaker cable
mwc Offline
aficionado

Registered: 07/21/02
Posts: 958
Loc: Texas(DFW)..that country to th...
In reply to:

wouldn't the current favor the less resistive path?



Yes but only after the the cable has been properly broken in and only after the electrons have worn a comfortable path through the wire. Sort of like water flowing down hill where it erodes the weak earth and goes around the rocks and stuff. But If the electrons are allowed to pool up at the end, then the cable will not sound good because the electrons will be stagnating....you see.









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#23264 - 12/19/03 02:00 PM Re: Speaker cable
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16273
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
chess,

I'm not trying to defend bi-wiring at all. I believe it's a waste of wire. What I am trying to do is understand the graphs on that webpage. I agree with you that, if anything, the unequal resistivities of the two wire paths would have an negative effect on the sound.
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#23265 - 12/19/03 03:48 PM Re: Speaker cable
golfdawg Offline
regular

Registered: 12/17/03
Posts: 5
If you're bored you can read Jon Risch's article (long and technical) on bi-wiring here: http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/biwiring.htm

Take it for what it's worth, I think cables are a personal thing. All I know is Axiom Speakers are excellent.

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#23266 - 12/19/03 04:29 PM Re: Speaker cable
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16273
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
golfdawg,

That article contains some dubious information. I'll concentrate on the most blatant example here:
In reply to:

The situation is such that when the full range musical signal is applied to the terminals of a full-range speaker system, the woofer only gets sent low frequency signals, and the tweeter only gets sent high frequency signals. Once the crossover networks have been electrically separated, they still continue to function in the same manner, having a low impedance in their passband of application. This means that if separate speaker cables are hooked up for the woofer and it's portion of the network, and the tweeter, and it's portion of the network, not only have the speakers and the frequency's directed and divided for them, but the two separate speaker cables will now also carry different signals, the woofer cable mostly the lows, and the tweeter cable mostly the highs.



Picture the binding posts on a biwirable speaker. Now, think of the jumpers connecting the tweeter and woofer posts as just another length of cable -- that's all a jumper is, anyway. So even when you haven't biwired, you're still using two cables.

Now remove the jumper and run two cables to the speaker (i.e. biwire them). The only difference here is that the "jumper" is now in fact the terminal on the amplifier to which both wires are connected. You've simply moved the point where both wires touch closer to the amp.

So, continuing with this image, would a speaker still be considered bi-wired if the point where one wire split into two was one quarter of the way between the amp and the speaker? Halfway? 3/4 of the way? 9/10 of the way?

Think about it.


Edited by pmbuko (12/19/03 04:38 PM)
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#23267 - 12/19/03 06:05 PM Re: Speaker cable
Saturn Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 10/21/02
Posts: 1041
Loc: Toronto Ontario Canuck
Peter;

Of all the posts of bi-wire in all my readings this many years yours is the only one that made me clue in on that point. Consider me a non believer of bi-wire. Bi-amping though is another story....
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