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#63221 - 10/11/04 10:57 PM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
bridgman Offline
axiomite

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 5446
Loc: Bowmanville, Ontario, Canada
>>If I change to my 1990 Denon DRA 325 50 Watt stereo receiver, I will not have the option of connecting the CD player via the optical audio (toslink? - someone help me with the terminology here) connection. How important is this?

My first impression is that most people with a good (well, "better than crappy") CD player tend to stay with analog signals and slightly prefer them. My "really cheap" CD changer seems to sound better with a digital coax connection than with the analog connection.

I'm starting to suspect that middling-good CD players have good analog output quality and sound great with analog connections while the cheapest of the cheap have crappy analog outputs and sound better with a digital feed.

If your receiver does not have a "pure analog / bypass all the DSP stuff" mode (aka "Stereo Direct" etc..) then I imagine a digital connection is the way to go. Stereo receivers always operate in "bypass all the DSP stuff" mode cause they normally don't HAVE a DSP

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#63222 - 10/11/04 11:47 PM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
DJ_Stunna Offline
aficionado

Registered: 10/09/03
Posts: 604
Loc: Baltimore. MD. USA (but born a...
JohnK - I don't think that the formula would apply to the switcher device. It would have to be a bad switcher for it to not run some in series and some in parallel.

I have a 4 way switcher, and it runs some channels in parallel and others in a series. If all 4 are enabled, my switcher will present the same impedance as a single pair (assuming all impedances are equal). Only running 1 and 2 or 1 and 4 give 1/2 original impedance and running 1 and 3 or 2 and 4 give double the original impedance. It's not like mine was of high quality either... It's just some $35 toy I got from a local Rat Shack years ago. I'd be surprised if Forghorn's didn't do that as well...

_________________________

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#63223 - 10/12/04 09:50 AM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
Foghorn Offline
local

Registered: 07/17/04
Posts: 226
Thanks for the info, but in some ways I am just more confused.
What is digital vs analog vs optical? To connect my CD player to my receiver I have 2 options: A single optical (TOS link) cable or a double (R and L) cable. Are those "digital" or "analog" or something else?

I don't know about the impedance calculation, but when I switched the receiver to a lower impedance setting, the situation improved dramatically. Here is a link to the "switcher" - actually "speaker selector" - I got the SDB 4.1.

http://www.russound.com/speaker_selectors.htm

It seems to work fine, but the connections are limited to 14g max and I wonder if that is enough for optimum sound (I know, here goes the cable debate again, but if I'm not mistaken, most people here recommend 12g - right?)

Also, because I want the subwoofer to be only as loud as the M22s in the living room, it is now connected through the "speaker selector" whereas before when I only had one room, I had it connected through the subwoofer "out" and it doesn't sound nearly as good no matter where I set the crossover. Any suggestions?

Thanks again.

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#63224 - 10/12/04 11:20 AM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
Ajax Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/30/03
Posts: 6255
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Foghorn,

There are two types of digital connections possible between player and receiver. One is an optical connection (TOSLink), the other is a coaxial connection (SPDIF). You know what a TOSLink cable looks like. The coaxial digital cable is just a regular interconnect with RCA plugs at either end. The outputs and inputs where you plug in the "double (R and L) cable" are ANALOG, not digital.

Lets start at the CD or DVD disk itself. The information on the disk is digital (1s and 0s). Your speakers, however, are analog. So, somewhere between the disk and the speakers, the digital information must be converted into analog information.

If your player has both digital and analog outputs, then the player has DACs (Digital to Analog Converters. Actually I don't know if there is only one or if there's more, but regardless, the player has something, DAC(s), that convert the digital signal to an analog signal).

But your receiver ALSO has DAC(s) that can do the same job. If you hooked up the player to the receiver with a digital connection the the information on the disk stays in the digital domain until it gets to the receiver. If you use the analog connection between player and receiver, then the player converts the digital info into analog. In order to take advantage of the digital processing in your receiver (DD, DTS, etc.), the receiver must receive a digital signal. If you send the receiver ONLY an analog signal, all you're gonna get is stereo.

As this wire table will show you 14 gauge wire is just fine for just about everything except a cable run of over 40 feet to a 4 ohm speaker. Most of us use 12 gauge just to be on the safe side. No big deal.

Don't quite understand your subwoofer problem, but if you connect the sub to the "sub" or "LFE" output of your receiver, and properly calibrate all your speakers, your sub should be balanced with the 22s just fine.

I'm not an expert, so anybody that feels I haven't quite presented this correctly, please correct me.
_________________________
Jack

"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton

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#63225 - 10/12/04 08:47 PM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
bridgman Offline
axiomite

Registered: 08/25/04
Posts: 5446
Loc: Bowmanville, Ontario, Canada
>>Don't quite understand your subwoofer problem, but if you connect the sub to the "sub" or "LFE" output of your receiver, and properly calibrate all your speakers, your sub should be balanced with the 22s just fine.

I think the question here is "if I have speakers hooked up in two rooms, but the subwoofer is only in one room, how do I wire things up so the sub only runs when I am in that room ?". Sounds like Foghorn was using the sub out before but switched to using the "high level inputs" on the sub (connected to speaker outs from the amp) so the sub would only be active when the speakers in that room were active.

My understanding is that you normally get a small loss of sound quality when using high level inputs (since the signal now has gone through the amp as well and is brought down to line level with resistors) but the difference should be pretty small.

Your description of analog vs. coax digital vs. optical digital was nice, should be a stickie

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#63226 - 10/12/04 09:13 PM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
Ajax Offline
axiomite

Registered: 12/30/03
Posts: 6255
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio
Thanks John. Now I understand Foghorn's subwoffer dilemma. I still can't help him with it, but at least I understand it.
_________________________
Jack

"People generally quarrel because they cannot argue." - G. K. Chesterton

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#63227 - 10/13/04 09:54 AM Re: Yamaha HTR 5740 (6.1) for stereo in multiple rooms
Foghorn Offline
local

Registered: 07/17/04
Posts: 226
Thanks all. The subwoofer issue is as described and I have pretty much figured out that it is likely a combination of using the high level input and positioning of the speakers. Once we got the house all wired for the 3 rooms the subwoofer was placed in the bottom cabinet with stuff (boxes of board games, etc.) sharing the space leaving it only about 3" in the back and 1" on each side to breathe - so I am going to have to negotiate with my wife on this issue. The M22s don't sound nearly as good now that they are pushed back into the cabinets either. When I had all 3 speakers just sitting out "cluttering up" the (>8000 cubic feet) room the system sounded great. I wish I had never heard it like that so I wouldn't know what I am missing - of course then I would be here saying Axioms are not that great...

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