Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Help picking my speakers

Room is 15x13x10
Listening 80%tv/movies 20%music
I listen to all ranges of music but more Bluegrass, Alternative, Rock, and Eletronic in that order.

Here is what I have in mind to match my new Pioneer 1015TX receiver:

Front: M40's or M50's (leaning to the m40's)
Center: VP100
Rear: M2i or QS4 (leaning to the M2i)
Sub: EP175 or other brand or none for now.

Questions:
From what I have read on these forums, the M50's sound a bit more forward. What does that mean?

Thoughts on this setup?

I havent heard the 40s or 50s, but I have heard the M22s and those paired with the QS4s and VP100 will flat out ROCK that room size.
If you do go with the 22s you will need a sub. Of course in my opinion you would need a sub for any of the speakers you choose.
Good Luck

Listen to John, and others, when they chime in-Johns got the speil down pat. However since I'm the one that said they were "foreward" I'll start off.

I'll start off with Hi, sunny_z, and welcome!

What "I" meant by "Foreward" as relates to the M50; I mean "where" in relation to the soundstage is the main vocalist; does it seem like the singer is way up-front, like you're on stage with him or her. Or, are you sitting in the back row of the theater, in a far Laid-back speaker.

There are certainly other ways of saying it, but that basically works for me.

The "Laid-back" speakers in the Axiom line are the M3, the M40 and the M50. The only two of these I'm familiar with are the M3s and the M50s. In my experence, the M3, though refered to as Laid-back, gives a presentation where the performer is(to me)at the plane of the TV. Kind of like sitting in the second or third row! The M50, on the other hand, to "me" seems to place the performer about a "foot" in front of the TV. Now it's like sitting in the 1st or 2nd row! Again, this is just my interpretation, out of many interpretations!!

So the M50 is more foreward, to me, than the M3s, but if the M50 is near the "front row" then I can't imagine it should be refered to as a laid-back speaker other than in relation to the other Axiom speakers of the M2 M22 M60 and M80 variety!

That only touches on my take on the "foreward" issue. There are others who will pop-in soon, if not "Now" with the rest of the story.

Again, Welcome to the forum!!
Rich.

hmm. I had considered the M22's but figured since you need stands, that the better buy would be the M40s/M50s.....wrong?

From "Describing Loudspeaker Sound."

"Forward" indicates that vocals, male and female, tend to be very present, almost as if the singer were standing in front of the plain of the speakers. It can be a negative term, too--if singers sound too close up it may mean the midrange is boosted or exaggerated. The opposite is "recessed," which means that midrange sounds like singers and choruses seem to be farther back, a bit distant-sounding and well behind the plain of the speakers.

I don't know if the M40, M50 owners would describe them as "forward" but they have the reputation of NOT being as forward as the M2/M22/M60/M80 line, due to a slight bump in the lower portion of the frequency response curve. Regardless, you will not find Any Axiom speaker "muddy," or "muffled and, being very accurate speakers, they will expose a poorly mixed or mastered CD.

If your ratio of movies to music is correct, I'd definitely recommend the QS4s for surrounds. They are fabulous surround speakers for movies, and no slouches when it comes to music.

I agree with Bray, the M22s would be real good in a room that size, but that doesn't mean the M40s or M50s would be bad, either. With the M22s being bookshelf speakers, when considering the cost, you should add in the price of stands.

I also agree that, regardless of your choice, being a movie watcher, a sub is a necessity.

If you go with the Axiom stands yes.
However there are many lower cost stands that work well for the M22s.
When I had M22s, I put them on ($12.00 each) Target cd racks that worked very well and looked good too.
Here is a pic

The chrome cd racks on either side of the TV were used as stands, and fit the 22s perfectly and were very stable. They are 23 inches tall.
I dont know if they are still available at Target, but I have seen many different stands that would work for much less $$$.

"hmm. I had considered the M22's but figured since you need stands, that the better buy would be the M40s/M50s.....wrong?"

I would agree with that - and I own M22s. I really like having towers up front in my home theater just because they push more air and do a better job with the low end so the big crash/explosion/etc. scenes in movies are more dramatic. There are some (and probably rightfully so) here that will tell you that the M22s are a great choice - and they are very good speakers.

But I would still stick with M50 > M40 > M22 plus stands unless someone can give you some objective data to the contrary.

I figure that's why they put numbers on the speakers... so my second grader could do the math and decide which one to buy...

Whatever you do, get a sub, it adds so much to movie enjoyment. Your room is about the same volume as mine, but I went larger system now instead of later.

I suppose I should say something here, since I've had both the M22s and the M50s. I listened to each, with the M22s stacked atop the 50s. I didn't find the 50s to be forward at all. The 22s, on the other hand are. Initially, they sounded real close to one another. After a couple weeks the minor differences seemed to grow and the 22s seemed to overtake them. I did find that the midrange of the M50s sound a hair muddier than the 22s, but the M50s were an easier listen. They are a really pleasant sounding speaker and they do bass really nice. The M22s, on the other hand are what I would call the ultimate when it comes to detail and they possess a 3D sound quality which is absent from the M50s. I ended up keeping the M22s. Why, you might ask? It was the superior soundstage which sealed the deal. The M22s have a better midrange, wheras the M50s do bass better. It is true the M22s are more forward. Some have said they are slightly more forward, but to my ears the difference isn't slight.

If you have a Paradigm dealer near you, give a listen to some Monitor 7s and then listen to a pair of studio 20s. I think these are close to a M50/M22 comparison.

Hi guys! Clarification time!!

When I commented on the M50 as being at all "foreward", I really meant it to be in relation to the M3 only. I don't know if there is a really good definition for the term "neutral" as relates to foreward or(ok; "recessed")but it seems to me that the M3 is pretty close to what "I" would consider sort of middle of the road.

Anyway, "foreward to the M3 only"
Rich.

OK. well I did get to hear pair of the Monitor 7 v3. They did sound dam good so now i'm a bit torn. But, I've also decided if i go with Axiom to get the Epic 50 package.

So has anyone hear the Monitor 7's and the M50s?

Peter (pmbuko) upgraded from Monitor 9s v2 to M22s. Yes, upgrade. The M22s are light years ahead of the Monitor 9s, and I'd say that 50s are just as good as 22s, although in slightly different ways. That said, I've not heard the v3s. Oh yeah, and when we compared Monitor 9s to Monitor 7s, the 9s were better than the 7s.

SOLD!

50M
VP00
QS4

Thanks for the advice.

I wasn't impressed with the reviews of the EP175 sub, so i'm looking at some others. The SVS: PB10-ISD has caught my eye.

Velcome to my vorld, my son... Muah ha ha ha!

the PB-10 is supposed to be a great entry level sub in the $400 range.. also look at the HSU STF-2. its no slouch either.

bigjohn

What we have here, ladies and gentlemen, is a new member of the M50 club. Congrats, SZ, on your choice.

Ken,

I meant no disrespect to the venerable M50. I had to choose between the 22s and the 50s and the 22s won, in my opinion, by a nose.

i am building an HT system for a friend, and he just purchased a pair of M22's, and a VP100 center. they should be here early next week.. i am very excited to see what they are gonna sound like.

bigjohn

We in the M50 comunity understand, Bruce, no offence taken. Besides, we(sob)get plenty of disrespect from lots of folks who "really" MEAN IT!!

Oh, and Yes! sunny z, velcome!!
Rich.

No worries, man... Probably half the reason I like to say the M50s are better is because I own them!

I was real close to being a M50 hootchie kootchie man myself. If the M22s hadn't come into the picture first, I would be in the club. I have got to stop listening to DTVs blues station while I'm typing.