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#16743 - 08/06/03 11:56 PM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10395
Interesting reviews, Mark and Jason, but what is fullness? If this is the upper bass area I know that my M22s are as full as things are supposed to be. An M3, for example, has been said to give a greater impression of fullness because the upper bass area is slightly elevated above the lower midrange, also leading to slightly less midrange detail. If this is the case, maybe you can't have both. What makes me doubt this though is that the 170 doesn't have that upper bass boost and I'd doubt that they'd design one into the 340. Is it possibly the low and mid-bass which the sub would handle?

Incidentally Mark, your comment about classical reminded me; did you ever get that Ma Vlast we discussed a couple months ago?
_________________________
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#16744 - 08/07/03 12:10 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
Zarak Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/09/03
Posts: 1849
Loc: PA
It wasn't really extra bass. There were times when I noticed extra bass out the Ascends, but since we weren't using a sub I tried to ignore that...as I know from listening to my M22's the sub does a great job of filling in those sounds.
Perhaps richer sound is a better descriptor? The M22 speakers seemed a little thin by comparison during Crash. If you are looking for more detailed description, I'll have to think on a way to explain it better, or perhaps someone else can jump in to help me out.

Overall, I'm still happy with the M22 and glad I have them...it really just depends on what you like and what you listen to mostly. For the most part I prefer the M22's, but there are songs that sound better on the Ascends.

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#16745 - 08/07/03 12:14 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
chesseroo Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/13/02
Posts: 4829
Loc: western canada
A useful review of 2 speaker types indeed.
It appears that each speaker has a different sound, each with its own advantages/disadvantages depending on the listener. I wish more ppl would review speakers with a 'difference comparison' in mind as opposed to searching for the answer to the question of 'which is better'.

As for the 'fuller' issue, i can attest to the more broad sound that the M60s produce compare the M22s. Although i found the upper frequencies to be very equivalent, you simply cannot overlook the fact that the M60s utililize not only an extra driver, but 2 larger drivers beyond the 5.25" midrange woofer along with a larger cabinet.
The "fullness" that may be missing from an M22 i personally feel can be found in the M60/M80. The M22 is excellent when paired with a subwoofer though giving the M60s a run for the money.
_________________________
"Those who preach the myths of audio are ignorant of truth."

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#16746 - 08/07/03 12:15 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
MarkT Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/15/03
Posts: 79
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
John,

No I have not yet purchased the Ma Vlast yet, but it is on my list of must-haves. I would really like to hear it on the Axioms.
In so far as the "fullness" concept is concerned, sometimes the M22s sound like I have taken the treble knob up to its max and other times it is just amazing crispness and detail. On the Ascends, The horns in one our selections this evening sounded like another musician was playing along only an octave lower, whereas the Axiom horns were more detailed but had less of a bass to them. I realize I might not be explaining this correctly because I by no means have a great deal of experience critically listening, but I do know that treble appeals to me, but not to the point of lacking any bass at all.
We were listening without the sub and the Ascends still had that extra bass in their sound.
I have been wrestling with this difference in the sound characteristics between the two manufacturers for at least 6 weeks now and need to make a decision soon.

Mark

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#16747 - 08/07/03 12:19 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
Zarak Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/09/03
Posts: 1849
Loc: PA
Yes, I certainly did not feel that it was a case of which is better with these speakers. They both have their advantages and disadvantages. I would love to hear the M60's to compare with the M22 and the Ascend 340's.

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#16748 - 08/07/03 12:19 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
MarkT Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/15/03
Posts: 79
Loc: Philadelphia, PA
Chesseroo,

I have read on more than one occasion on these forums that some people prefer listening to the M60s without a sub, so for me that speaks volumes about its capability of perhaps filling in some of the mid-range sound, as you have mentioned. I can accept that the highs will be the same as the M22s - it is the lower mids to low end of the sound spectrum that I am referring to.

Mark



Edited by MarkT (08/07/03 12:21 AM)

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#16749 - 08/07/03 12:26 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
curtis Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 1501
Loc: Manhattan Beach, CA
But did you guys have fun?

Zarak.....I have heard the M60, and I think they sound "fuller" than the M22's. I like them a lot, but the highs on some material is still too much for me eventhough they are a bit more refined than the M22's. But if you looking for added fullness to your M22's....the M60's are the ticket.

The 340's definitely have more bottom end than the M22's. But I think that the fullness is not due to a midbass boost, because the 170's even sound a little more full than the M22's. I think it has more to do with the forward and high detailed nature of the M22.

I didn't get to do a lot of critical comparing between the M60's and 340's, but I can easily tell you what stands out is still the highs of the Axiom.

curtis


Edited by curtis (08/07/03 12:29 AM)

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#16750 - 08/07/03 12:30 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
Zarak Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/09/03
Posts: 1849
Loc: PA
Yea...we had a good time. I'm just worried hearing this fullness is going to give me upgraditis and I'll want the M60's if they can give me the fullness and keep the detail!

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#16751 - 08/07/03 12:32 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
curtis Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 05/28/03
Posts: 1501
Loc: Manhattan Beach, CA
Upgraditis never dies....there is no cure.

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#16752 - 08/07/03 01:20 AM Re: Speaker Face Off Part II
HGP Offline
old hand

Registered: 06/04/03
Posts: 70
Loc: Austin, TX
If you want fullness combined with the detail of the M22s, go with the M60s. I originally ordered the M22s, which I compared to the Athena AS-F2 floor-standers. The M22s were superior to the Athenas except in fullness. I also wanted the best of both worlds and ordered the M60s. It fit the bill perfectly.

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