Yeah, I cleverly changed her name.

In case you were unaware, I'm currently in pursuit of an unavailable girl, and it's not even Regina Spektor! She's sweet, she's funny, beautiful (I'll admit it), and she likes to hang out with me. Now of course that may be just because I seem like a non-threat, but my huge ego would like to believe it's because there's a connection that could turn into something more substantial.

Then there's the guy she's dating. It's a little worrying that she started dating him to begin with. He's 27 or so, lives at home, doesn't have a car (neither do I, but out of choice, not because I totaled it), and he just had a child with an ex in February--a child he has yet to meet. None of these things can tell the whole story, of course. However, after meeting him, I'm at a loss for what's causing the attraction. He's not attractive, and apparently he's even told her that he's glad he has her, as now he doesn't have to try to be attractive anymore. A true romantic. Not only that, but he was completely cold to me the one time we met, even though I went out of my way to be nice.

I know this girl through a coworker. They're best friends, and my coworker has ColLAIRE come in and join us for dinner usually at least a couple of times a week. It used to be that we had her bring food in for us--that was the excuse--but now we just have her come in to hang out with us. Anyway, my coworker is dating this guy, let's call him WoWboy, and it's his best friend that ColLAIRE is dating, so it's two best friends dating two best friends. Insurmountable? Maybe. I mostly hear complaints about the guy. My coworker says that he's always hanging out at her apartment (which she shares with her boyfriend), and he helps himself to her food, never offering to reimburse or replace. Not only does she buy extra groceries just because she knows he's going to eat it, but he leaves messes around the apartment, too. This is my competition?

I guess that's the worst thing. He gets to date the coolest girl in the world, and he doesn't even have to put forth any effort. How do I compete with that?

I've simply been trying to enjoy my time with her and see if anything develops, despite the circumstances. Besides her coming in for dinner, we've gone to comedy night twice, they've come over for a movie twice, and we went for a walk once. The only time her boyfriend was along was for pho.

I'm scared that I'm getting further and further into the "friend zone," but I'm still torn between what to do. On one hand, it would be nice to put up a fight for once. On the other hand, this is a decision she's made, and I feel like I should respect it. If she likes me enough, she should break it off with him on her own. But then, saying nothing is just going to lead to regret. This is the spin cycle I'm in right now. I suppose the only way I'll respect myself is to talk to her about it and see what happens. I'm taking my time weighing how important self-respect is.

I really like her!

Now that you're up to speed on the basics, I'll tell you about her birthday, which was the 28th. She likes to read, so I looked through my collection of books trying to find something she might also like. It became painfully apparent that all of my favorite reading is geared towards adolescent males. She has said she reads anything that's around, and when she came over for a movie the first time, she pointed out Ender's Game, saying she liked it, and Ranma 1/2, saying nothing about it, but I get the sense she at least had an interest in it. I decided to give her a copy of I Was a Teen-Age Dwarf by Max Shulman, which is a book based around the character, Dobie Gillis. It's a light, fun read, and I figured its goofiness might fit her well. Also, giving her something I already owned wouldn't be too awkward of a gift (I actually bought her the copy I gave her, as I wanted one in a little better condition, but don't tell her that).

I needed a way to wrap the gift, so I took advantage of the Shout Box here, and Sean came to my rescue, suggesting aluminum foil. I almost always enjoy what I find in aluminum foil, so I had to take his suggestion and run with it. However, it was still obviously a book, so I decided to put it in a Ziploc bag covered with duct tape. Scary? Maybe. I didn't have any duct tape, so I had to borrow something from my dad. Thankfully, he had aluminum foil tape, which went along well with the aluminum foil, and I thought it looked better than duct tape would have, too. At first I was going to pretend that NASA had planned on launching it into deep space to let an alien culture enjoy our literature, but the mission was scrapped, and I was able to buy it at their annual yard sale. After getting to work with it and seeing the refrigerator, though, I decided to throw it in the freezer. I thought it would be funny to give it to her nice and cold and explain that it had been sent hurtling forward through time, Back to the Future style, and that's why it was iced over. I didn't have the opportunity to give it to her myself, but my coworker took it home and put it in her own freezer, and she gave it to Collaire the next morning.

Apparently she thought it was funny, and was fascinated with the Ziploc bag. My coworker said she went so far as to say I'm awesome. I'm looking forward to seeing her again, as I don't know if she knew what was up with the pressed "flower" that I put in the card.

Back on Valentine's Day, when she came in to join us for dinner, she made me a flower out of a paper napkin, which turned out really horribly. She said she wouldn't be offended if I threw it out. Naturally, I held onto it. I figured it would be funny to give back to her at some point, and this was the perfect opportunity. I simply said in the card that someone gave me this beautiful flower (aka abused napkin) once, and I thought it was appropriate to pass it on to her.

I don't know what's going to happen with all of this, but it's nice to know I can still like someone so much. If it was up to me, I'd see her every day. Here's hoping she's not already just thinking of me as a brother.

That's all for now! Finally!

Sounds like your guys get along well. Time for the next step?

I'm glad I'm married, that sounds like way too much effort now.

Though I suppose some people (not me of course) would say that shuttling the constant stream of subwoofers in and out of your house sounds like way too much effort.... :p

Charles,

It is inexplicable why women choose guys such as the loser Claire has chosen. If your feelings about her are as strong as I've interpreted them, you owe it to yourself to not give up on her.

The dreaded "friend" status is a death knell--stay away from this at all costs. As much as you want to tell Claire your true feelings for her, causing her to choose between you and her current boyfriend, let's first work on uping your stock. To put it simply, make her want to choose you.

I have no idea how your personal interactions with her go, but if I've read your description right, you're slipping into that safe "friend" zone where you like each other well enough, but there is no tension (at least on her part). You need to work on creating some sparks between the two of you to let her know that you are desireable.

It's a bit of a project, but you can do it. You don't want to spill your feelings for her only to be rejected because she is suddenly overwhelmed. Work on building up the right kind of relationship (more romance, less friend) and then break the news to her and put yourself in a better position.

And, Charles, I'm not saying you have to do this stuff, and by no means am I a relationship guru, but I've been sucked into that friend trap before. There is nothing worse than being friends with a girl you really like only to have her confide in you all her relationship details with another guy. Especially when you want to be that guy.

I'll get my people on it.

Charles,

If my wife read this she would probably get all teary eyed.

One thing I've learned in the 50 odd years I've been around (and yes we do know more with age) is that you need to live your life with as few regrets as possible, especially when it comes to affairs of the heart.

I'll agree with Sean that you don't want to overwhelm her, but it seems to me that she has to have more than a minor interest if she's spending that much time with you. I say strike while the iron is hot and before she develops to much of a relationship with the other guy. Just my 2 cents.

Indeed! Disapointments and failures you can recover from, regrets linger.

I make a third vote.

myrison, moving subs around is only physical not the mental and emotional stress that goes along with the dating game, I'll take the subs anyday, although these 150+lbs boxes are starting to push the limits.

Tell her how you feel! Ask her out on a real "date"! But I agree with the others, don't drop bombs on her too fast. Sounds like you've been doing fine so far. Hopefully she will get a clue and know of the attraction that you have for her. Then, if she has good judgment, she'll dump loser guy.

I read "don't drop boobs on her too fast."

Only after the third date.



I think.

Charles,

I know this will sound a little "high schoolish", but why not ask her to a dance? Nothing turns on a person more than dancing, as you can get intimate with each other without feeling awkward. Just be clear it's only going to be the two of you.

Although, I could be completely off base on this, as I met my wife back in high school. "Rusty" doesn't even begin to cover it........

Don't sweat it.....if it's meant to be, it will all unfold naturally. If not, remember: "There's a lid for every pot".

Thanks for the feedback, guys. It's nice to talk about it a little before vaulting myself over the point of no return.

She came in to dinner break again, and she brought Baskin-Robbins ice cream for us, since they had their 31 cent scoop special tonight. I was going to get some more after work, but the line was outside the Baskin-Robbins quite a ways.

But yeah, every time I see her it reminds me I wasn't being sarcastic... I really do like her. She thanked me directly for the birthday present. She said it was very unique, and the smile on her face seemed genuine enough that I didn't accuse her of hating the gift. I don't know how someone can glow like she does. She must be absorbing the energy from my brain.

Anyway, I think she's going to go for me when I tell her I like her. I just have that feeling. I'll have to start advertising the power of aluminum foil at that point.

Just don't start wearing the aluminum foil pyramid hat too soon into the relationship .

Instead, stick to aluminum foil underwear. Consider this, would it really be a bad thing if she found out on her own? Hmmmmmmmmmmm. . .

And there is your opportunity. Take her out to dinner to repay her for her kindness. Not so much preasure that way and it leaves you with several options depending on how the evening goes.

As for the tinfoil, its much too late for that. She's already sucked all the energy out of your brain. You're hardly making sense...

When I found out I was really bad at the whole rigamorol of how to effectively feint, and bob, and duck, and weave through the beginnings of a relationship - the courting ritual - I countered with the absolute most backward tactic... complete honesty.

Sonuvabee... if that hasn't worked for me ever since.

Then again, I'm as charismatic as David Hasselhoff and cute as a baby lamb, your mileage may vary.

Bren R.

I'm thinking complete honesty is the way I'll have to go, torpedoes be damned. It's a straight line to what I want to find out, and then I can stop taking up message board space with my near-love life.

Let me just specify that complete honesty is "you know... I'm really liking spending time with you, I'd like a chance to do it more", not "I collect your hair that falls out and tape it to my pillow and spoon it all night"...

... just so we're clear.

Admiration is flattering... criminal infatuation is scary.

Bren R.

Hey, I failed the psychopath test, so that's one thing going for me.

I know I present myself online with exaggerated dimensions, but in person I'm fairly reserved. I'm pretty sure I can manage to not be scary.

Now there's a conversation opener.

See, I know how to communicate the pertinent details!

Maybe I should mail you a letter on my letterhead that gives you a certification of sanity...

Talk about a chick magnet, whoo-eee! Nothing gets 'em hot like a letter from your psychiatrist!

I like it.

"Hey, baby. I failed the psychopath test, and I've got tin foil underwear. Wanna go out?"

Yeah, CV, just send me Claire's email address and I'll fill her in...

Hmm hmm, I bet you'll try all right....

Seriously CV, just make sure you don't go too fast or come on too strong. You don't want to potentially ruin two couples that are best friends, as well as what at least for now is a good friendship with her. The best of all possibilities would be for her to choose you, albeit with a little nudging from you.

You know, I was trying to avoid using her name so it would be just SLIGHTLY harder to do a simple Google search and find this thread. Ha ha. Oh, well. I'm sure she won't be searching for me online, anyway, since she already has the flesh-and-blood version.

Shh, I'm waiting to see if he'll fall for i --OH! HI CHARLES!! um, what are you doing here? heh heh...

D'OH!!! Sorry CV, forgot not to mention Co-laire by name. My most sincere apologies.

Now, about that email address - I've just about got your letter typed up ...

Oh, it'll be fine. I won't come on too strong, but I don't want to leave any doubt about my interest, either. It'll work out, even if I don't get to date her. The world is full of fish I'll never catch, but maybe that's for the better. I should just enjoy it as an aquarium, as in look, but don't touch. Just kidding. Now where's my net?

Hmm, the thought of her reading these things is interesting. She would see you have a charitable spirit with your gifts of CDs/DVDs/Blu-rays/games etc, and she would see you in your element with your homies, i.e. as a funny, personable guy.

I'm not sure what her reaction would be!

Hopefully a nice and understanding one, although my wife thinks I'm a dork for all this board activity. Must be a guy thing. Other than Amie and Sonicfox, there's zip for estrogen here (unless you count my man-boobs).

Another belly-laugh reading your posts! Sure you're not self-medicating?

BTW, nice play on "The Colbert Report".

Hey, her boyfriend is actually good for something! I was hating him in my mind today, and I came up with "out of shape with puked features," so I used it as the start of my new story:

the mental imagery formed after these statements are beyond all comprehension

CV, was that like "Mentos, the Fresh-maker"?

Good one!

{bump}

Ha, women do like a good soap opera, huh?!

Men too! Count me in.

CV shouted a few days ago that Collaire's boyfriend, sadly, appeared to be stepping up his game, tuning in a little more. CV was undaunted and enjoying ongoing, frequent, and casual contacts with Collaire anyway.

CV, report, please!

Oh man - I'll have to go check the 'roll' for the shoutbox update. I knew I should have it summarized and emailed to me!

I've been trying not to interfere, but Ian won me away from a rival with a big gesture and I can't help but think that's the route to go. The other guy seems like a nester, we need to take action before he nests with our Collaire! "Faint heart never won fair lady", after all!

I bet he held a VP150 over his head and blasted "In Your Eyes" through your bedroom window, am I right?!

Here is the video evidence!

LOL! No, but it did involve making my own custom model loudspeakers completed with personalized silk-screened labels. That's pretty manly, to put it all on the line with your silk-screener and your woodcutter and your speaker finisher. <opinion> Don't you think CV could employ this same tactic with an illustrated novel? </opinion>

Totally. Ladies love guys with a sense of humor.

And big woofers, so to speak.

Maybe it should be a children's book. That sounds less daunting than an illustrated novel.

Yeah, nothing new to report at the moment. I probably won't see her again until next week. She and my coworker are heading out of town tomorrow, and I'm not sure she'll be in for dinner tonight. I would of course inform you all if something major went down.

Ah, the different personalities...

Medic8r gives a basic outline of the human nature of love and attraction.

Amie likes the romanticism of this Bridges of Richland County story.

And it's all I can do to not pass along my favorite pick-up line "Does this rag smell like ether to you?"

Bren R.

Has that actually worked for you?

When things get tough I always revert to the ole duct tape and rope routine. Works every time.

Fact #1 - I have not been appreciably single since I was about 14 (I'm sure that says something about me, Medic8r?)

Fact #2 - Look at me. I'm not exactly the prettiest little bunny in the briarpatch.

You do the math.

Bren R.

So I went to see Iron Man with my coworker and her boyfriend tonight, and Collaire and her boyfriend ended up coming, too. Collaire (I'm going to get tired of using that dumb name--ha ha) said hi right away and said she finished reading the book I gave her for her birthday. I know it's a light, quick read, but I honestly didn't know if she'd read it at all. I asked her if she liked it. "I was entertained," she said. She was smiling pretty big, but she always does that, so it's hard to take it seriously. Still, I'll take acting over no reaction, and who's to say it wasn't genuine?

I liked the movie well enough. I definitely want a suit, as does my coworker. She was mentioning it on the way home, and I told her that she would need two of the arc reactors, one for each breast. She agreed.

All of the stuff they play before the previews even start was getting on my coworker's boyfriend's nerves. "I'm going to go to the bathroom and kill myself," he said. "Don't forget to flush," I reminded him. I know, I'm hilarious. I guess it's not just him who kills himself.

Toilet jokes are a good way to end, so we'll call that good.

And believe me, one thing we have alot of in Winnipeg aside from the deer, is bunnies.

Friday night I watched a movie with my wife whose name (the movies name, smart-guy!!) I have already blocked out of my mind in self defense of my manhood, but hey, she was a sport and saw Iron Man with me so it was only fair.

Actually, it wasn't all that bad. It had some sharp humor in between the depressing, then uplifting, then back to depressing roller coaster of a plot that women seem to enjoy so much. Including one line that I think that applies nicely to your predicament.

The main female character answers the question to one of life's oldest and great mysteries when questioned on "What do women want from men?"

I can't remember her exact words but the gist of it was, "Truthfully, the secret is.....we don't know!"

I think in my case they want friendship. Buckets and buckets of friendship. Ha ha.

Today she said she genuinely liked the book I gave her, that she managed to read it even though she was busy with other stuff, and that it was funny. So I'm glad. Claire and Tiana (my coworker, and yes, I'm using real names now) were talking about going to see The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian. Claire turned to me and said, "Do you want to go?" Cool, right? No, she was just inviting me to go along with the group, which includes her boyfriend.

Not that I'm giving up. I still need to speak up for myself and see where that takes me.

While at the movie, lean over to the boyfriend and say, "I need to go to the bathroom. Let's go." After he gets to the bathroom with you (don't worry, he'll accompany you. All guys like group bathroom trips) tell him you dropped your wallet in the toilet. When he leans in for a closer look, push him in, and give the toilet a good couple of flushes. Bye bye boyfriend.

Problem solved.

Ummm, I forget. Just how did you do on that Psychopath test again?

Our Sean, he's always so helpful!

At least he knows how to get rid of a turd.

ba domp psht!

Comic relief, always welcome.

DEAD THREAD.

Not really, but I couldn't seem to find the nerve to impose on an existing relationship, and after I found myself resenting her slightly for sticking with a goober, I decided to let it go.

I still enjoy her company, but I think I've effectively wrestled my heart into submission. Tiana complained to me once again about how much Claire's boyfriend sucks, and I didn't really feel much at all. I just agreed that his behavior was BS (he was mad at Claire for making them slightly late to Prince Caspian--I don't see how he has any right to have an attitude when she's the one driving him around everywhere... and seriously, mad over Prince Caspian?), and that was it.

If the relationship unravels, maybe my feelings will kick back in, but for now I think I'm fine just being her friend.

I'm excited about the Zzang candy bars that zhimbo recommended in the candy bar thread. I ordered 10 of them so I could share the experience with friends. They should get here Wednesday, so I'll take them in to work on Thursday, and in addition to some of my coworkers, Claire's coming in to try one. Don't worry. I'll make her eat the whole thing in front of me so I know that none of it goes to her boyfriend. Ha ha.

The soap opera is losing its suds. Is that the fat lady singing in the shower?

Quitter.

As a friend of mine once said "yeah, she's got a boyfriend, but that's only because she hasn't met me!"

Bren R.

I also enjoy watching beautiful ladies eating things in front of me.

Thats really a shame given how you really feel. In the end, if you go for it and she turns you down, you are no further behind than you are right now. If she feels anything for you, and she does, she will, at least be tempted, and there is the very real possibility that she will take a chance on you.

To put it another way, you have nothing to loose and a LOT to gain.

To put it another way, you fear the wrong thing: her rejecting you. What you should fear is that you will not have another opportunity to approach her.

I'll shut up now.

Go, Pep Talk Fred, go!!!

I appreciate the feedback. I still don't know exactly where I'm going to land. I seem to change my mind from one day to the next, and it seems like it depend on whether it's a day I've seen her or not. It's a lot easier to decide to let her go when she's not right there in front of me turning my heart to hearty soup.

It still feels like Tiana is trying to feel me out regarding Claire, and I'm still giving nothing back. I have this feeling that I actually would have a chance if I'd give enough of a signal that I'm interested in Claire beyond friendship. But if that's what it takes, I'm not sure I'm game. I always come back to, "Well, if she likes me enough, she'll make herself available." I'm afraid of trying to force something to happen, as that kind of relationship might want to unravel quicker.

Of course, all of this is academic for me, as I've never been in a real romantic relationship, and at the rate I'm going, I may end up marrying my pride.

I don't really know what I'm saying at this point.

Have Amie send her out a special pair of women's pink speakers with silk screened covers.
It worked for Ian, though i don't think the speakers were pink.

Don't be left standing on the dock while the ship sails away. There are worse things to get over than the rejection of a woman so take a chance.

I remember that the first girl I was brave enough to ask out when I got to high school laughed in my face. A few years later in college after building up quiet a bit playing rugby and martial arts, I met her again in a club. She didn't remember me and asked me to dance.

I know revenge is wrong but the look on her face when I told her why I would NEVER dance with her was golden!!!

Man, back in junior high a girl asked me if I wanted to go out. I laughed at her and said no. I wasn't trying to be mean. At that point in my life, I simply didn't have idea how to react, as I hadn't even considered dating anyone.

She kind of blew up at me in a class in high school. I didn't realize it was the same girl until I was thinking about it later. But yeah, I was acting like a dork with a friend in that class. I don't remember the details, but I was pretending like I thought I was cool, which I knew I wasn't, but she took my attitude seriously and really jumped down my throat. Once again I didn't know how to react. I said something about how I was all too aware of how uncool I was, and I nearly broke into tears. She felt bad at that point. We even ended up hugging at graduation, which was nice, since she had turned into a very attractive girl.

Ooh, my Zzang candy bars are Out For Delivery. I'm glad they're on time so I can take them in to work tomorrow. Yum (I'm pretty sure)!

CV lives a very interesting life.

I suspect he's really some sort of special agent/spy.

I've almost cracked his code.

CV, the Zzang penguin abides effortlessly at midnight.

perhaps he is a French agent/spy?

CV, Les grenouilles apprécient manger le Pastèque.

Que?

¿Donde esta el baño?

How do you get the upside down question mark?


Oh, down the hall and to the right.

1. open new browser tab
2. Google 'where is the bathroom Spanish'
3. browse web sites to find the Spanish translation
4. highlight it
5. copy
6. paste into Axiom reply window

It's just that easy!

Gracias! Mis intestinos están haciendo girar como dos terrieres rabiosos en un bolso de arpillera!!!

How 'bout if I draw a question mark on a piece of paper, cut it out, turn it upside down, and paste it to my monitor?

Only if you can match the font perfectly in size and serif!

No wonder I failed Spanish in high school. This is hard.

I can't get the tape to stick to my monitor. Let me use my gum. . .

As long as you're not like my first secretary and use Liquid Paper on it, you'll be OK.

I'm sure I'm much more qualified than her. Plus, my tops are very low-cut.

Funny thing is, so were hers. Of of my patients complained (not a male patient, of course).

She didn't really use Liquid Paper on the monitor (a classic blonde joke), but she was 19 and not the sharpest tool in the shed, shall we say. She quit to take a job in the federal government. Insert joke here.

Upside down question marks are for sissies. Ümlaüts are where it's at, boÿ.

Yeah, but yöü chéàt. Yoü're on a Måc.

Mâçs kîck åß!

I'm seriously thinking about getting a MacBook (or MBP) for my next computer purchase. Having had PCs/Windows only since 1995, the last time I used Macs was in college circa 1986-1990. How much has changed in the last 20 years?

And when will CV come in and hijack this thread back to his on-again-off-again courtship?!

Gee, Tom, I guess i am post-whoring.

Not that there's anything wrong with that!

Wheee, lots of rainbow heads! Cheaper than LSD!

Why do I keep trying to lick my monitor?

Because of the glue you used to put on the upside-down question marks?

Alternate answer: you're out of toads?

Perhaps you have a salt deficiency?

You're right on both. I used toads to stick upside down question marks to my screen.

*lick lick lick*



I'm thirsty.

You know, there's probably dried yak saliva on that thing.

Oh great! Now I'm gonna get hives. . .

Thanks alot.

Hey, didn't Dried Yak Saliva open for Negative Orange back in 2003?

Yeah, I believe CV has the lunch pail to prove it.

Oh yeah, the one with the hot chick wearing nothing but an orange donut necklace...

Wonder if CV's ears and crotch are burning now?

Time to go to the clinic, eh?

IIRC, on the flip side of the lunchbox there was a photo of the hot chick's boyfriend, giving us the finger.

Reminds me, I gotta post the Disney Princesses talk about Chlamydia in the funny thing thread some time.

Although, if you Google the three key words, it's the first link, so there.

I wonder if my work's websense blocks the word Chlamydia?

Hey, it worked! I guess it's okay since it's educational. . .

Disney should publish a coloring book for the kids.

"Mommy, what color is "burning sensation?"

Thanks for helping Peter out with his post count, guys. Geez, I log off for 15 minutes, and this is what happens...

I'm not purposely trying to keep my post count higher than yours, you know.

Seriously, what do you take me for?

I think you know.

This thread has really gone to the nutters .

That may be, Chess, but we are professional nutters.

Not anyone can do this.

Well yes i guess that is quite true. medic8r is certainly a professional in nutters.
So does that lifetime of exposure create a conditioning effect in which in the sane becomes the insane?
I'm witnessing some strong evidence here.

Please do not attempt to be nutters without proper training. Serious injury, dismemberment, or death could result.

I think JP managed to escape from someplace and only poses as a doctor to throw people off.

I'm only a nutter after a certain activity.

Because I almost cry when girls talk to me?

I'm glad to see the thread has fallen off the cliff.

tee hee!

Well played with, sir.

all these rainbow heads really are starting to take effect
not unlike a heavy dose of demerol

No such luck my friend. Lets try this tack. Talk to the girl of we'll be forced to track her down and tell her for you.

Now which would be less painful?

You know, I'm really not sure. I seem to be running into a lot of internal resistance. Once again, I got to go to comedy night with her, alone with her on the way there and on the way back, and... nothing. She even wanted me to get up and dance after the comedians did their routines, but I chose to be a sitting statue. I mean, I've never danced in public before, so it's going to be a big step for me to start, but really, what does it take to dance in a club?

I really need to learn how to help myself.

Get the girl and you won't have to anymore

About the rest, I say this in only the nicest way... but, Charles - you suck. Don't make me come there and go all "Biker Eye for the Straight Guy" on you.

Bren R.

Can you be a little more graphic with your threat? By a little I mean a lot. PM me. Ha ha ha.

Sounds to me like your already dating, just neither of you have actually said the word out loud.

And my God man, you just missed the best opening ever. No, you don't have to learn to dance like a pro, all you had to do was wait for a slow song and then tell her you that you are not comfortable dancing but could probably pull off a slow dance.

You even have the added advantage of being sincere instead of it being a 'line'.

Charles, I'm horrible at dancing, but I've found that no matter how bad your moves are, if you time them to the beat of the music you'll be fine. Believe me. Back in my college days I shared a balcony with the girls from next door. They always had friends over on the weekend and they inevitably wanted to go clubbing and dragged me along with them.

Just find the beat and stick with it.

Yeah, CV!

I asked Sean the other day, "Wasn't that our favorite half-Japanese, all-muscle Axiomite in the new Negative Orange video?"

And he said, "Yeah, and CV's got the dance moves to prove it."

Word up, bro!

Thats it!!! Gimmy her email now so I can tell her that she needs to bring a 2x4 on your next non-date to soften you up a little cause your... um... shy??... thick as a brick??...

Amie, are you out there? What the heck do we do with this guy??

I like to dance around in the privacy of my own home, of course, but the music I play at home is a far cry from the music they play out in the wild. I also have dancing I do at work, and lately I've been doing a "pants dance," which Tiana told Claire about, so Claire was hoping I'd bust that out. Losing the little bit of weight from DDR makes the pants just loose enough to make it fun to adjust them while moving around. I do it to freak my coworkers out, especially Mike, since he has been "trying" to lose weight for a long time now. But yeah, both Tiana and Claire were hoping I'd unleash it on the public, but I wasn't quite there.

Yeah, yeah, I'll get new pants, but at this point I'll have to shop in the juniors section. I especially need new work pants, but I was already wearing the smallest size (in both length and waist) of the kind that I like. What a pain! I'm not even that small of a guy. 5' 8", 150 lb. I feel fairly average.

I think I'm going to have to tell Tiana and get her input. I'm pretty sure she'd be on my side.

Yaaaa soooooo. As I said, start with slow dances and avoid talking about your pants for 2, 3 minutes at a time maybe......
LOL Kidding!

and while I'm being inexcusably mean.....
St.Pat's Guy! How dare you start a story with "Back in my college days I shared a balcony with the girls from next door." and end it with nothing but 'got drug to a club'!!!

Would you believe we managed to snag the same apartment for two consecutive years? Ah, those were the days. . .

You mean that Tiana doesn't know yet?

Do you think she's that dense? Dude, they both know... you just have to make your move.

--thispostprovidedbysomeonewhomarriedhisfirstgirlfriendwhokindasortahadtohunthimdownanddidntrealizetheyweregoingtohaveadateonthefirstdate.

You may already know that I whiled away my university summers working at a summer resort. Ahhh, young love. In my vast experience (every Wednesday night was dance night) boys don't actually even have to dance to really impress the girls. They just need to stand on the dance floor, swaying slightly (on beat if possible but not crucial) and make lots of eye contact. I'd say in 98% of the cases girls were so impressed by this act of courage that they would dance around said boy, making it seem as though he were dancing, and then he'd be made in the shade. With your DDR training I'd say you're already light years ahead of the rest. Start small and you'll see how easy it is!

BTW - strategic alliance with Tiana is a brilliant idea. As is chocolate.

Wow - there should be an award for the best run-on sentence ever Ken!!

Chocolate's always a brilliant idea.

Oh, you mean for Claire?

Now that you mention it, I'm not sure we should limit it to Claire. Maybe CV should send us all chocolate. Hmm.

I think that would definitely help his case.

CV? I'll take some Scharffen Berger. 70% minimum, please.

I'd probably stay away from flowers, unless she's the romantic type, then maybe a single rose of the appropriate color. Black is not the appropriate color.

If you are sending a flower, the dedicated members of the Axiom message boards could probably help you write a haiku to go with them . . .

Incidentally, here's a list of rose meanings, at least in the UK.

Chocolate for all
Is what I give to you but
Here is a rose too.

Chocolate melts like
my heart, softer, sweeter when
we are near to you

Amie's haiku is
Much more romantic but mine
is much funnier.

To be serious
I would probably steal the
haiku by Amie.

There are so many
paths to the heart - stomach, eyes
and of course laughter

Soap opera thread!
I see one new patient and
it blows up on me!

Alternatively
There is the path I prefer:
underneath the ribs.

If that path's taken
I know where CV will live
for 10 to 20

Ken is approaching
Post number 9000. Whoa!!!
I'll never catch him.

And now back to our
regularly scheduled fun -
CV's Claire Repor'

This hijack brought to
you courtesy of Amie
the Magnificent!

Wonder Woman, eh?
With her invisible jet
and golden lasso

Let me just tighten that up. "Boys" should not attempt to dance unless they can. The "white boy hip sway" should be the extent of it... anything more and you're in over your head and look like the drunk uncle (druncle) at the wedding.

But that's just me... I prefer to be the guy standing at the table in the leather jacket resting my beer on my belt buckle and remaining an enigma who can be wrestled into a slow dance with the right amount of fluttering eyelashes. I get to keep my cred that way.

Bren R.

No doubt, CV dreams
of one day snagging his own
Wonder Woman, eh?

Just to add my 2 cents...boyfriends like the one described on the very first post (I am just joining the party) are merely a speed bump. My wife, when I first met her, also had a boyfriend what was a "speed bump" in my mind. I treated him as such, paid no attention to him, and basically stole my wife's heart away.

We are now happily married, and I am really glad I had the balls to do what was needed to get her by my side.

The moral of the story is: Boyfriends are speed bumps. Girls like ColLAIRE are begging for a real man to step up and act like a future husband should act like. You think she likes her relationship? She is just there because he is expressing lots of interest, no other reason. If you start asking her out on dates, getting to know her better, that boyfriend will be a thing of the past, and soon you'll be the boyfriend. If you treat her right, you won't be a speed bump for another guy either

Ahh, so that giant pile of stuff following you around is your cred, then?

Don't take Bren dancing!
Mr. T non sequitur:
I pity the fool!

Hah! The big guns are out now CV. Yer donefer. Might as well get it over with my friend.

The world is waiting, CV.

No pressure.

The audience is listening.

Medic8r lies
He says he is the doctor
More like a patient

Charles, heed this advice:
Get rid of Claire's boyfriend with
Giant Monster Truck!

Uh oh. Bren's aware.
I must finish him with a
Giant Monster Truck!

Why am I still here?
It's after 5 on Friday!
Arrivaderci!

I'm not saying she's dense, simply that I haven't admitted what's plainly obvious, so there hasn't been discussion about Claire beyond friendly terms.

Annnnnnd... I didn't talk to Tiana about it today at work. I guess I started this thread to showcase what a spineless specimen I am?

Charles, if I were a betting man I would have to bet that everyone involved, including the girls and the bf, know how you feel about Claire. The present you gave her was the dead giveaway. K is right, you gotta make a choice and live with it.

It is a little known fact that males of the species Homo Erectus are able, in times of dire need, to grow/re-grow portions of their spine.

Pity we're all H. sapiens...

well, probably.

... well maybe. At the rate we are going, we have evolved into Homo Destructus, but thats another thread.

I am a firm believer in genetics. I'm almost certain we have inherited that spine growing trait... well, somtimes...

Let's go back to the dancing theme. I've got the perfect technique for you, CV. It's called the fishstick, at it requires very little skill, coordination, or even rhythm. Give it a shot.

I'm gonna have to practice that one.

I just blew tartar sauce everywhere.

Back to flowers.
Back in the day, We convinced a shy buddy of ours to by a rose from the 'Rose Girl' who sold them at local night clubs and walk up to this girls he had been obsessed with all night and tell her that she deserves a rose.

Well he did, but when she asked "why?", he lost it and retreated when he couldn't figure out what to say.

Moral of the story, she thought his flustered retreat was so sweet, she hunted him down and they have been a happy couple ever since.

Good point Murph. Anybody can execute 'awkward' well (since it comes naturally) and that gets you sincerity points. Most people who try for smoothe come off as lounge lizards.

The only thing holding you back now CV is the fear that she will say no and put you in the position you are already putting yourself in now by saying nothing.

Read the above sentance every morning after you get up and take a few moments to think about it.

Just my opinion, but if CV doesn't get off his horse soon he may find that in the future Collaires kids are calling him uncle Charlie.

No kidding! He can babysit the kids at the park while Claire and her significant other have some alone time together.

I'm pretty sure my chance has already come and gone. I appreciate all of the feedback, and I'm sorry it didn't go anywhere. It's just that it seems fairly straightforward. If she liked me a fraction as much as I like her, she would have made herself more available. Since she's coming in way less and spending more time with her boyfriend, it seems she's made her choice.

On the plus side, now I don't have to learn how to be in a relationship.

or she just got tired of waiting for you to make a move. But you knew somebody was going to say that, right.

I normally swear never to give advice on such matters. Damn internet, makes it too easy to shout your opinions to the world. I'll stop now but I'll finish with, "If you don't ask her out now, you will never know for sure and that will be way worse for wayyy longer, as opposed to the quickly passing feeling of rejection."

Or you can just sing Tiffany's "Could've Been" to yourself alone every night for the rest of your life.

Bren R.

Thats too bad CV, life does go on though and there is no one 'perfect' person out there for you.

Bren, your leather jacket and gun slinging habits don't scare me a bit, but coming up with a Youtube of Tiffany?? That terrifies me!
.

You know, that's a very good point, Murph. I hadn't put two and two together like that, but I guess Bren is more complicated than I thought. Hmmm, "Dear Diary, today I rethought my analysis of Bren ..."

Bren is a sentimental 80s brat -- complete with high bangs -- trapped in the body that oozes punk cred.

He's an enigma, really.

Hmm. I'll have to ask him what it's like to have a four-headed penis.

Wait, you said enigma, not echidna.

For a truly frightening look into my mind - I think I still know all these lyrics on these two albums.

Seemingly a bit of a dichotomy, but I owned the Tiffany eponymous CD at the same time as Venom, Slayer and Cryptic Slaughter vinyl.

Bren R.

Bren's trying to redefine Renaissance Man for modern times.

OK, I just can't seem to let this one go.

talk to the woman dammit. She backed off cause you didn't take the sledgehammer 'wanna dance' hint.

I have learned several times over that its never too late, and that the only regrets that really linger are regrets over risks not taken.

BE A MENSCH, TALK TO THE WOMAN!!! At this point there is absolutely nothing to loose and still something to gain.

C'mon kid, trust me on this, the thought is much harder than the actual act. This reminds me of my son, who regularly works himself into a tizzy over things he can easily conquer.

T-A-L-K TO THE WOMAN!!!!!!!!!!

I'm beginning to think that fredk will be tiptoeing through Collaire's tulips before CV will.

I don't think I'd look very good in a corset.

Bren R.

That doesn't rule out the possibility of the converse being true.

Are you suggesting I'd look good... out of... a corset, Peter?

*makes a weak excuse and backs away.. slowly*

Bren R.

No. That the corset would look good in you.

Maybe he wants to make a corset out of you!

You're more my size.

Kenneth, what is the frequency?

Bren R.

Be at ease.

You're right that telling her how I feel would leave me with the fewest regrets. I'd know exactly where I stood, and I would be proud of myself for speaking up. Where I'm having trouble is that IF she likes me, continuing to date someone she's not as interested in doesn't speak a lot for her character, though I think it's more likely that she sees me as just a friend. In the end, I think I'm too proud to beg for reciprocation. I'd rather it happened more naturally.

It will hurt for a while, but probably mostly in the ego, considering who's being preferred over me. But it's fine. Life has its disappointments, and then it has its real tragedies. Thankfully, so far I've only been disappointed.

That's a good attitude. I took solace in the saying, "If it was meant to be, it would be."

But then we did end up getting together -- fortunately there wasn't another guy in the equation -- and now two kids later, it's still going well.

CV, I like your last post a lot. It shows that you're happy and level-headed. Your certificate of sanity is in the mail.

After some reflection, I have realized how easy it is for those of us thousands of miles away to throw all kinds of advice at you, whereas you are the one, of course, that will have the actual dealings with her and make your own reality. Or have your reality made for you by others, hmmm ...

Once again, I'd like to thank everyone for listening and being very encouraging. It's nice to know that people have my back. You're all a positive influence on me. There are a lot of people around here with good heads, and it makes me want to be a better person.

Like these?

(falls down in front of monitor and convulses)

Dang, more collateral damage. Now where's Ken when you need him?

"Ken, got something for you to see, yoo-hoo!"

He's been mostly dead all day.

I see my hired goons were worth it.

I'd always wanted to hire some goons. I'm glad I took the plunge.

Next time he comes around, I expect to see a little more respect ...

OK Charles, I can’t stand it anymore and have to say something…. Have you ever watched a monkey swinging around in a tree? If not, do so. A monkey will not let go of one branch before it commits to the next branch. It has to have a firm grasp on that next branch before it lets go of the first branch. Think of women and relationships with this in mind and you’ll start to understand what’s going on with this girl you’re infatuated with. She’s made it pretty clear that she’s not all that interested in the branch she’s clinging to now, but she needs the comfort of finding that next branch before she can let go of the one she’s holding onto. She’s trying to grab it (you), but you won’t let her.

Suck it up and figure out how to let her know you are interested in her. I’d work with her girlfriend if I were you. Your last post is nothing more than you trying to find comfort in the bad decision you’ve made that will force her to look for someone else to help her get away from the twit she’s with now.

I love monkey analogies!


Good job, Mike!

Then again, Mike makes some good points ...

"Horny" kicks "embarassed's" ass.

Tom's a wise man.

Ah, but "sated" is King.

But you have to WANT to be King before you can BE King.

I was trying to work something to that effect into my post, but I kept getting stumped by the fact that people are born into royalty and don't do squat to deserve it sometimes.

I know this isn't where you got it, but I always associate that monkey/branch comparison with M:I-2.

Yes, a lot of my decision is cowardice with spin. However, I really don't know how I'd feel about dating a swinger who's just looking for the next handhold. I kind of hate to think about her being freshly off fartknocker's branch.

Don't worry. Now I'm just joking. You called me on the fact that I'm justifying my lack of action, but debating is fun.

I mean, you're right, the only way to feel good about myself is to just do it. I don't have feelings of this depth often enough that I can just flush it away and be okay.

As it happens, I'll be hanging out with Tiana and the tree dweller tomorrow. I doubt I'll have a good opportunity for spilling any beans, but I'll make an effort to leave a decent impression on her, and I'll talk to Tiana on Monday. Between you and fredk, I may yet be browbeaten into a surge of spinal growth.

Thanks for the talk.

You know, I think the point here is that you felt deeply enough for her to start a thread in hopes of making a connection.

For the love of (your deity here), I've had SO many missed opportunities in my life... I would give up alot to go back and make my feelings known to the few women in my life I should have had the *alls to speak up to. (Yes, I'm divorced for quite a few years)... DO IT. As others have said, regrets last much longer than simply diving in and at least KNOWING.

Go for it CV... let her know how you feel.

More Monkey logic

"Everybody's Got Something to Hide Except Me and My Monkey"
John Lennon




Of course he wrote this lyric to describe how he and Yoko felt about their relationship so it is therefore totally discredited. heh heh

Bump.

From the Shout Box on July 6, 2008:

[CV] Oh, I took the smallest step forward possible. I sent Tiana a message about the Claire situation. I actually sent it on Wednesday, but she didn't log into MySpace until last night, right after I went out to a movie with all of them

I should have known my shout would echo.

There is good acoustics in here.

Ha ha, nice edit.

D'Oh! I didn't think anyone saw.

CV, I just the read the first page and the last couple, so forgive me if I missed something crucial. I won my wife from a sort of similar situation. Two rules. Be honest about how you feel to her even though it will seem counterproductive sometimes. Don't fear the friend zone. In fact, make sure that you are her best friend. It takes time...painful time, but you are giving her a very real and solid alternative to the status quo and success is inevitable. At least it was for me. She knew I wanted to marry her and eventually she said yes. No dating ever. We just skipped straight to the good part. I have been the happiest guy in the world for 14 years now.

Good luck!

Jeb

As Kinge ups the ante...

*Howard Cosell voice* The eyes of the Axiom world are upon our young friend as he prepares for epic battle with the forces of the heart ...

Nice story kinge. We've got CV backed so tight into a corner this time there is no escaping the inevitable.

CV, I like fall weddings.

I think you need to come to her with a list of kids names as well as the intended dates of birth.

Not 'til after the first date. Gotta go slow here you know.

Make sure you wear some shorts that show off your bitchen tattoos, like I do:

Looks like a list of things not to listen to.

"I'm the one they call Dr. Feelgood ..."

My theme song, take it as you will.

So Tiana asked me today if I wanted to talk about the message I sent her about Claire. It was right at the end of my shift, so we didn't talk long. I said I didn't really know what I could do at this point, and she said "not really anything." She admitted that doing nothing also didn't seem like the way to go. She actually seemed pretty cool with me liking Claire. I guess I'll talk to her more on Wednesday. "So I guess you don't want me to tell Claire about your message, do you?" I said no, since I want to talk to her a little more. "I imagine she must at least have a hint of me liking her," I said. "I don't know. She can be pretty oblivious. Anyway, it's not that obvious. I didn't know you liked her until someone else said something." So I guess I somehow had them fooled.

Excellent!

Charles, just direct her attention to this thread. It'll explain everything!

I think it may emphasize the wrong points.

Like what, your good taste in friends?

She'll be convinced he's part of some strange Muppet Fetish group....

All right, so here's the deal.

After thinking about it a bit, I decided to let Tiana go ahead and tell Claire about the message I had sent her, because let's face it, I would have dragged my feet into eternity, and I was tired of having this constant pressure inside me. I also figured that using Tiana as a buffer would take away the awkwardness. Claire wouldn't have to respond, and I wouldn't freeze in the middle of spilling the beans. At least she would know for sure, and I wouldn't have to keep carrying this weight around.

Tiana waited until no one was around, said to me, "Yeah, it was out of left field."

"What was?" I asked.

"Claire had no idea you liked her."

So she was taken aback a little, and apparently she said that it didn't change anything. Which is fine. On to the next humiliation. I just need to learn to make my humiliations shorter.

And so ends the saga.



I guess it's good you didn't opt for the tattoo to express your feelings.

Don't worry. There will be new sagas and new opportunities for regrettable tattoos.

Tune in next week. Same bat-time, same bat-channel. . .

I wonder if Christopher Nolan is sad that no matter how much people like his take on Batman people will always reference the TV show more.

Without it, his version wouldn't seem quite so serious.

Yeah, it really could have been a lot more serious. He needs to pull out all of the stops next time.

I have yet to see the new movie. I should soon because one of my coworkers saw it over the weekend and didn't stop talking about it all day at work. This is the same guy who constantly forgets I haven't watched any episodes from the 4th season of "The Office" but will talk to me about them every other day. . . (sigh)

Ouch. Just so you know, the Joker is Luke's father.

NOOOOoooooooooo. . .

You should put a spoiler alert on that.

Dang, no watching CV explode!


Thus proving that the 'sensitive sex' can be as clueless as us guys.


Heres the sales take on that:

16 cold calls = 8 suspects = 4 prospects = 2 real opportunities = 1 sale

One down, 15 to go...


"Ah say, ah say boy, you gotta pick up the pace a little."

I need to always be closing.

Unless you have to pee.

Hey, Fred wanted to see me explode.

That proves it. Fred's weird.

I think you did the right thing Charles. I doubt if it will end the saga, now you've planted the seed and perhaps it will grow. And if it doesn't at least you won't spend the rest of your days wondering if.

Charles, now is the time for you to slice your ear off and send it to Claire in the mail.

Hey, thanks. Yeah, it's not entirely out of the realm of possibility that something could develop, but if nothing else, at least it was a good diagnostic that lets me know my heart can still work.

My Axioms would be jealous.

You still have a second ear. . .

Doesn't the second ear give depth perception? Ha ha.

I'm weird??

Man, the freaks come out at night...

Well done Charles!
A sigh of relief is always better than holding your breath.

Whoaaa did I just say something deep?

/emote "looks in coffee cup for remnants of an accidental additive."

Charles, no matter the outcome, you should feel proud of yourself for taking the chance. That's what will instill more self-confidence the next time, and women find confidence attractive....as long as you don't get so confident you become arrogant!

But, in the interim, it may not be over. It's just possible that Claire "never saw you in that way before", but might start now....

Ditto the last two posts. Well said, gents!

Didn't the Well-Said Gents come in one place behind Negative Orange in the 4th Annual San Dimas Battle of the Bands?

*looks for Sean*

*waits*

I don't know, but I bet CV has the Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure Deluxe Edition DVD deleted scenes to prove it!

No way!!! I was dreaming about those movies this morning!!! (uh, don't ask. . .)



This hive mind thing is getting out of hand.

I get to be Sigmund Frood, dude!

Party on!

I guess Tuttlefest is happening at the Circle K.

By the way, thanks for the comments, guys, but let's give it up for the real star of the show: Tiana. For being such a good friend, I'm volunteering along with her for Habitat for Humanity this coming Saturday.

Tuttlefest is dead, long live Tuttlefest.

Man, I have to start exercising again. There's another girl to impress.

Impress her with your mind, the rest will follow.












If that doesn't work, hypnotize her.

I really should have a whole shelf of books on how to trick girls into dating you. It could be the first thing I point out when I have them over.

Usually those books come packaged with a giant club. As the girl turns her attention to the bookshelf, you sneak up behind her and "BAM".

She's yours.

I came here for the audio advice, but I'm getting so much more.

We should charge membership fees.

Do tell???

Man, a couple of anonymous people have been looking at this thread again recently. They must know I'm cycling through my crushes again.

LOL it is a new year after all....

I just had to mention that the girl at work who's too young for me and is in love with her boyfriend is way too cute. Not only that, but she has insane reaction times. As soon as she turns into the same hallway, she starts waving at me. She can be way down at the other end of the hall, and right as I happen to see her, she's already raising her hand to wave. She thinks I should go to the employee picnic on Saturday, but I always feel uncomfortable even when I'm going with people I'm close to. We'll see.

Round two, GO!

Like Yogi Berra said, "It's like deja vu all over again."

Yeah, CV's love life was headed in the wrong direction until he did a 360.

Yeah, I should just assume that any girl who likes waving at me is only waving goodbye.

Hey, I didn't "do" my Xbox 360. Wait, you were talking about something else.

Why don't you ask her if she has any single girl friend's?
It doesn't hurt to ask.

Hell, ask for a pair instead of a single as long as you're asking anyway.....

2 for 1 businessman's special!

Says the man who just got back from a business trip!!!

D'Oh!!!

Too bad your Medusa's head tote-bag isn't ready........I'm sure that would be quite an "icebreaker".

Not to mention you would look SO sexy with it slung over your shoulder.

Just get naked.

"Eh?" is all you need to say as a greeting.

Neither of you will forget that moment.

Hey, the first one could possibly be here this week. It was supposedly shipped yesterday. I'm crossing my fingers that it will arrive, not because of the picnic, but just because I want to show it off to my coworkers.

Can you take a camera with you? Half the fun is seeing everyone's reaction.

Ha ha. In my experience, the only thing that hurts more than asking is hearing the answer.

The thing is that she's only 20. Her friends are going to be the same age. I probably shouldn't go out of my way to be the creepy old lecher.

Dan's weirder than I am.

Unpossible.

If she stares at you blankly, just say, "Don't worry, I brought the whipped cream!"

Anyways, the key is to play it like you don't care, because you shouldn't. Because if you don't care, then when the girl tells you that she "just wants to be friends" you can actually process that and move on rather than returning to her like a dog to its own...

Happy Birthday to Claire's boyfriend! I hate that I'm always going to associate July 4th with him now.

At least you know where to tell him to stick his fireworks.

Damm you Charles, I missed this whole thread because my dyslexia made me read the title wrong. I could have screwed this up for you in half this time.

Time for a baseball reference. Only way’s I know to get more hits are more at-bats and increase your average. Both of which might be facilitated by an:

After Action Review



Seriously it wouldn’t hurt to review what happened and how you might do things differently...before, as someone said above, you do a 360.

This requires pics, too.

CV's AAR.

Arm the missile and don't forget to point it in the right direction.

Sorry CV, couldn't resist.

I don't really feel comfortable taking pictures of a man's Roman candle, especially when he's sticking it somewhere.

Yeah, I think I'm going to have to go for a totally different approach, but it may take a while to get there mentally. I need JP to put me under hypnosis. Too bad he only prescribes medications!

No, when JP visited me I saw a copy of "Jedi Mind Tricks for Dummies" in his briefcase. It's sorta like hypnosis, only WAY cooler!

No better time like now to start preparing so I’ll toss out (reiterate what others have already said) some ideas.

Women (people in general) are drawn to confidence. As you’ve seen they often confuse cockiness/arrogance with confidence but will usually take that over timid-ness any day…especially a branch in the hand (the monkey analogy). So as we said in the Corps “Exude Supreme Confidence” (also intimidates the crap out of the enemy).

How does that apply to your situation? Don’t wait to ask a girl you like out. Do it soon after you meet her as is prudent and do it yourself not indirectly. Waiting shows indecisiveness and lack of confidence and the longer you wait and get to know her as “friends” the more awkward your asking may be. Besides, with rare exception women know if you have the “right stuff” as soon as they meet you so the longer you wait the less your chances.

Stuff it if she has a boyfriend, ask anyway…what could be more confident. Plus now she knows your interested. Also, if the girl is that great you’re not likely to be the only one pining after her, but you may have been the only one with the guts to approach her. The boyfriend can also be your advantage if you’re worried about getting turned down because it gives both you and her a face saving way to back down while still getting your message across.


Do what it takes to boost your self image. Working out is great.

Erase that one hobby in your profile and stop doing it. Self deprecation can be charming if you’re exuding underlying confidence otherwise it shows weakness.

Nothing breeds confidence like success. Set small goals and then exceed them. Again, exercise is great for this.

Do a self assessment of what you like to do and are good at. See if there is a way to mix those things with meeting people. You’re more likely to feel confident when doing things your comfortable with.

If you’re not good at it start getting out with groups and mingling/talking. The “gift of gab” will get you more dates than the best looks in the world. I’ve had two friends, one looked like the “Crypt Keeper” the other like “Alfred E. Neuman” but both had the gift of gab and had girls falling all over them. Get better at conversing by doing more of it.


Self medicate. Short intense workouts build testosterone which in turn acts like an aphrodisiac by boosting confidence and aggressiveness/assertiveness. Meditation is also a powerful tool for some people to fine tune their minds. I meditate daily usually many times especially while running.

Short of an epiphany you aren’t going to fundamentally change who you are Charles, but by building on your strengths while improving and or mitigating your weaknesses you can surely improve your batting average. I mostly rehashed what others already said but thought I’d restate some highlights and how you might use them to change direction 350 degrees this time.

Once your swing improves you can start looking at how to get more at bats.

Those are all great ideas. I'm not so sure about swinging bats at women, but I see what you're saying. At this point, though, I don't really feel like working on myself on the off-chance someone else might appreciate it. It seems a little ridiculous to want to win over a woman who is dazzled by the confidence of morons. If that's what they respond to, then there are plenty of dudes out there to accommodate them. Maybe this will result in an eternally isolated existence. That's fine. I'd like to emphasize that I do appreciate your thoughtful suggestions. I have no doubt they'd lead to companionship and a happier me. I simply don't want to pretend I'm going to follow them when I'm really not wanting to throw myself back into the game.

You’re right that you shouldn’t work on yourself for others but rather for you, and if it’s not what you what right now I respect that. I’m purposely not looking to date right now because I like being single and unattached and plan to stay that way at least until I retire. There’s just not enough time in the day for me to work, do all the things I want to do, and have a relationship. Ah, but when I retire it’s back to university for me. My experience is that many young women do like older men (probability and upper limit to that but I’m willing to push the envelope). Should you choose to enter the fray again good luck and good hunting.

Speaking of "confidence" verses "over-zealousness," every time I hear the word "fray" I can't help but think of this guy charging in to a battle only to 'accidentally' kill everyone on both sides. Upon seeing any skirmish, his battle cry was "A Fray!!!"
One of many comic collections I wish I still had.

I liked Groo too!

Didn't Sergio Aragones do little drawings in the margins of Mad magazine?

Yup, it was my recognition of his name as the guy who did those tiny little cartoons that made me buy the first Groo comic. They were both hilarious.

To the tune of "She'll be comin' 'round the mountain"

If you're in a bad position,
Call for Groo.
He will join your opposition,
Call for Groo!
If a slow death is your worry,
Call for Groo in a hurry.
He will kill them all for you.
Call for Groo!

That was actually published in one of the comics, I still remember it after all this time.

Bren R.

Finally Bren, you bring back a memory from my early teens that doesn't involve ruining my occasional habit of listening to a classic metal bands by posting pictures of how ridiculous they actually looked. Thanks for the chuckle!

I don't even remember how my brother and I started reading Groo... I was never a huge Mad Magazine fan, I recognized Sergio Aragones' style from what Mad issues I HAD read, but it wasn't a big draw.

Collected those for some time.

Used to read Peter Porker: The Spectacular Spider-Ham as well, but that wasn't nearly as funny.

Bren R.

I used to have an issue of that Peter Porker comic. I don't remember much about it. It's been a while.

I remember buying it thinking "this will be hilarious"... I remember being wrong. Luckily I think I only bought one issue.

Bren R.

I just thought you all should know I'm going for a walk in the park with an actual woman tomorrow evening after work. While I don't think anything will happen beyond friendship, she's been really fun to talk to, and it will be nice to try hanging out with someone different. I may meet another person I've been talking to online, too.

Well good luck! Since I am married I don't know what going to a date means anymore!

It means opportunity for embarrassment! All you can hope for is that it's just as embarrassing for her. Ha ha.

Your definitely right!

Hey CV I saw the pics of your HT system! It's awesome!

Hey, thanks. My room definitely isn't as nice as some of the other ones, but at least the gear is pretty decent thanks to my very skewed priorities. I'm going to be moving my system into the basement when it's done, so I'm going to be putting my energy into making that room as good as possible.

Well, Charles.... YOU get an "Awesome" as well!!

That's great Charles! I hope things work out for you.

Excellent, Mr. Charles!

Wow I just found this thread. I read the first post and knew it was not going anywhere. I will recommend to you a book which has changed many lives. It is called the system and will help you understand yourself, as well as how to change your behavious so that it positively affects your dating life. I read it about 10 years ago and it turned my dating life 180 degrees. It's called "The System" and it works like a charm. The three big things it stresses as has been said before are "Confidence,Challenge,Control(Of yourself)"

I strongly recommend reading the book and following what it preaches. It really makes it easy to understand where you stand with a woman very quickly and helps you spot the wrong ones and the right ones. Good luck to you.

Why do they call them "self-help" books? Doesn't the necessity of reading the book pre-suppose that you're not actually helping yourself?

Huh?

I'm confused.

I may not get women, but I got Peter's joke.

read the book and then you'll get both. =)

STOP IT!!!

I hate you, Mr. Eric!






[ confused n00bs: read the pet peeves thread ]

I thought reading the book pre-supposed that you WERE "helping" yourself. That is if by "helping" you are implying the M word.

Well, by that definition, I'm also helping myself if I pay a doctor to help me.

Does that mean I'm helping myself when I flip on Judge Judy or Doc Phil?

The walk along the river went well. She brought coffee, just like she said. She recognized me by my walk because I told her I walk fast. The sparks didn't set the river ablaze or anything, but she's fun to be around. She's certainly more outgoing and living life to the fullest. I think my limited sampling of life's experiences and reserved nature in person would bore her pretty quickly, but she didn't run away.

We had talked before about going to the Kings of Leon concert at the Gorge next weekend, and that might still happen. We'll see. If nothing else, it was nice to meet someone new. There's one other person I need to meet, and then I also need to talk more to a couple of women at work. Look at me go.

I'm glad you had a an un-negative time. You're too interesting a person to end up a permanent bachelor. Keep taking advantage of opportunities to interact and something will happen sooner or later.

Thanks, Peter. I'm actually feeling somewhat hopeful. There was a long stretch where I just wasn't seeing anything, but right now I feel like I could be fun to be around.

Go, CV, go!!

Sounds like you guys had a pretty good time during your walk. AND you got all sorts of other dates to line up!! Whoo hoo!!!

+1 to what Peter and Sean said. I look forward to our roadtrip and factory shenanigans this fall.

Nice to hear everything went well! Good luck on your next date. I remember one funny date I had, this girl wouldn't stop asking me questions, I thought I was in a interrogatory. LOL I think one thing you should never ask someone on a first date is, how much you make a year, what car do you have. LOL That's just what she asked me. No need to say the date ended right away.

If nothing else CV, have fun while you are out with them, that is the biggest thing, IMO.

I am very glad I found my wife sooner rather than later in life. I couldn't imagine doing it again.

Good point on the fun. It's definitely easier to have fun when I'm not worrying about what it might turn into.

It has been my experience women seem to have a sixth sense, it tells them whether or not you are having fun while you are with them.

Wow, I take a week off and Charles has some dates lined up. Good Work CV! I should probably go on vacation again, just so I don't jinx things.

Too late. I'm pretty sure the woman I met isn't interested in doing anything again. The other one I was going to meet, who I've been talking to for a while, is no longer wanting to meet anyone as of last night, after a guy she liked led her on, started avoiding her, then finally posted to his Facebook that he was in a relationship. Now I'm down to the stripper at work.

Sorry to hear that, at least you have your Axiom's to keep you happy/busy in the meantime

StripPER! StripPER! StripPER !!!

You have a stripper at work? I don't have a stripper at work.

Man, the benefits packages some people have at work are really something!

That "other girl" sounds like she would be really appreciative of a nice surprise gesture at the moment. She might be angry at the world but then again, it might also be the perfect time to stand out from the crowd by being the nice guy that you are. 'Worst case Ontario,' you don't have anything to lose.

Ha ha. The stripper thing is just a rumor. I have no idea if there's any basis for it. I don't really care, either. She's always been nice to me. Two of my female coworkers seem to dislike her, though.

I'll think about it. I'm doing what I can in conversation, and I don't really know what I can do beyond that.

Flowers would probably be the obvious choice. Something in a 'cheery, hope things get better for you' kind of bouquet as opposed to going for the romantic bunch just yet. The card should also strictly be about cheering her up. Show you care about her feelings as opposed to feeling her.... Oops, sorry I slipped for a moment there.

Shortly thereafter, the old spontaneous carefully timed "Hey, you looked like you needed a coffee." when you notice she is having a particularly bad day.

This opens the perfect opportunity to test the waters with, "I hope today is much better for you than yesterday. Here are some chocolates to help get it started..." Again, the small sampler sized boxes with a little card. A full box might be trying too hard still at this point.

If she stops smiling when she thanks you, then it's time to pull out, but again nothing to lose.

Oh, I may not have explained well, but I only know her online. One of my coworkers has a son who went to school with her, but that's the only way I know she's real. I wouldn't have a way to enact these physical transactions.

But yeah, while I like talking to her a lot, I don't see real potential beyond friendship, so I'm not going to pressure her into an actual meeting. In the meantime, I'll do what I can to get her focused on better things.

Ahh sorry, I wasn't paying attention. You did explain that. I was the one stuck on co-worker.

All my romanticism sneaky planning wasted!!

I like strippers and have dated several. They have nothing to hide..... They also tend to prefer 'nice' guys as most of the men they deal with when working are A-holes. I'm not a jealous person though. If you are, don't even think about it....

The profession is not what it used to be. Exotic dancing seems to be becoming the profession of choice for upscale young students who are trying to get through University on their own. At least according to several panicking Dads I have talked to.

Ha ha. The exact rumor I heard is that she would strip at parties for $300/hr. So yeah, that would certainly help with tuition.