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#201846 - 03/25/08 03:18 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: real80sman]
ctown Offline
devotee

Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 364
Loc: Calgary, AB
Anybody use the VP150 with the M22's?? Its the only thing missing in my system.

After I finish the bathroom reno with deep soaker tub, granite sink and travertine flooring.....the VP150 is next!!

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#201850 - 03/25/08 03:31 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: zzyzx]
fredk Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 6951
Loc: Canada
zzyzx. Take what others post about speakers they did not choose with a grain of salt.

Find someplace to audition the M80 ht package for yourself, you will be blown away! I was for both music and movies. Though I have to admit that I didn't move around to check out the 150. Couldn't get my jaw off the floor long enough to! ;\)

FWIW. I just had a running conversation over at audioholics with a guy who started off posting that the M60 vinyl looked crappy, was sometimes harsh and had a weak center.

After some back and forth conversation, it turns out that he likes the M60 better for music than the system he bought, the speakers he got were real rosewood and he thought the center for the system he got was far superior to anything on the market.

So, in reality he thought that the M60s were a very good speaker and the vp150 was just fine, but had I not asked questions, it would have ended up as another one of those Axioms arn't good posts. (where the heck is that rollyeyes smily??)
_________________________
Fred

-------
Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!

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#201852 - 03/25/08 03:33 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: fredk]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13309
Loc: Iowa
Stop back peddling Tom. ;\)
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

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#201871 - 03/25/08 05:17 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: St_PatGuy]
terzaghi Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 04/04/07
Posts: 4840
Loc: Tulsa, Oklahoma
I think the vp150 souds great...
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#201875 - 03/25/08 05:21 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: SirQuack]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10389
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
zzyzx, I would buy the full sytem try it out and if you truly do find an issue with the VP150 then you can return it and try to find another center that will be better and still fit where you want it to go. BTW, good luck with that, any center that does better than the VP150 is much bigger in the size, especially in depth and the ones I looked at were also much taller.

The idea of a bookshelf center works very well and eliminates the off axis issue, so if you can, I would try the M2 or even dual M2s, if you have the space and are truly concerned with the off axis issue, I have measured about a 1.5db drop in SPL going about 20-25deg off axis, but I still find the clarity to be about the same. I think it is just the volume drop that gives the impression of a lack of clarity. It's kind of like when comparing speakers of similar quality, if one speaker is calibrated higher than another, the louder speaker is usually deemed the better sounding one.

ctown, have you forgotten already, I have both VP centers and used them with the M22s and both work great.
_________________________
Jason
-----------------
TTTHHHPPPPPTTTT!

My HT

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#201904 - 03/25/08 08:42 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: jakewash]
ctown Offline
devotee

Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 364
Loc: Calgary, AB
 Originally Posted By: jakewash

ctown, have you forgotten already, I have both VP centers and used them with the M22s and both work great.


All I saw was the M22's with the VP100, then you upgraded to the VP150 and now M80's with VP150 and the sub quest that never ends.......

I didnt think you were running the VP150 with the M22's??

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#201907 - 03/25/08 08:55 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: ctown]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10389
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
I did for awhile, during the big comparison phase and the difference is subtle, but both sound great as they have the same drivers.
_________________________
Jason
-----------------
TTTHHHPPPPPTTTT!

My HT

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#201951 - 03/25/08 11:45 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: zzyzx]
grunt Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 12/04/06
Posts: 3569
Loc: Nirvana
I am one of the trolls ;\) in the AVS and other forums who has posted about the VP150 not being able to keep up with the M80s. I don’t see this as much as a complaint about the VP150 as a compliment to the M80s.

My issue with the VP150 is what Randy alludes to in his comment:

 Quote:

Now, the best center is a matching speaker to your left/right mains, however, most people don't want a single m80 standing in front of the screen.


No dedicated center speaker (enclosed horizontal design) is ever going to keep up with the M80s. Anyone who says that thier favorite brand dedicated horizontal center speaker (AV123, B&W etc…) sounds as good as there full range mains is just saying that there mains just don‘t sound full range. So maybe it’s not fair for me to say that the VP150 is weak compared to the M80s when the fans of other brands won’t admit as much about there speakers but I think people who want information deserve honest opinions. And yes this is just my opinion.

Most people probably won’t have any issues with the VP150. I’ve noticed on many movies the about 50% of the center channel information blended into the left and right mains so even close up the VP150 blends well with the M80s. It’s mostly in the movies where there is no blending of the center into the mains I can really hear the difference in which case I usually run a phantom center which simulates having an M80s center by playing the center channel through the mains.

I think my biggest problem is that I’m in a small room and sit close 6.5 feet from the front speakers. This tends to exaggerate the sonic differences inherent between the M80s and VP150 and the sonic differences resulting from there dissimilar placement. I think sitting further away and having the speakers further apart will eliminate much of this by allowing them to blend more. This is why on several occasions in other forums when people have questions about what Axioms to buy for a small room I would recommend getting three M22s or M3s across the front with a good subwoofer. The exception would be if they want to do lots of stereo listening or are trying to future proof for when they move into a larger room. Also I would still recommend a M22 or M3 center for anyone who can fit it only because they go deeper and will therefore likely blend better with the M80s. They're also a little less expensive.

 Quote:

I really want to use the VP150 (it will fit my console perfect BTW ), I just wanted to make sure the off axis stuff was no big deal.


For those who report hearing comb filtering due to the VP150 design this is an interesting read.

 Quote:

Harman testing has shown that sonic anomalies which are audible while the listener is moving around become much less obvious once the listening position is essentially fixed (the listener sat down!). Toole spoke of comb filtering, and has deduced that it is an artifact of measurement, not an audible problem in normal listening.


http://www.linkwitzlab.com/Acoustics%20a...all%20Rooms.doc

I hope this helps and I haven’t inflamed anyone’s passions.


Dean





Edited by grunt (03/25/08 11:50 PM)
Edit Reason: so much dyslexia
_________________________
3M80 2M22 6QS8 2M2 1EP500 Sony BDP-S590 Panny-7000 Onkyo-3007 Carada-134 Xbox Buttkicker AS-EQ1

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#201957 - 03/26/08 12:46 AM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: zzyzx]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10304
Z, it is in fact a "design issue", but certainly not one unique to Axiom. Vertically configured driver arrays give wider and smoother horizontal response than does a horizontal array. Flip that MTM up on end and listen to the improved dispersion. Again, if there's room for it, a vertical center speaker as similar to(or identical to)the mains as possible should be considered. If there isn't room, you use what fits(or use no center speaker at all).
_________________________
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Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



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#202195 - 03/27/08 05:09 PM Re: VP150 Concern [Re: JohnK]
bugbitten Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 04/06/05
Posts: 2339
Loc: Madisonville, KY
I use M3s (above and below) with my M80s and fnd them to be a perfect match.

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