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#381361 - 08/12/12 02:05 AM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: 2x6spds]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1182
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Originally Posted By: 2x6spds
No audible difference between Class A and Class D amplifiers? Really?




2X no one wins in a head butt lol and no will win this argument either. Seems both camps are firm in their position. Me i dont care , i'm more tim taylor, MORE POWER grin

For the doubter's Why did Pioneer pay Air Studio's in london to tune their sc 55 class d3 reciever , which delayed its release. So really how can we say amplifiers all sound the same ???


Edited by Socketman (08/12/12 02:10 AM)
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#381386 - 08/12/12 01:30 PM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: CV]
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
I agree with you about the obvious audio truth that all solid state amplifiers do not sound the same.

I agree when it comes to home theater, however, I respectfully disagree about MORE POWER concerning 2 channel music systems.

For me, 5-20 wpc from a Single End Triode tube amp is da audio bomb.
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Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.

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#381465 - 08/13/12 09:44 PM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: CV]
fredk Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 7040
Loc: Canada
Damn CV, you sure are getting your moneys worth out of Axiom. Disappointed women swooning over your posts, Andrew personally testing your gear...

I'm looking forward to your comments on the speakers as you listen to them more. Axiom has done something interesting here with their new offering and it would be great if they hit this one out of the park.
_________________________
Fred

-------
Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!

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#381482 - 08/14/12 02:39 AM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: fredk]
CV Offline
Founder, Axiom Upgrade Club
shareholder in the making

Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 11162
Loc: Richland, WA, USA
I still need to watch some movies with them. I'll try to do that this coming weekend. I wish I had more room to play with placement in my current room, but it's just not happening. As it is, I think they're over a foot from the wall, which I think is pretty good considering the space constraints. I'm really crossing my fingers for the basement being ready (even if it will still be far from truly finished) to move my system to by the end of summer. Then I can play with placement a lot more.

Just with the music I've been listening to, I do feel like the sound is more three-dimensional, though it does vary. Some material still wants to be flat. It also feels like it's playing cleaner at higher volumes, though I had v2 M80s, so that may have been improved by v3. Not that the M80s were lacking, really, but these just seem to go that little bit further.

For me, based on what I've heard so far, it's worth it, though this price point makes it hard to recommend to other people. They have to be in the market at this price point, I guess, and they have to be fine with getting just that little bit of extra performance. For the people with the disposable income, I'd say the LFRs are a good way to go. Granted, I don't have the means to directly compare them to other speakers in the price range. I wonder if any hobbyists ever get together around here. It would be a hassle, but I think it would be fun to get a conference room somewhere and see what gear people show up with. At least it would give me more points of reference.

Anyway, I'm very happy with what I've been able to achieve with Axioms in my home theater, and I think I can safely say I'll continue to support their research. One thing I'm hoping is they'll make it easy to upgrade the LFRs to newer versions. That's one reason I was hoping for a fully active external crossover. It's probably more of an ordeal if you're switching out the passive crossover. I'm curious if future versions might incorporate changes in the drivers that were made for Bryston's Axiom collaboration. The guy at Bryston made a big deal of transient response in that thread that was linked to. In any case, I'm just thinking I would rather be able to upgrade my LFRs in the future rather than trying to sell these and buy whatever future versions are released. It's not going to be easy for me to stay with Axiom flagships at this price is all.

Now I need to save for a new display, since my warranty ran out on my Sony SXRD (I got a 5-year warranty after the trouble with my first one--I can't believe it's been that long), and it feels like what's holding my system back at this point. Besides the room, I mean. I may still go with a projector, but I'm leaning toward a cheaper 65" plasma to last me until more laser projectors are out. That would at least give me 5 more inches and would probably give me faster HDMI switching. But an even larger image from a projector would be better.

Anyway, I still have more to get out of the LFRs, so I'm sure I'll have more to say after 1) I watch more movies, and 2) I move them into a better room.

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#381492 - 08/14/12 09:24 AM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: CV]
ClubNeon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/06/09
Posts: 3448
Loc: Western Maryland, USA
On the topic of displays: For my new place, I'm planning to get a cheap projector so I can get used to the tech, and work out setup bugs. Then when the prices of the lasers come down, I'll be ready.

This is the same thing I did when going from a CRT to a plasma. At the time I was wanting to upgrade plasmas were $5000, so I got a $500 LCD that had about the same viewable area as my 36" 4:3 CRT when showing a letter boxed movie. So it was more of a side-grade.

That's what I want to do again, something that's a side-grade from my 50" plasma. Probably a bigger picture, but not as deep blacks, or some small trade-off.
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Pioneer VSX-1018AH-K, PDP-5020FD, DV-79AVi
Axiom M22s, VP150, QS8s
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#381530 - 08/14/12 06:38 PM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: CV]
dakkon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1844
Originally Posted By: CV
The guy at Bryston made a big deal of transient response in that thread that was linked to. In any case, I'm just thinking I would rather be able to upgrade my LFRs in the future rather than trying to sell these and buy whatever future versions are released. It's not going to be easy for me to stay with Axiom flagships at this price is all.



I don't quite follow you on this one... It sounds like you want to get the Bryston Model T's, and have some buyers remorse due to future products? I thought about getting the Model t's myself. However, the Bryston's will be in the 10k$ price range. They also need 6 channels of amplification... Also, I think the primary changes to the Brystons were made to the 8" woofers (this is just a guess on my part).. Since the LFR's use 6 1'2" woofers,i don't know if the "upgrade" would be needed or available..

Since you asked about other brands in the same price range.

Another Brand i was considering was a pair of pre-owned Wilson Sasha's. These are going for 5-7k$ used.. However, since we were able to get the LFR's for 2,700$, i thought the LFR's were a much better value. I auditioned the Wilson's and they sounded quite nice; however, i think that the LFR's+ a pair of 600's out perform the wilson's by a long shot at the same price point. I would hypotheses that for the same amount of money one would spend on the Model T's you could get MUCH more performance from a combination of Axiom products. for 10k$, one could easily buy a pair of LFR's and a pair of EP-800's.


I think once you get your speakers moved into the basement, and there is a solid wall behind both of your LFR's you will notice a significant improvement.

I look forward to your future comments.

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#381543 - 08/14/12 08:02 PM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: dakkon]
fredk Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/06/07
Posts: 7040
Loc: Canada
Originally Posted By: dakkon
[quote=CV] ...for the same amount of money one would spend on the Model T's you could get MUCH more performance from a combination of Axiom products. for 10k$, one could easily buy a pair of LFR's and a pair of EP-800's.

Speaking of which, how's that pair of EP800s doing CV? grin

You're already high enough in the audioholic food chain that upgrading, no matter what it is to or from, will be painful unless you have a LOT of spare cash.
_________________________
Fred

-------
Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!

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#381562 - 08/15/12 12:04 AM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: dakkon]
CV Offline
Founder, Axiom Upgrade Club
shareholder in the making

Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 11162
Loc: Richland, WA, USA
Originally Posted By: dakkon
I don't quite follow you on this one... It sounds like you want to get the Bryston Model T's, and have some buyers remorse due to future products?


No, I was never in the market for the Model T. And there's no buyer's remorse at work. I'm satisfied with what the LFRs offer me over the M80s. I'm just saying that the improved transient response (if that's the term he was using) was a performance characteristic he was after, and if Axiom verifies an audible benefit to this design choice, I could see them incorporating a change in their own stock drivers. When these improvements accumulate into a new version number, it would simply be nice for owners of this generation to be able to more easily upgrade. I'd personally like to keep pace with Axiom's developments, so this is just me being greedy.

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#381564 - 08/15/12 12:07 AM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: fredk]
CV Offline
Founder, Axiom Upgrade Club
shareholder in the making

Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 11162
Loc: Richland, WA, USA
Originally Posted By: fredk
Speaking of which, how's that pair of EP800s doing CV? grin

You're already high enough in the audioholic food chain that upgrading, no matter what it is to or from, will be painful unless you have a LOT of spare cash.


True enough.

And the four EP800s are doing quite well. I was just watching the THX, DTS, and Dolby intros the other day at reference level, and wow, they sound (and feel) good.

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#381583 - 08/15/12 08:19 AM Re: LFR1100/ADA [Re: CV]
BlueJays1 Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 4077
Loc: Porch,enjoying Bombay Sapphire
Originally Posted By: CV
Originally Posted By: dakkon
I don't quite follow you on this one... It sounds like you want to get the Bryston Model T's, and have some buyers remorse due to future products?


No, I was never in the market for the Model T. And there's no buyer's remorse at work. I'm satisfied with what the LFRs offer me over the M80s. I'm just saying that the improved transient response (if that's the term he was using) was a performance characteristic he was after, and if Axiom verifies an audible benefit to this design choice, I could see them incorporating a change in their own stock drivers. When these improvements accumulate into a new version number, it would simply be nice for owners of this generation to be able to more easily upgrade. I'd personally like to keep pace with Axiom's developments, so this is just me being greedy.


Not only a change in the voice coil and mass but also in the driver material. The guy from Bryston states the cone material is a combination of magnesium/aluminum. Those are significant changes.
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