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#363140 - 01/09/12 07:27 AM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: jakewash]
Cork Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 79
Loc: Pennsylvania, US
Okay, thanks everyone, I'll keep looking. I did find a NAD I liked, then I googled the price ... ouch! I guess there's a reason they don't quote price on their site.

#363141 - 01/09/12 07:30 AM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: Cork]
Wid Offline

Registered: 06/22/03
Posts: 6722
Loc: The Peoples Republic of Il.

Spearit Sound has refurbed NAD products.

"A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." Sigmund Freud

#363153 - 01/09/12 10:14 AM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: Wid]
Nick B Offline

Registered: 08/05/06
Posts: 496

That is quite a small room almost; nearly the same dimensions as my room. My 5.1 system consists of 2 M22's, a VP150 and 2 QS8's. I have had a budget Onkyo 5.1 receiver rated at 75 X 5 channels (about $300 at the time 7 years ago) and it drove the speakers as loud as I could want in my room. A few years ago I upgraded to the Onkyo 805. The main reason was so that I could get, HDMI audio, the Audyssey MultiEQ XT and maybe I would notice a difference in the amps having more headroom. I haven't noticed much of a difference with the Audyssey in my room with my setup and having more headroom with the amp hasn't made much of a difference from what I have heard. Having HD audio (the uncompressed audio from Blu-Ray) IS something this is quite noticeable though.

The speakers that you are driving are quite efficient, not a tough load (like a 4 ohms) and you have a small room like me. I think it would be a waste of money spending too much money on a receiver. Just buy the receiver that has the features you want and are within your budget, nothing more. Having enough power should not be a problem. Also, if you spend say $1500 or $2000 on a receiver you will probably never want to upgrade it anytime in the near future, even if there is some new and cool feature that you would like to have (like height and width channels right now, for example). If you spend $300 to $600, then if there is a new feature that you really want, then it is not as much of an issue. The one thing to keep in mind though, is that you probably will not hear any difference between a $500 and $2000 receiver in your room.

#363157 - 01/09/12 12:02 PM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: Nick B]
dakkon Offline

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1846
Cork, just to throw something into the mix... I have a pair of speakers similar to the M3's and center similar to the VP100.. i am using a marantz mm9000@ 135W per channel to power them.. This setup is in my bedroom, which is about 12X12 or so.

#363233 - 01/10/12 08:13 AM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: dakkon]
Cork Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 79
Loc: Pennsylvania, US
Thanks for additional info guys. What I'm hearing is that the Marantz will work, probably just fine, but more power is better.

The only receiver I've found so far that has the features I want in my price range is a Yamaha RX-V671. The Denon AVR-2112 was close but doesn't have component out which I want. My max budget for a receiver is $650. (It's a secondary room, I can barely justify that.) And it's used primarily for music, say 90/10. So if anyone has any other receiver suggestions, I'm all ears. [network receiver, DLNA certified (and plays FLAC, which is non-standard DLNA), internet radio enabled, video upconversion, optical & coax audio inputs, component video inputs]

I have to confess that the reason I'm considering the Marantz is that it's smaller (hence the reduced power) and would fit on my bookcase. Otherwise I have to place it on top of the 7 foot bookcase as I do now. Since I'm 5'7', that makes things difficult at times; although remotes are a good thing and make the need to acces it directly far less frequent. The one out I have if I go with the Marantz and find I made a mistake is that it has 2.1 preouts; so I could amp the R/L, and just put the amp above the bookcase.

#363245 - 01/10/12 12:04 PM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: Cork]
dakkon Offline

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1846

not sure if you are familiar with them, but they are who i bought my marantz stuff from, and several other people on the forum like them as well..

You can look around their selection and see if they have something that will work for you for less $$$

#363345 - 01/10/12 10:21 PM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: dakkon]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10400
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Sounds like you would like an Onkyo, the refurbs at A4L are good sellers and of a good quality.


#363348 - 01/10/12 11:19 PM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: Cork]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10412
Cork, I assumed that the small size of the 1602 was a very significant factor and didn't suggest a somewhat larger alternative before. My suggestion for a unit in the same $500 price area would be the Onkyo 709 factory refurb(which should be at least as reliable as a brand new unit)available here from A4L for about $490. It has all the features which you've specified and a slightly higher 110 watt power rating. Incidentally, that's right what you say you've been "hearing", but both points can't be right: if the 1602 has enough power, more can't be "better" since it simply would be unused.

Another possibility at A4L, since you say that the 2112 would be fine except for not having component outs, would be the 2312 here which includes them at about $550. In my view the 709 would be the better buy for about $60 less.


Enjoy the music, not the equipment.

#364607 - 01/23/12 02:40 PM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: JohnK]
Cork Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 79
Loc: Pennsylvania, US
Okay, I'm back after a longish delay. (There must be some universal law that says when you are on the verge of a new toy, the bossman automatically increases your workload.)

I took the majority opinions into account ... and still got the Marantz 1602. But don't be put off, the recommendations had me looking into more options for a week and a half. I wanted the smaller form factor, although it still didn't fit on my shelf, the feature set was perfect, and since my lsat two receivers were Onkyos I was in the mood for something different.

I hooked everything up this weekend and it sounds very nice, and I'm loving all my new internet and network features (I didn't even have HDMI on my retired rcvr). But, while I get sufficent volume for any level I might want to crank, it's also true that I'm up to 60 of the maximum at normal levels, and I get to about 90% of the maximum (+1 db, for what that's worth) when I crank it to my worst rocking out volume.

So my question is, is running at those levels inherently bad? I think I could still get Amazon to take it back if I'm runnin gtoo high. (And feel free to also take this opportunity for I told you so's.)

#364622 - 01/23/12 06:35 PM Re: Minimum power for M22/VP100? [Re: Cork]
alan Offline

Registered: 01/29/02
Posts: 3191
Loc: Toronto/New York/Dwight
Hi Cork,

Despite the small room, I would have preferred you get a receiver with more power output "just in case" there might be a situation where after a few drinks, you "crank it up". With just 30 watts per channel, it would be easy to drive that unit into clipping. Axiom has replaced lots of drivers burned out by owners who've "cranked up" low-powered receivers in party situatons or in rooms that are far too large for the modest power output of their receivers.

By the way, consider the "0 dB" setting the maximum you should not exceed; it's a rough indication of the maximum clean amplifier output available from the receiver. Going above that risks possible clipping of one or more of the internal amplifiers, with the risk of burning out drivers from a feeding a momentary dirty distorted signal from an overdriven amp.

You should be OK if you don't exceed the "0 dB" indication.

Alan Lofft,
Axiom Resident Expert

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