Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Technical Questions Centre channel above or below screen?

Some of you guys(and girls) have your centre channel mounted above and others below your screens. I'm wondering if either was done simply for placement reasons or did you choose either location for sonic reasons?

The tweeters on my M80s sit almost in line with the centre of the screen(52" Sammy) and voice imaging is coming from slightly below the TV and slightly to the right of centre (in 2 channel). When I add my VP150, if I were to mount it ABOVE the TV, will it raise the imaging more to the centre of the TV or will the centre channel take over most of the dialogue completely and therefore the imaging be moved according to it's placement?

Tks, Adrian

Adrian whenever I used a single channel I found it sounded better below the screen, which had the center closer to the height of the tweeters on the 80s.

You'll probably just have to experiment with both positions and see what works best for you. <---<<< That almost sounds like advice from Dr. Ruth.

Also, remember to angle the center upwards/downwards to your ears, depending on which way you go. The VP150 can be flipped over to make use of the angled design.

Thanks Dr. Ru....uh, Rick! Most people seem to have their centre mounted/placed under the screen, but I've always thought it was more out of convenience (shelf space on stand) than necessarily the optimum placement. Indeed, most advertising, including Axiom's, show the centre mounted under the screen. ::Scratching head::

Generally, you want the speakers, L/C/R, in a flat line. That way sound moving across the screen does not move up as moves left to right. All that said, I moved mine to over the TV and improved the clarity of dialogue. I have not noticed any loss in image quality on moving sounds, but over my screen is only about 15 inches higher than the tops of my towers, so minimal sonic impact.

Also, if you get an image to the left in 2 ch, then you could spend some time getting that worked out. Toe the speakers in, get the levels right, etc. If that does not work, you might try to treat the first order reflections. My image was off as well, but after some work I have it dead center now and music is much improved.

Excellent question!

First off try whats most convenient. If you have a television that you can place the center on would be a good start (or wall mounting slightly above). You then could try angling the tweeters and hear if there is any difference and vice versa (slightly beneath the t.v/projector).

Its all about playing around with the available placement options you have and see what yields the best performance. There is no correct answer. There are always trade-offs (well most of the time)

Adrian, if material which should be imaged in the center is presently coming from a bit to the right of center, that would indicate that the level calibration needs further adjustment to make the left main louder with respect to the right. If two separated speakers play the same sound at exactly the same level(as heard at the listening position)the sound should appear to come from directly between them for someone sitting directly between them. The image would move to the left or right with the listener if he wasn't directly between them.

John, at the moment I am running the M80s in stereo. The left speaker doesn't have a wall behind it which may not give it as much bass support but I don't think it's too noticeable.

When I auditioned other speakers(not in my house) I also found that the speakers I was listening to, seemed to also image slightly to the right of centre using the same material as I tried on my 80s. This led me to believe that possibly the material was recorded like that(the other speakers were Monitor Audio RS6/8 and both Paradigm Studio 100s and Monitor 11s). Could it be, that is the way it is recorded? or maybe it's just the way I hear things.

It's not a problem to boost the left side slightly when I get all the speakers connected(Banana plugs on order), just seems strange that when listening to the same material on other speakers, the singer's voice comes from right centre, in two channel that is.

Well, to test whether it's a matter of speaker level imbalance or that the material is intended to be heard as slightly off-center, use mono mode. The sound in mono should definitely come from dead-center when levels are calibrated to be equal at the listening position.

Adrian, not sure if you have seen my setup on here but I have my center basically right against the ceiling ~8' off the ground and the M80s are, of course, on the ground. I notice no ill effects and have a great soundstage. Dialogue is nicely centered on the screen. I think it comes down to placement and aiming to achieve what you are looking for.

I think it all has something to do with that brain cell discussion we had a while ago .

I had my center channel above my TV for almost 10 years and ever since my recent purchase of my Sammy it's sitting below the TV and I find it to be a much better placement. I would love to get it off the table and mount it just below the TV but I don't know where to start looking other than omnimount. If you guys could help me out also it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance.
Cam

You know Jay, I'll be willing to bet a 40" Sammy would fit nice between the mantle and the VP150 there.

The volume is only one factor - a big one - but not the sole factor. The reflections play a large role as well. If the first order reflection is close in time, you end up with a virtual driver (sound source) to right of the main speakers. So instead of the image centered between 2, it is centered across the three speakers, with the third (virtual) speaker being played at a lower level and not in time phase with the other two.

From Adrian's description of his room, I think this is the problem. His boundaries are not equal, and that will pull the image around and force it to move as frequencies change. I lived through this in my last room. I think this article had some useful info on same. If not in this article, check his other articles. Hodas

Actually Adrian, I have my eye on a 58" Panny, I have to remove the shelf and ceiling mount the VP150 to make it fit. I am just waiting for the 36" 9 yr old Panny to die first, the front panel controls on it are already dead, I can only operate it with the remote .

My decision to place the center channel above the TV was based on science and research.

I realized that if I put the speaker below the screen, my dog would often stand in front of it (research) and absorb the highs (science) therefore causing me to suffer decreased intelligibility of dialog.

Mark, have you considered telling the dog to "stay" in the corner, and use him as a bass trap?

Actually, I've often encouraged his "woof" as a second bass source, but I can't get him to do in sync with Darla tapping the damn fishbowl...

Ha! Ha! a different type of "woofer".

Hey Adrian,

As others have pointed out, center-channel placement always comes down to performance and freedom from audible coloration. In my case (a 50-inch DLP Samsung rear-pro), my center sounded much better on top of the Samsung than below it. I had to buy a rickety shelf to position the center above the TV. It looks stupid, but it sounds good.

Actually, in my experiments with center-channel placement and listening tests, the center sounded best of all on its own dedicated stand out from the TV and free of any boundary effects. But that's not practical in my room, or in most rooms.

So you accommodate to what is practical and what sounds reasonably good.

Regards,

I'm thinking I'll try the centre over top of the TV as this will give me shelf space for my AVR/BD/Cable box on the stand underneath. The VP150 will fit on the lower shelf but would have to share it with the AVR so it would end up off centre(not good). I might have to consider a taller stand as an alternative as the 2nd shelf on my present one is seriously lacking in height.

I know it's come up many times in the forum, but I did a search and couldn't find anything on a VP150 wall mount. If you guys could please help me out with a couple different suggestions it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
Cam

It should be noted that some older VP150's (like mine) are *NOT* able to be mounted upside down, due to the fact that the mounting hole does not line up with the FMS-CC.

Now if you just have it on a shelf, by all means! Flip it over and flip the grille cover so it looks nice

- D

Cam many have used the FMB for the VP150, it works very well.

Wouldn’t just mounting a small shelf work for most people?

I've done that in the past Dean, most home stores have several types in the $10-20 range. A $15 shelf and a pair of wedge door stops should put you in business.

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I will take both into consideration; I do like the shelf idea, especially if I can find a dark glass one to match my component shelving unit.