Get Free, Friendly, Expert Advice
Call 1-866-244-8796 or email

Designed and Manufactured in Canada Since 1980


AxiomAudio Blog

Positioning Floorstanding Speakers

Our Newest Flagship Model: The M100

Why We Make Our Own Drivers

Wall'O'Fame
My listening room
"Serenity Cinema", now with 40% extra Serenity!
Who's Online
0 registered (), 116 Guests and 11 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Financing
Forum Stats
12821 Members
11 Forums
22694 Topics
400704 Posts

Max Online: 378 @ 02/24/13 04:33 PM
Top Posters
Ken.C 17699
pmbuko 16227
SirQuack 13311
CV 11067
MarkSJohnson 10698
Meanwhile On Facebook

8| Don't miss Andrew Welker's post on our message boards about the new subwoofer...

󾓲 The April Newsletter is out! Did you get your copy? http://www.axiomaudio.co...

Double-take! :O How well do you know our line? First one to spot the surprise...

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#389926 - 02/20/13 11:37 PM XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci
gjtphx Offline
regular

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 9
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
Last year I moved to Denon AVR 3312ci from an old Denon AVR 2807. My dedicated media room is 22x20x10 in size. My 7.1 setup consists of 2 Axiom M60's (FL and FR), Axiom VP150 as centre channel, 4 Axiom QS8's as surrounds and one Axiom EP350 as Sub.

When I moved from Denon 2807 to 3312, I was expecting a significant improvement in the sound dynamics, but I only feel a marginal improvement.

My question is whether adding an Emotiva XPA-5 as a power amp for the first 5 speakers into my setup will improve the sound quality? Does anyone has a similar setup and seen significant improvement when they moved to XPA-5? Please advice.

Top
#389927 - 02/21/13 12:19 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10310
George, welcome. If the maximum output capability of an amplifier can meet the safe(to your hearing)sound levels of the speakers being used, there's no good reason to expect any audible difference with one having an even greater maximum output available(e.g.,the few watts difference between the 2807 and 3312 are likely meaningless). Unused headroom is simply that: unused.

Particularly with the amplifier in the EP350 carrying the load of the lowest bass frequencies, your 3312 should have more than enough capacity to do the job.
_________________________
-----------------------------------

Enjoy the music, not the equipment.



Top
#389960 - 02/21/13 08:31 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
cohesion Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/27/12
Posts: 159
Loc: Maple, Ontario, Canada
While John doesn't believe separate amps are any better than receivers some on here -- including me -- believe they do. I haven't personally heard any Emotiva gear but it seems to be generally well thought of and a few Axiomites use it. You might consider giving it a try under their 30 evaluation policy. That way if it really doesn't sound better you could return it.

Top
#389962 - 02/21/13 08:46 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: cohesion]
SBrown Offline
aficionado

Registered: 11/16/10
Posts: 806
Loc: Victoria,BC
Yes amps do make a difference, how much you want to spend and how far you want to go is another story.


I think Axiom has figured this out now with the ADAs and its the way to go. I just have to start putting more money aside....
_________________________
Beauty is in the eye of the beer holder.

Top
#389963 - 02/21/13 08:57 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
dakkon Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 02/08/04
Posts: 1807
My room is 17X18X18, and i had to get larger amps.. I would also recommend getting a larger center channel, either the 160, or 180.. I went from a 135w per channel amp, to 500W per channel amps. The reason for buying more power was that i was driving the 135W amp into the clipping region. You have a lot of air space to fill, depending on what volume you listen to movies, you will benefit from more power.


However, with that being said i agree with John, that it won't "sound" better.. You will just be able to drive the speakers father without driving your amp into the clipping region.


Right now i have 3 amps. two 2 channel amps, and a 3 channel amp... i have 7 channels of amplification because i have a pair of LFR's which use 2 channels of amplification each.

Top
#389967 - 02/21/13 10:13 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10394
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
You kind of went for a straight across move going from the 2807 to the 3312 as the 33XX series replaced the 28XX series.

To potentially see/hear a difference you would have to move up to the 4XXX series. I will bet you will notice a difference by adding an external amp to your system, whether or not this difference is worth the cost outlay is up to you and your ears.
_________________________
Jason
-----------------
TTTHHHPPPPPTTTT!

My HT

Top
#389968 - 02/21/13 10:18 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
Boltron Offline
veteran

Registered: 11/18/11
Posts: 166
Loc: Toronto
I ran a Denon 4311ci in a 7.2 setup with my M80s(set as small), VP150, QS4/8s. It all worked fine of course but at higher levels with some action movies (Super 8 train crash for example) I really felt that the receiver was running out of oomph. I subsequently got a 3 ch ADA1000 for the M80s and VP150 and there is a noticeable difference when the mood takes me to crank it up a bit. As an added bonus I could run my M80s in full range (large) and to my ears the overall sound is better. I love the M80s and I want them at their fullest, I couldn't run them as large with the Denon.

IMO, an external amp is a must in my 22 x 16 room. I am considering upgrading to an ADA1200 actually.


Edited by Boltron (02/21/13 10:20 PM)
_________________________
--For every expert, there is an equal and opposite expert.

Top
#389970 - 02/21/13 10:31 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13311
Loc: Iowa
George, amps don't make things sound better, they amplify what is fed to them, which is why there was little difference between your 2 Denons. No different than my 2805 versus 3808ci. They both have decent amp sections.

As Dakkon mentioned, more power will get you a little bit further without straining or clipping, that is if you even use that extra power.

Understand by doubling your power (for ex. 100 to 200 watts) only achieves and increase of 3dB. There are some other variables like room size, placement, etc. that can affect the outcome, but this mathematical equation is good to understand.

There is a lot of topics that could take this into different directions (for ex, capacitance amount, damping, etc) which can vary from amp to amp, but for normal listening at moderate levels you most likely won't hear a difference.

With that said, I like Outlaw amps much more than Emotiva, long story. smile
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

Top
#389976 - 02/22/13 12:08 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
CatBrat Offline
axiomite

Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 5664
Loc: Some random location
There is a difference between MCACC and Audyssey. I get more bass with less shrillness in the upper range with Pioneer's MCACC.

Top
#389978 - 02/22/13 12:35 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
mpyw Offline
local

Registered: 07/24/09
Posts: 279
Loc: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Hi,

I have a pair of M60 and VP150 and driving them with XPA-3 through an Onkyo NR808.

Trust me, the extra power from the XPA will make the M60 sings.

My room size is 22x18x10.

Top
#390076 - 02/24/13 02:09 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
gjtphx Offline
regular

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 9
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
Thanks Everyone .. I will get a XPA-5 and VP160 ... and will update the results really soon.
_________________________
2 M80 HP, 1 VP160 & 4 QS8
Emotiva XPA-2, XPA-5
Denon 3312ci
Oppo BDP-103
Onkyo C-7030
Arcam irDAC

Top
#390189 - 02/25/13 06:34 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13311
Loc: Iowa
you get what you pay for.
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

Top
#390197 - 02/25/13 09:25 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: SirQuack]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1010
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Originally Posted By: PorterPlex
you get what you pay for.


Care to expand on that thought??
_________________________
DOG is GOD spelled backwards.

Top
#390207 - 02/25/13 11:15 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
jakewash Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 12/26/03
Posts: 10394
Loc: Calgary, Alberta
Randy has a bad taste in his mouth from an experience he had with Emotiva a number of years back.
_________________________
Jason
-----------------
TTTHHHPPPPPTTTT!

My HT

Top
#390209 - 02/26/13 12:04 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
Socketman Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 07/12/09
Posts: 1010
Loc: Whitehorse YT
Nuff said, once bitten twice shy.
_________________________
DOG is GOD spelled backwards.

Top
#391635 - 04/02/13 10:06 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
AdrianD Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/09/12
Posts: 85
Loc: Maple, Ontario
So? Did you get the XPA-5?
I have this amp, although I'm driving my fronts M80s with a pair of Emotiva UPA-1 monoblocks; personally, I think the separates bring more to the table than a receiver.
I just finished watching The Life of Pi on Blu-Ray... very good movie; we all jumped of the couch a few times :-).
_________________________
M80 v3, 2 x Emotiva UPA-1 Monoblocks, XPA-5, UMC-1 PrePro
Pro-Ject RPM Genie, Carver C2 Phono Preamp

Top
#391902 - 04/11/13 01:34 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
troyd Offline
local

Registered: 02/17/04
Posts: 288
SO, yeh did you get the XPA ?
I remember Porters rant(s) on the Emo a few yrs back lol I do not even need that high volumn listening.
_________________________
HK 3490
M80 HG Cherry
2x Energy ESW10 Subs

Top
#392112 - 04/17/13 06:56 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
SirQuack Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 01/29/04
Posts: 13311
Loc: Iowa
wasn't a rant actually, factual info that Lonnie himself from Emo ended up agreeing it was their limiter circuit that was a flawed design on the MPS1. for some reason a few individuals like to blame the m80's
_________________________
M80s-VP180-QS8s-EP600-2xEP350 Denon3808 Outlaw7700
M22-OWM22-VP100-Denon2805
Audio Nirvana

Top
#397864 - 10/16/13 08:25 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: AdrianD]
gjtphx Offline
regular

Registered: 02/20/13
Posts: 9
Loc: Phoenix, AZ
Originally Posted By: AdrianD
So? Did you get the XPA-5?


Sorry for the late reply. Yes I got the XPA-5 and I liked it so much that I ordered a XPA-2 for my front speakers. Emotiva amps have really changed the way I listen to music and watch movies. I upgraded my centre channel to VP-160. I am waiting for the delivery of SVS SB13-Ultra sub tomorrow. I will be further upgrading my front speakers to the new M80's coming in December.
_________________________
2 M80 HP, 1 VP160 & 4 QS8
Emotiva XPA-2, XPA-5
Denon 3312ci
Oppo BDP-103
Onkyo C-7030
Arcam irDAC

Top
#398563 - 11/14/13 10:50 PM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
jman54 Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/14/13
Posts: 1
I may have a different perspective on this. I own the M80, v150 & QS8 with the ep500. I bought 2 Emotiva XPA-1 amps to run my M80's. these amps are rated 1000w/4 ohm, the improvement in quality ranges from 20 to >100% depending on what I am playing.
My perspective is that it's not about the size of the room or volume (actually I saw no change in volume), it's all about having enough power to drive the speakers. I saw improvement thru the entire spectrum, I hear thing I didn't before with my 140w x 7, Yamaha rxv3800 which is now my preamp and still powers my surround and center channels. I saw no reason to increase the power to the other speakers nor do I think it would matter, they provide only an effect or enhancement in surround plus I listen to music in stereo most of the time. Bottom line is that I saw a huge improvement in quality and think it was definitely worth the money.


Edited by jman54 (11/14/13 10:53 PM)

Top
#398663 - 11/19/13 07:35 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: jman54]
AdrianD Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/09/12
Posts: 85
Loc: Maple, Ontario
Originally Posted By: gjtphx
Sorry for the late reply...

When I got my gear, the last thing on my mind was the forums shocked . I'm glad you enjoy your setup; when you get those M80s, you'll be ecstatic.

Originally Posted By: jman54
...I saw improvement thru the entire spectrum, I hear thing I didn't before with my 140w x 7... Bottom line is that I saw a huge improvement in quality and think it was definitely worth the money.

Right on the dot; I experienced the same until I hosted a first party with the (then) new gear. I added to the list of improvements clean, loud sheer power.
_________________________
M80 v3, 2 x Emotiva UPA-1 Monoblocks, XPA-5, UMC-1 PrePro
Pro-Ject RPM Genie, Carver C2 Phono Preamp

Top
#398667 - 11/19/13 11:29 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: gjtphx]
JBG Offline
devotee

Registered: 06/14/02
Posts: 375
I have an XPA-5 ...only 2 complaints are the rear rca terminal connections (one broke) they sent a replacement board which I had to change. next complaint is the heat generated .. my next amp purchase would either be D-sonic or Axiom
_________________________
Epic 100 * 180HP * 500 all V4 * 4x QS8's * MRX-500 + XPA-5 * Epson 3010 * Shakers * Harmony 1100

Top
#398750 - 11/22/13 07:40 AM Re: XPA-5 with Axiom Speakers and Denon 3312ci [Re: JBG]
AdrianD Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/09/12
Posts: 85
Loc: Maple, Ontario
Originally Posted By: Johnny_Be_Good
I have an XPA-5 ...only 2 complaints are the rear rca terminal connections (one broke) they sent a replacement board which I had to change. next complaint is the heat generated .. my next amp purchase would either be D-sonic or Axiom

Emotiva is not perfect... that's for sure; but it offers very good quality for the money.
I have 2 x UPA-1 monoblocks, 2 x UMC-1 Prepros and an XPA-5; I do frequently change components and test things but never had an issue, although I pay much attention to the cables because the RCAs do "feel" flimsy.
As for the overheating... you must either listen at insane levels for long time and have very inefficient speakers. I was never able to get my XPA-5 to heat up more than warm to the hand.
_________________________
M80 v3, 2 x Emotiva UPA-1 Monoblocks, XPA-5, UMC-1 PrePro
Pro-Ject RPM Genie, Carver C2 Phono Preamp

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >



Moderator:  alan, Amie, Andrew, axiomadmin, Brent, Debbie, Ian, Jc 

Home  |  Corporate Info  |  Products  |  Message Board  |  FAQs  |  Warranty  |  Site Map  |  Privacy Statement   |  Contact Us

©2014 Colquhoun Audio Laboratories Limited
All Rights Reserved.