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#53929 - 10/21/04 12:18 AM Re: OT: Politics
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
See the debris? How many folks or parts among them?



You want to entertain that the 9/11 attacks were media fabrications, a CIA plot, the work of the Jews, never happened, that there is no terrorist threat, that the terrorists did not attack us, that there is no war being waged by Islamo-Fascists against the West, that they didn't take the heads of Nick Berg, Daniel Pearl, Jim Bigley, etc. etc. etc., Islamo-Fascists are not committing genocide in Darfur, they are not killing Sikhs, Hindus, Ba'hais, Buddhists, they're not really blowing busses, murdering hundreds of school kids at a time, blowing up pizza parlors, naming streets after murderers ... right, PMB, let's discuss how what's happening isn't happening, I mean, after all, the Guardian says what is - isn't, good enough for you is it?
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#53930 - 10/21/04 12:32 AM Re: OT: Politics
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16227
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
The fact that it occured is precisely the reason we need to be damned sure it was really the act of a globally powerful organization and not just the coincidence of good planning and poor security.

But it's the fear instilled in us that it can happen again "at any time" that this documentary focuses on. Yes, they got us once, and in a way we couldn't possibly ignore. Did you know not a single person we've captured in the wake of 9/11 has been convincingly tied to Al-Qaeda, and that the name "Al Qaeda" was only coined after 9/11 because it was legally necessary to have a named target in order to prosecute the uncaptured bin Laden? The War on Terror presupposes a globally-connected terror network. There's simply no evidence to support the existence of such a network.
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"I wish I had documented more…" said nobody on their death bed, ever.

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#53931 - 10/21/04 12:36 AM Re: OT: Politics
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
Personally, I think "Al Qaeda" is a public relations fig leaf for the great Jihad - an ad hoc action group, one of many who play to the crowd, to the cheering multitude.
_________________________
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#53932 - 10/21/04 12:42 AM Re: OT: Politics
pmbuko Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 16227
Loc: Leesburg, Virginia
2x6, I've seen the pics and don't need to be reminded.

Your knee must have jerked right into your jaw because you're putting words into my mouth yet again. Neither I nor the documentary producer ever made the suggestion that the attacks on 9/11 were a fabrication. Where you got that idea is beyond me, really. Neither did he suggest there is no terrorist threat. He is suggesting that the theat to us has been blown way out of proportion, and the threat as described to us by our leaders is not based on facts, but fear.

The fact is, you can't think rationally in a state of fear. You know, what FDR said, and all that.
_________________________
"I wish I had documented more…" said nobody on their death bed, ever.

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#53933 - 10/21/04 12:53 AM Re: OT: Politics
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
I believe you participated in the thread where some folks here suggested that no airliner hit the Pentagon, but rather it was a military cruise missile - by inference, one of our own. You may believe what you call the "terrorist threat" is exaggerated - I believe there is a war being fought against us. The EU knows it as well, but are looking to make their separate peace, their accommodation. I think that by suggesting that the "terrorist threat" is exaggerated, the necessary inference is that our efforts are unbalanced - an over reaction. I disagree. I think we our response is fitfull, tentative, and in search of coherence, but better than the policies which I would expect from Kerry.
_________________________
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#53934 - 10/21/04 04:00 AM Re: OT: Politics
AdamP88 Offline
aficionado

Registered: 08/12/03
Posts: 639
Loc: Omaha, NE
It's time once again to go off on a tangent.

In reply to:

So, PMB, do you sense that the Democratic Party has drifted somewhere into the dark regions of insanity?




Speaking of drifting into the regions of insanity...

http://www.yubanet.com/artman/publish/article_14313.shtml

Yes, the Bush administration is standing by it's approval of a book that claims that the Grand Canyon was carved by Noah's flood. And the promised review on the legality and appropriateness of government agencies selling Christian viewpoints apparently never took place.

Quite honestly, it scares me that the current presidential administration approves this book. When our government pushes religious fundamentalism instead of truth, I get a little worried.

Separation of Church and State? What's that?



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#53935 - 10/21/04 10:31 AM Re: OT: Politics
bigjohn Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 3016
Loc: San Angelo, TX
2x6- i think pulling out those pics and posting them is the 'classic' scare tactic that all republicans are clinging to right now. every single interview, news clip, or article i see on george w, he is ranting on and on about war, world terror, and immenent(sp) danger. i even saw cheney go so far as to say that if kerry is elected, a nuclear attack on american soil is inevitable.. ? WHAT?? how could he possibly know that.. its plain and simple scare tactics.

george, dick, donald, rush, you, and the rest of the war loving republicans, try to keep the edge by making people fear a 'what if' scenario. every day is a 'what if' scenario, regardless of who is the president. and i think the republican party is desperate, and just like you showing the 9/11 pics, they are promoting fear in america, and then using it to their advantage. its really kinda sad..

bigjohn
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#53936 - 10/21/04 11:20 AM Re: OT: Politics
jorge016 Offline
local

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 246
Loc: Minnesota
2X6-thanks for the pix-did Saddam send those planes? I just might let my wife put her Kerry/Edwards sign on our yard yet.
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#53937 - 10/21/04 11:35 AM Re: OT: Politics
2x6spds Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 03/16/02
Posts: 2726
Loc: CA, USA
Hello fellas

Gotta make this quick as I have a mountain to move here ...

No, Saddam did not "send the planes," no one "sent" the planes. The planes were hijacked by cadres of Jihadists who comforted the passengers, won their trust, convinced them to sit in terror with the promise that they were heading back to the airport and then used as missiles full of Jet-A to bring down the twin towers, Pentagon, and one probably on its way to the White House or Capitol went down in Pennsylvania.

The pictures were in response to PMB's argument that the "terrorist threat" is being exaggerated for political purposes by the administration. I think folks forget what we are dealing with.

As to the reasons for going to war in Iraq, refer back to previous posts. If a refresher is required, I'll get back to y'all later.
_________________________
Enjoy the Music. Trust your ears. Laugh at Folks Who Claim to Know it All.

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#53938 - 10/21/04 12:36 PM Re: OT: Politics
jorge016 Offline
local

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 246
Loc: Minnesota
I'll be waiting for that refresher. Maybe we could rehash the Deulfer report and the look on Bush's face when asked about 3 things he had done wrong in his tenure. Inability to admit and correct mistakes will keep us in Iraq for a long time.
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