Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Saying hello, M22's vs M40/50/60 for roomsize

Greetings to all. I am thinking about my next speaker purchase, and after doing a little research online found that Axiom seem to have an extremely good reputation both in terms of speaker quality and company satisfaction. As of a week ago I hadn't even heard of Axiom, and was pretty much convinced that a higher-grade Energy or Paradigm would be my next set of speakers. So I'm here to offer a friendly hello and ask for a little bit of advice from all of the wise Axiom owners here. I've read through many, many old posts gathering info, but I wanted to get all of your takes on the situation.

My setup consists of a Pioneeer Elite VSX-43TX receiver (absolutely love it), Sony DVP-NC650V SACD/DVD player, Energy Take 5.1 L,R,C,LR,RR speakers, and a Kenwood 10" sub. I am quite happy with the Energy's for home theater purposes, but am looking for more depth and warmth from music sources, particularly from traditional Classical fare and Contemporary Jazz (Spyro Gyra, Rippingtons, Marc Antoine, Keiko Matsui, etc..) SACD's. Franlky though, between my wife and I we listen to about everything - so these speakers need to be able to handle a wide range of music, including some Aerosmith, Metallica, and Top40 stuff. Our entertainment room measures 19x15x8, with the mains along the 19' stretch of wall, so the primary listening positions are a scant 6-7 feet from the mains.

I emailed Axiom and got a reallly wonderful response from Alan Lofft, but I am eager for even more input. His advice is that the M22's would probably be ideal for this situation, and I agree that they're really nice and would be a vast improvement over what I currently have. Asthetically (sp?) my wife and I are leaning more towards towers than bookshelves, but sound is paramount here, not looks.

So what about the m40 & m50? It seems that these two have a less-than amazing reputation around here, and I'm curious as to why (especially since the Overstock store has m40's for less than $400/pair.) I've read many posts saying that for most applications, the m22 and m60's are the best, with the m80's being the ultimate if you've got the room. I really don't think my area is large enough to let the m60's "breathe".

What does everyone else think?

Thank you for any and all advice, I really will appreciate it!

Eager to become an Axiom fan,
Peter Chenoweth

Welcome, Peter. First, although this may be only a matter of semantics, depth and warmth in sound are characteristics of the original recording; we should be looking for speakers which accurately reproduce those characteristics, neither increasing nor decreasing them with unusual dispersion characteristics or response fluctuations. The M22s do this at a relative bargain price, but you may be disappointed if that's not what you're looking for. In my view, they're ideal.

The M3, M40 and M50 use a different driver for the mid-range than do the M2, M22, M60 and M80. That area is slightly depressed or "laid-back", which some prefer and which tends to make some poorly recorded pop items less intolerable.

Peter,

I would definitely go for the M22s in your situation. I also own a pair and listen to CDs and SACDs of "just about everything" like you do (including Metallica). Mine are about 8 to 9 feet away from the listening position and also about 8 feet apart. (My living room is roughly 12' x 13', with the speakers along the 12' wall.)

This past March, I upgraded from Paradigm Monitor 9 speakers, which were very much larger and heftier than the M22s. I was expecting a side-grade (no improvement in performance, just a smaller package), but I ended up with a much better speaker overall. So many more details came through the M22s than I had ever heard with the Paradigms. In retrospect, the tower speakers were way too big for my room and that could have been a large part of why I wasn't hearing everything I should have.

You say that you're looking for more depth and warmth. The M22s have a very flat frequency response across the board, so that makes them borderline cool with almost no coloration. Thus, they are highly accurate, so when Lars bangs on that darn snare drum, it's going to bite your head off. In other words, these speakers won't add warmth where none existed before. The speakers really shine with high quality recordings and SACDs are truly impressive on them.

I don't want to make you nervous about high recording quality being a requirement, so I'll tell you that I also play back my MP3 collection through my M22s and the majority of them sound great, too.

Thanks for the great replies! By warmth I mean to say decent low-midrange response. If I'm confusing terms I appologize. In some pieces of music, there's just not enough oomph in the low end of the mid-range to really satisfy. I know it's there, as I can listen to a particular CD via a nice set of headphones or through (heaven forbid) my old Sony speakers and hear midrange "warmth" that the Energy's just don't have in that specific range.

For instance, a Yo Yo Ma's solo cello SACD I like has some amazing runs up and down the range of his cello, while the highs and mids and deep lows sound great (I'm sure they'll sound even better with some Axiom's ), there is definately some mid-range lacking somewhere around the 100-200hz range that neither the little 3.5" Take 5 woofers (for lack of a better term), nor my 10" sub can handle effectively. It is precisely that weakness that I am trying to fix in my quest for "the next level" of speakers.

The M22's with a good subwoofer would be perferct for you. Your room isn't really large enough to need the extra the M60's can give you.

Don't skimp on the subwoofer. I HIGHLY recommend the Hsu VTF-2. Many Axiom board members have the M22/Hsu combo (as I did) and it's an amazing combo.

I think you nailed the lack of warmth that you are hearing within this response. I would be very surprised if there was not a hole in the frequency response with your current equipment. There is a limit to how much bass a small cone and enclosure can produce, and you do not want to force your subwoofer to handle frequencies much above 100 Hz as you will then be able to localize the source. I'm curious as to your reasons for leaning toward tower speakers? I believe that as your room size and distance from the speakers diminishes, there is better imaging from speakers that approximate a point source, that is, all the sound originating from a single spot. Anyone care to comment on that?

The only reason we're really leaning towards a tower is that we have it stuck in our minds that towers will sound better than bookshelves, and be more visually impressive. I know, I know, silly. I know it's simply not true that towers are always better than bookshelves, but stereotypes can be hard to break! :-)

Also, it's the fact that with the 22's we would definately need more substantial speaker stands, and from my perspective I'd almost rather spend more money on the speakers themselves, than the speakers and nice stands.

The more comments I'm getting, the more I'm really warming up to the idea of the 22's.

If you rearrange your room so that you're more than 10 feet away from the speakers, then I'll heartily recommend the M60s to ya.

Yep...If you can get yourselves back from them, the M60's are indeed a better speaker. I'd even suggest more than 10'.

But if you're sitting close, and don't intend on really BLASTING the volume, the M22's and a sub is a better choice.

I have the M22s and an Adire Rava subwoofer, I must say that the audio quality is unbelievable. I wouldn't hesitate to recommend the M22s to anyone. You might also consider getting these speakers, and upgrading your subwoofer later. I don't know how good your current sub sounds, but adding high quality bass really does compliment the M22's sound.