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Hi 2x6'
I worked with Joe V. for a period of time which was way too short. I learned alot from Joe and I'm still admiring the man he was. I also learned a great deal from Amie C. she was very patient, supporting and encouraging. Noreen who is still a key actor at Axiom; she is always there for me - she is my idol. These three exceptional persons are a very though act to follow. Despites my efforts, I know that I cannot be their equal but not many persons who I know could be.

You bought a pair of M3 speakers which were sold to you as M3v2 which I understand can be disappointing when a newer verison is only introduced a few days later. Axiom which, is a customer oriented company like I never seen, migrates its products incrementally to a new version to minimize the frustration of its clientèle. As Brent and I wrote you, yours were missing the magnet grilles and the white dust caps. For sure, they could not be identified as v3 which would have been false representation.

I do understand your frustration but sonically your M3 are v3.

Really?!?

JC, let me give you a bit of advice. Integrity is everything! It is the firm foundation on which trust is based. That bullet proof integrity characterized my interactions wtih Noreen, Joe V. and Amie. You and Brent are on the wrong path. I have always regarded Axiom as a company which operates on a much higher ethical level than the rest of the herd. Be careful you don't become just more bull.

Here's the email train between me and Axiom in which I was repeatedly assured that I had purchased M3V3s.

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Re: Axiom Audio Response to Your Request
AXIOM AUDIO.COM - JC [jc@axiomaudio.com]
You replied on 7/2/2010 12:25 AM
Extra line breaks in this message were removed.

Sent: Thu 7/1/2010 12:19 PM
To: Phil
Philip,

They are v3 except for the grille and woofer dust cap.
jc

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Phil" <levylaw1@cox.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 1:35 PM
To: <jc@axiomaudio.com>
Subject: RE: Axiom Audio Response to Your Request

Hello Jean-Claud

11058071006102 and 103

Please let me know. Please also let me know how to tell the difference between the new V3 tweeter and the V2. The woofer appears to be all white in the V3 and mine are black eyed peas. Let me know if there are ANY differences other than the color of the center nipple of the woofer between
V3 and V2. Any cross-over differences?

Philip Levy


-----Original Message-----
From: jc@axiomaudio.com [mailto:jc@axiomaudio.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 01, 2010 7:43 AM
To: levylaw1@cox.net
Subject: Axiom Audio Response to Your Request


Hi Philip,

My name is JC (Jean-Claude). I am an expert audio advisor at Axiom.

It is always a pleasure to hear back from an Axiom owner.

Brent is on vacations until July 14th. Please, email me the serial number of your M3 and I will be able to confirm its status.

Thanks again for your e-mail! If you would like me to me to follow-up directly by phone, just drop me a line with an appropriate time and a number for me to do so. Alternatively, you are always welcome to dial Axiom's toll-free number (1-866-244-8796) - any of our Audio Experts would be pleased to help.

Have a nice day !

JC
Jean-Claude Benoît
Axiom Audio Expert
1.866.244.8796
jc@axiomaudio.com
Read about me: http://www.axiomaudio.com/JC.html www.axiomaudio.com Are you an Axiom Audiophile? Sign up for the free monthly Axiom Newsletter!
http://www.axiomaudio.com/newsletter.html
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Hi Brent

Boy, I sure felt better after your explanation that my new M3s were V3s and not V2s. I was afraid that just because my new M3s have a label saying V2 on their backsides, and had the push-on grills instead of the magnetic ones they were really M3V2s. I was relieved when you told me the only differences between the V3 and V2 are the magnetic grills and a cosmetic change to the tweeter. You told me that at least I got the new tweeter!

But, oh, no, my tweeter is not the new one. The magnetic grills we already know about. But holy samolies, I just checked the webiste and notice the new V3s also have different 6 1/2" drivers! So, my M3V3s have the old tweeter, the old grill covers and the old 6 1/2" drivers. Maybe the label on the back which indicates "V2" is for real. What do you think?

I am very disappointed. You assured me I would be getting V3s when I ordered my pair. You assured me today that my M3s are V3s despite the label. I will go so far as to say this is very disturbing to me.

I bought my first pair of Axioms in about 2003. Since then I've bought M2es, M3Tis, M22s, M50s, VP150s, QS8s, a bunch of Meraks. I have referred quite a few people who on my recommendation purchased Axioms speakers. This is not right.

Is this public display really necessary or helpful?

Well somebody's timeline has got to be wrong here. That, or there was some miscommunication.

2x6, is it possible (I'm asking, not stating fact or accusing ) that by the time you requested the change/upgrade to v3 the custom finish on the M3 cabinet was already complete? In this scenario, the best that Axiom could do would be to ensure that all of the internal components are v3. With the holes already drilled out for the old grilles, I don't think it would be possible for them to convert the cabinet into the magnetic grilled version.

Never mind, looks like you already knew you weren't getting the magnetic grilles. It also looks like you ordered them before the June 30th release of the v3's, so that would explain the black capped drivers. BTW, according to Axiom all of the recently sold black capped drivers are the same identical driver as the v3 other than cap colour. They've also stated that they've been implementing the v3 changes/improvements into the recent "v2" orders, which is probably why they are assuring you that your M3's are sonically equal to the v3's.

RE-read my question. I asked for clarification, and was not accusing you of anything. If you ordered V3's, demand a replacement, I would. If you ordered V2's, then you got what you ordered. It really doesn't get any simpler than that.

Call me what you will, I don't really give a damn what you think of me.

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here at all, nor am I taking any sides between Dr. House and Tom. I have no quarrels with anyone here. Everyone has disagreements, there's nothing wrong with that. But I would like to point out something that I saw in this particular arguement just as a 3rd party observation.

Take it out of the context in which it was presented here on the Axiom forum and put it in say, oh the Paradigm forum for example. So a loyal Paradigm owners has a sister looking to get herself a system on a strict budget. Knowing that she probably won't be able to afford a Paradigm set-up the brother asks if anyone has any experience with Axiom speakers. So another loyal Paradigm owner chimes in and says, "oh yes you should look at the 3rd party tests of the M80's the graph shows it's even more neutral than the Studio 100's, and for the price they are a very good speaker". Then someone else responds by saying, "well what does a graph show anyway, that's no way to judge a speaker".

That's a fair statement, a graph can not tell you how smooth a speaker may sound, if it's highs are fatiging, or if they sound spacious and open or not. Certainly speaker manufacturers who are dedicated to developing a neutral speaker will undoubtedly study graphs of the speakers performance to try to tweak whatever they need to to improve its performance. But a graph is not a tell-all when it comes to the way a speaker performs. Still, the response sounds a bit... defensive. And if I were reading the thread from the standpoint of being an Axiom owner like I am, I could (and I stress the word COULD) see where someone might feel the response was sort of on the 'fanboyish' side of things. I'm not calling Tom a fanboy, not in the least. I do understand patriotism, and as Grunt pointed out, it's so easy to read a persons post and get the wrong impression of the way it was supposed to sound. I have no doubts House didn't mean to sound as if he was saying the Ascends were a superior speaker to the M22's any more than Tom meant to sound as if he was annoyed that he would recommend anything but Axiom speakers. And personally I didn't get those messages out of either of those two posts... but it was from those two posts that the fireworks began, so somewhere down the line the message got misunderstood.

I don't see much fanboyism around these parts, most people here are open minded to most advice and recommendations towards alternatives to Axiom products. Still, we all have some varying degree of fondness towards Axiom, so it's understandable that any recommendation that doesn't fall in the 'Axiom' column can look/feel like a jab. And in some cases that may well be what they are, I just didn't feel as if this was one of those cases. But that, just as the rest of my post, is just my own personal opinion, and should not be cut an pasted on Wikipedia under 'What Dr. House REALLY meant'.

But I missed any and all of the posts in question regarding Dr. House and his feelings towards the V3 designation thingy. So perhaps I'm just not looking for anything that might be taken negatively out of the good doctor towards Axiom as a whole? On the other side of that coin, those who are in the know concerning that situation are perhaps coloring anything he says now with the attitude he may have expressed at that time, and getting the impression that anything he says as of late, is slanted. I really have no business to say if it is or isn't since...

A. I'm not Dr. House.
B. I have no access to his train of thought.
and
C. The book I had on him titled 'Dr. House, His Real Agenda and His Plans On Destroying Axiom' burned up in my fire before I got a chance to read it.

Ok, ok... I'm playing this rather tongue-in-cheek I admit, but that's only because... well because this is the internet folks! This forum in particular IS tongue-in-cheek!!! We're never serious about anything in here... EVER!!! Which isn't to say that we're not seriously diggin our Axiom speakers! But come on, in the two years I've been hanging around we've only really hated on two people... Skiing Ninja and Solid State. And that's because those two OBVIOUSLY had an agenda! To a lesser extent a lot of people around here got fed up with Bob. But that was more due to his lack of willingness to seriously follow the advice of those members who were earnestly trying to help him rectify his situation... as well as his very negative attitude after recieveing his speakers, than anything else. I didn't sense any sort of agenda coming out of Bob, just a penchant to bitch about his situation with little to no willingness to even consider anyone's advice on how to improve any aspect of performance with his set-up.

Anyway, like I said I'm not putting any blame on anyone at all here. It's all good as far as I'm concerned. I just wanted to express that I truely don't see any agenda behind Dr. Houses recommendation. Nor would I ever catagorize Tom as an Axiom fanboy. But then again, I always thought we'd find those WMD's laying around somewhere in Iraq one day. Sooo..............

Oooops... looks like I missed the boad. That arguement is over and done and now we're off on another quarrel... my bad.

Am I the only one who thinks if you aren't happy with what Axiom has sent you, you should just simply send it back? What's the big freaking deal here? Mistakes of course happen, but it sounds like Axiom was not even given the chance to make things right because of a timeframe. If 2x6 is in that much of a hurry and cannot send them back, that is not Axioms fault. I find it hard to believe they wouldn't re-ship another set with magnetic grilles and white drivers if so requested.

2x6spds,

Ok I admit I do understand the disappointment in thinking you're getting one thing, and getting another (or as in this case, not knowing exactly what you got???). I know how that frusteration can build up and fester and create hard feelings and in the end come out in anger. Now before I go any further let me just clarify that I am not part of the Axiom clean-up squad. Saying so proves it, because if you are part of the Axiom clean-up squad you are required by Canadian law to state that fact... otherwise it's entrapment!!!

Ok so now that you know I'm on the level let me just say that if I were in your shoe's I very well may feel the same way that you do. In fact I'm going to go as far as saying I'd probably feel pretty much exactly the way you do. Dispite this however, I am willing to bet you have the new tweeter, and that you're M3's sound 100% identical to any other honest to goodness pair of M3's. For me though, that might not be enough. If it were me, I might have asked if they would take back the set I got, and sent me a pair with the magnetic grills, silver dust caps, and V3 label on the back.

Have you asked them to do this? If not, this is what I would suggest. In my experience with Axiom (JC was directly involved in most of my issues), they will do anything and everything you request of them within reason... and then some!!! There was not a single thing I asked for that JC did not provide me. I don't know if you followed my thread, but it went on for a LONG time before it was resolved. In fact, they gave me SOOO much support and new parts I got to the point that I felt bad asking for anything else because I knew that they couldn't have made any profit from my purchase after everything they sent me. But they never, and I mean NEVER refused anything I asked for. I got everything requested promptly and they were always very good at following up with me, making sure I was satisfied.

So my suggestion is if it's really bugging you, ask them if they'll take yours back in exchange for sonically AND visually V3 M3's. My guess is they'll be more than happy to accomodate such a request and you'll have nothing left to question.

Personally I can see how the switchover from something like a V2 to a V3 could be a big cluster f&@#!!! Some customers will gladly accept the new speakers with the old hardware that is sonically equal to the new hardware (like the black-eyed pea drivers), plus the new hardware (like the tweeters), wrapped in an old box (like the one with the pop-in grills instead of the magnetic ones) and be just fine with them. Others will accept nothing less than everything that is new about the speaker (including cap color and magnetic grills). I'm not saying either of these two types of customers are right or wrong, I'm just saying that both of them exist, so I don't fault Axiom for using up old inventory while making the transition. But I would highly, and I mean HIGHLY doubt that they sent you a pair of V2's and just told you they were V3's. I tell you what, order another set of V3's and when they get there take the tweeters out of both and take them down to a professional lab. If their findings are that you were sold the old tweeters, then I'll pack my Axioms up and send them back to Ontario as well. And I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one.

And I LOVE my Axiom's!!! So I'm saying this because I'm THAT sure that you have not been duped. But by all means, ask them to trade you for another set of M3's if it's killing you like it is. I know for a fact that your peace of mind is more important to them than a few dollars in their coffers. I know this from experience. JC took care of me, I'm confident he will take the same good care of you as well.