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#300146 - 04/03/10 04:39 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: michael_d]
BlueJays1 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 4080
Loc: Porch,enjoying Bombay Sapphire
Nothing in life is free. "Free shipping" is having the cost of shipping/handling/insurance and other overhead (packaging materials) incorporated into the MSRP instead of having substantial charges added on afterwards. I agree with policies such as this because it shows that the manufacturer is upfront and honest about its pricing/prices and not trying to backdoor any inflated charges onto the consumer. I would hope they would never change that policy.

Great points made on the shipping costs folks.
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#300156 - 04/03/10 05:09 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: ]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10399
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
 Originally Posted By: htnut

The EP500 goes lower than the Paradigm's. The EP500 also has more power. Those differences may not be worth the delta in price to everyone, but I mention it because you need to compare apples to apples when talking about price.

The EP600 and PC13 are comparable, the EP800 is an upgrade over either one.

The 500 plays to 18 and the DSP 3200 plays to 22 going by the specs, I would be willing to bet many would take the DSP price over the EP500 and give up the few hz difference or you go for the 3400 which hit 19 and still costs less. This is why many say Axiom is over priced. SO far as power goes, like you said earlier it depends on the design, wattage specs doesn't mean alot.
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#300159 - 04/03/10 05:18 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: jakewash]
Ken.C Online   content
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/03/03
Posts: 17791
Loc: NoVA
Said it before, I'll say it again. The Axiom subs are built in North America. Paradigms are built in China. Your choice.


Err, that came off a little rough. I'm just saying that one pays a premium for a product manufactured here--there's no way around it.


Edited by kcarlile (04/03/10 05:19 PM)
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#300166 - 04/03/10 05:29 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: Ken.C]
Adrian Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/27/08
Posts: 6613
Loc: It's all about the location.
My DSP3400 says "Made in Canada" on the serial decal. I know "made in" can mean different things where manufacturing is concerned, as components may be made somewhere else but assembled in North America for instance. I don't really know where Paradigm's drivers and amps are made, but I'd hazard a guess that it may be their cabinets that are actually made in China, like many other speaker companies have done, but their drivers/amps are made in house. This may have changed over the years of course, to keep costs down, but I don't know for sure.
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#300168 - 04/03/10 05:31 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: Adrian]
Ken.C Online   content
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/03/03
Posts: 17791
Loc: NoVA
From what I've heard (from sources that may or may not be rather biased, truthfully), final assembly is in Canada, but the rest is China.


Edited by kcarlile (04/03/10 05:32 PM)
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#300173 - 04/03/10 06:22 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: Ken.C]
BlueJays1 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 4080
Loc: Porch,enjoying Bombay Sapphire
While I agree with you that you pay a premium for North American made products I would guess Axiom sources the components for the electronic section from China or elsewhere and are assembled in house. The subwoofer drivers are definitely made in Canada. The website shows the steps in assembling a Axiom subwoofer driver. I am sure Axiom has specialized in cost effective production and equipment into cabinetry and have increasing economies of scale for the standard vinyl finishes. I can understand having to pay a premium for non-vinyl finishes because of the extensive and specialized labour that is required.

Where Axiom really benefits in my opinon with North American manufacturing and assembly is quality control - quality control initiatives and more control over how it is implemented.
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#300207 - 04/03/10 10:43 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: Ken.C]
fredk Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 7146
Loc: Canada
 Originally Posted By: kcarlile
Said it before, I'll say it again. The Axiom subs are built in North America. Paradigms are built in China. Your choice.

Are you sure? When I did my Axiom visit two years ago, Debbie was just on her way to China to do training in electronics assembly. I am fairly certain that was for amps.

From what I can tell, subs are the most competitive part of the market. There has been a lot of technical innovation in the last 5-7 years and there are lots of good, competitively priced sube out there. It is what it is...


Edited by fredk (04/03/10 10:44 PM)
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#300213 - 04/03/10 11:13 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: fredk]
michael_d Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/23/04
Posts: 3917
Loc: Up yonder
Axiom has two factories. One in Canada and one in Shanghai China. It should be noted that they actually own the factory in China, which is quite unusual and was a feat that took Ian a great amount of time and effort to accomplish. They make all the components at their factories, right down to the wire connectors. During our last customer counsel meeting, we discussed this and it was noted that Axiom does not advertise this fact and they should consider doing something in the future to explain it in more detail; as this thread shows, - people care about the subject.

Without going into a very long winded philosophical discussion regarding the concept of “quality”, in which my views mirror’s Robert Pirsig’s, quality of goods manufactured is most greatly influenced by the management and oversight of the facility and personnel performing the work. Just because a product is manufactured in China, does not necessarily mean that the product is, well…junk. Junk is manufactured right here in good ol’ North America too. Because Axiom does own the factory in China, they have control over the facility proper, including the environmental conditions, cleanliness, machining, etc. Ian spends a great deal of time at this factory as well. China’s boom in manufacturing the past decade has outpaced its ability to establish or adopt a globally recognize quality standard, such as ISO 9000. They will eventually and the price of goods will rise with it. But…that does not mean that you can’t buy a product made in China that does not have a very high level of quality. You just need to do your homework.
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#300216 - 04/03/10 11:27 PM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: michael_d]
BlueJays1 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 4080
Loc: Porch,enjoying Bombay Sapphire
Excellent post michael_d.
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I’m armed and I’m drinking. You don’t want to listen to advice from me, amigo.

-Max Payne

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#300218 - 04/04/10 12:12 AM Re: I don't hesitate to recommend Axiom [Re: BlueJays1]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10399
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Thanks Mike, that was very informative.
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