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#406005 - 07/08/14 03:23 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: JBG]
casey01 Offline
aficionado

Registered: 07/03/08
Posts: 764
Loc: Toronto
Originally Posted By: JBG
Here are my results after a last attempt of calibration with the Anthem ARC for the ep500 sub, First off if you have ARC, never use the same settings for movies as for music, this means doing 2 x 5 position test, this said, with the volume on the ep500 v4 at 12 o'clock I finally have some decent bass (passed the angry wife on second floor test). I was going to pull the trigger on a seaton submersive HP, now I'm confused if I'm going to keep this sub or not or ad a second sub, these rusults having me re-think my setup a bit, I have some space to put only 1 ep800 up front (tight fit next to the m100) along with the ep500 hummmm....



I believe the bottom line is that you are experiencing the issues and limitations of sub eq's which, depending on your room, can make things more complicated than they should be. For a few years now, I have incorporated in to my system(with 4 subs) a dedicated Velodyne SMS-1 digtal sub eq which has been on the market for awhile now yet offers on-screen programming,multiple set-ups, moveable parametric adjustment from 15-200HZ and both Auto and Manual memories with adjustment capability on the fly. Of course, the ultimate goal with any of these calibration devices is to achieve as flat a frequency response as possible in your room. The problem is, when all is said and done, you may not like what you hear.

In the beginning when I did the Auto set-up(which shows on-screen in real time) it showed a reasonably flat response. When I did the calibration manually, I was able to tweak a few adjustments so the on-screen graphs were even more precise. The trouble was, when the calibration was complete and I did some critical listening, I didn't like the sound. The accurate flat response in my room had the 30HZ and higher frequencies mask much of the frequency below that level which wasn't to my taste so I ended up lowering the middle frequencies and slightly boosting the bottom end which is now to my taste and suits every musical or movie circumstance.

Bottom line? Technical accuracy may not be what you like. Ultimately, let your ears determine the final outcome.

Top
#406007 - 07/08/14 06:10 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: casey01]
Nick B Offline
devotee

Registered: 08/05/06
Posts: 492
Originally Posted By: casey01
Originally Posted By: JBG
Here are my results after a last attempt of calibration with the Anthem ARC for the ep500 sub, First off if you have ARC, never use the same settings for movies as for music, this means doing 2 x 5 position test, this said, with the volume on the ep500 v4 at 12 o'clock I finally have some decent bass (passed the angry wife on second floor test). I was going to pull the trigger on a seaton submersive HP, now I'm confused if I'm going to keep this sub or not or ad a second sub, these rusults having me re-think my setup a bit, I have some space to put only 1 ep800 up front (tight fit next to the m100) along with the ep500 hummmm....



I believe the bottom line is that you are experiencing the issues and limitations of sub eq's which, depending on your room, can make things more complicated than they should be. For a few years now, I have incorporated in to my system(with 4 subs) a dedicated Velodyne SMS-1 digtal sub eq which has been on the market for awhile now yet offers on-screen programming,multiple set-ups, moveable parametric adjustment from 15-200HZ and both Auto and Manual memories with adjustment capability on the fly. Of course, the ultimate goal with any of these calibration devices is to achieve as flat a frequency response as possible in your room. The problem is, when all is said and done, you may not like what you hear.

In the beginning when I did the Auto set-up(which shows on-screen in real time) it showed a reasonably flat response. When I did the calibration manually, I was able to tweak a few adjustments so the on-screen graphs were even more precise. The trouble was, when the calibration was complete and I did some critical listening, I didn't like the sound. The accurate flat response in my room had the 30HZ and higher frequencies mask much of the frequency below that level which wasn't to my taste so I ended up lowering the middle frequencies and slightly boosting the bottom end which is now to my taste and suits every musical or movie circumstance.

Bottom line? Technical accuracy may not be what you like. Ultimately, let your ears determine the final outcome.


You and most other folks probably would not like a flat frequency response in the bass region and up unless you are listening to it at reference levels (around 85 dB), which is very uncomfortable. When it is quieter then that is is much harder to hear lower frequencies, which is why you prefer the boosted bottom end. Programs like Audyssey Dynamic Eq are designed to compensate for this change in how we per-sieve sounds as the volume level changes. This seems like the best solution, so that as we change the volume we don't have to change the EQ to our tastes. Dynamic Eq is definitely something I will get in my next receiver/processor.

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#406013 - 07/09/14 02:45 AM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: TroyD]
exlabdriver Offline
aficionado

Registered: 09/07/11
Posts: 999
well, I talked my wife into unboxing our first EP800 tonight. Despite its size & weight, it was relatively easy as we were able to slide it on a bath towel along our shiny laminate floor. Carpeting would have been another matter.

Firstly, the cabinet is gorgeous & flawless. Easily connected & I fired it up (not calibrated yet) & played some Clapton on DVD through it at about half volume & up to -15 Db on my AVR. Sounded clean, accurate & very musical. As a test, I turned on my remaining Velo & it was not apparent at all.

Here are some pics of new on the left & old on the right. I resurrected my old DIY stands for the M22s until I can get a real set from Axiom. 'Beast' #2 is scheduled to arrive on Friday.





TAM

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#406020 - 07/09/14 12:33 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: TroyD]
JBG Offline
devotee

Registered: 06/14/02
Posts: 405
Ended up returning the ep500 V4 and gettting a new 15'' ported sub in the next couple of days... hopefully this will be the one that will work for me.

Top
#406022 - 07/09/14 06:34 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: JBG]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1181
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Originally Posted By: JBG
Ended up returning the ep500 V4 and gettting a new 15'' ported sub in the next couple of days... hopefully this will be the one that will work for me.


I get it. I like sealed ok for music but HT is a different story IMHO. Plenty out there to choose from. Hope you find one that suits your tastes.GL


Like they say , There's no replacement for displacement!!!
Richard


Edited by Socketman (07/09/14 06:35 PM)
_________________________
DOG is GOD spelled backwards.
I blame my terseness on my keyboard. smile

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#406024 - 07/09/14 08:44 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: Socketman]
JBG Offline
devotee

Registered: 06/14/02
Posts: 405
Originally Posted By: Socketman
Originally Posted By: JBG
Ended up returning the ep500 V4 and gettting a new 15'' ported sub in the next couple of days... hopefully this will be the one that will work for me.


I get it. I like sealed ok for music but HT is a different story IMHO. Plenty out there to choose from. Hope you find one that suits your tastes.GL


Like they say , There's no replacement for displacement!!!
Richard


since I listen to 90% movies and I just didn't feel the bass like my old 15'' klipsch. My opinion the new ep500 is more suited for a musical application, a 12'' simply can't reproduce what a 15'' can but at the end I guess it comes down to personal tastes, so now I went back to the ported 15'' route, will be starting with one sub and if it works out I'll have a dual setup in no-time. going to recieve the sub & know this monday!!!

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#406038 - 07/10/14 01:35 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: TroyD]
exlabdriver Offline
aficionado

Registered: 09/07/11
Posts: 999
Well I spent most of yesterday in the horizontal position recovering from my second cataract surgery, so I took advantage of this 'down' time to audition my first EP800 with music. I won't run any movies until the second one is setup & Audyssey is run.

I watched (as best that I could with an eye patch) a couple of high quality, live concerts - Clapton/Winwood & Sade. The single EP800 was superbly powerful, accurate & musical; however, what was most impressive was a multi-channel SACD of Spyro Gyra that is recorded & mixed in an outstanding manner. This fusion jazz album contains huge dynamics & percussion with lots of low freq Upright & Electric Bass in the mix.

I can't imagine how scary the addition of the second one will be in my room when it arrives tomorrow. Interestingly, my M22s & VP160 are easily blended with this monster.

BTW, I can see even better this morning, ha!. I'm expecting 20/20 in both eyes shortly...

TAM

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#406039 - 07/10/14 01:45 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: TroyD]
MarkSJohnson Online   happy
shareholder in the making

Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 10848
Loc: Central NH
Excellent news about your eyes and your ears, TAM!
_________________________
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::

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#406105 - 07/13/14 04:22 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: TroyD]
JBG Offline
devotee

Registered: 06/14/02
Posts: 405
picked up a psa xv15 amp and even with exchange rate, shipping and the taxes, this sub is the best bang for the buck... I finally got the bass I was looking for. I will most likely get a second one. Cs reminds me when Axiom started up.

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#406152 - 07/14/14 11:01 PM Re: Dual/triple SUb Choice [Re: TroyD]
exlabdriver Offline
aficionado

Registered: 09/07/11
Posts: 999
Second EP800 arrived all OK - no damage at all. Again, this is a magnificent looking box in HG Rosewood that is flawless.

I fired it up & played some dynamic fusion - Spyro Gyra again. All I can say is that two of these beasts is most impressive.

Pic shows a little more balance in my room now:



Note my reflection in the screen - kind of a selfie, ha!

TAM


Edited by exlabdriver (07/14/14 11:02 PM)

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