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#359828 - 12/01/11 11:04 AM Multiple Subs
Nick B Offline
devotee

Registered: 08/05/06
Posts: 491
I have an original LFM-1 Outlaw sub and have been thinking that a few years down the line that I would like to upgrade to something with a little more extension and output. Since I don't want to have to upgrade several times I was thinking about getting an SVS Ultra 13 or Axiom EP800 or Seaton Submersive. But, I have read several articles mentioning that you need at least two subs to help smooth out the frequency response for all of the listening positions and even help smooth it out in the sweet spot as well. When you start doing the math, two of these about subs comes to over $4000, which is probably more than I would want to spend on subwoofers.

Then I started thinking well maybe I could get two EP500's or maybe two HSU ULS 15's. That may not be a bad idea, but then I read the review of the Outlaw LFM1-EX over at Audioholics and it was a pretty glowing review (for subs in that price range). I didn't expect the review to be so positive, with all of the tough competition in the $600 price range. So now I am thinking that maybe I could get three of the LFM1-EX's and I would have four almost identical subs (since the LFM1 is basically a half brother), and maybe I would be better off than even the two subs as a pair that I mentioned above. Sure I wouldn't have that extra 5 to 7Hz extension that I would get from the other subs, but I bet it would sound better in every other seat, ignoring that extra bit of extension. I found a good article that discusses this same topic.

http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/article/subwoofers-4-2-or-1-0

If I go with four subs do you guys think that it is a good idea to have the same brand for all four? The SVS PB-12NSD and Axiom EP350 are close in price to the Outlaw LFM1EX, so could I get three of the SVS's or Axiom's and use my Outlaw LFM1 and have them integrate well?

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#359831 - 12/01/11 11:14 AM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: Nick B]
gtpsuper Offline
old hand

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 80
IMO the Axioms fall way behind in performance and price compared to other brands. There was a user on AVS that had a PB12NSD and bought a Axiom EP500 for another room. The PB12 NSD went deeper, had more tactile feel, and played louder, it gave up alittle in the "musical" area but not much. Axioms have a "brickwall" type high pass filter on them so they don't gradually roll of it justs stops right at the filter. Which hurts any room gain you could get.

If you want a pair of "mega" subs, the SVS Ultra, SubM, JTR Capitvator, eDs A7-450, A7s-650 would be the way to go.

I'm an Axiom owner, but just look at all the forums for audio and hometheater and very rarely to you see anyone recommending or praising Axiom subwoofers. They just plain suck for the price.

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#359834 - 12/01/11 11:26 AM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: gtpsuper]
Jc Offline
aficionado

Registered: 06/27/06
Posts: 500
Loc: Sherbrooke, QC, Canada
Originally Posted By: gtpsuper
They just plain suck for the price.

Hi gtpsuper, I wonder if you have personally auditoned an Axiom subwoofer or if you are judging them only from comments read on various forums ?
_________________________
jc
Axiom Audio Expert / jc@axiomaudio.com
Recrutement d'Intégrateurs/Installateurs professionnels Québec

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#359837 - 12/01/11 11:54 AM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: Jc]
nickbuol Offline
connoisseur

Registered: 09/16/04
Posts: 4415
Loc: Marion, IA
I've seen various awards for Axiom subs...

Although, I own an SVS, mainly because at the time, the Axiom sub line was minimal with only a couple of underpowered (for my needs) options.

I am going to build a second sub for my theater build. It will be based off of my existing SVS, but probably be a box instead of a cylinder since I should be able to build that real quick vs building another sub that my wife hates the looks of.
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#359840 - 12/01/11 12:47 PM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: nickbuol]
gtpsuper Offline
old hand

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 80
[/quote]Hi gtpsuper, I wonder if you have personally auditoned an Axiom subwoofer or if you are judging them only from comments read on various forums ? [/quote]

Yes I have a EP175 for a bedroom tv setup with soundbar, got the sub from craiglist, about a year ago.

Does the Axiom subs implement a "brickwall" type high pass filter?

Originally Posted By: nickbuol
I've seen various awards for Axiom subs...


Along time ago, nothing recently. Axiom hasn't done major updates to their subs for a long time. Not like HSU, SVS, eD ect... Thats why they've fallen behind, most review/rewards are from 2004-2007.


Edited by gtpsuper (12/01/11 12:48 PM)

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#359843 - 12/01/11 12:59 PM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: gtpsuper]
MarkSJohnson Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 10832
Loc: Central NH
GT, I'm pretty sure that the 400, 500, 600 and 800 have all come after 2007.

You've got old info.
_________________________
::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::

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#359845 - 12/01/11 01:13 PM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: gtpsuper]
Jc Offline
aficionado

Registered: 06/27/06
Posts: 500
Loc: Sherbrooke, QC, Canada
gtpsuper,
Other than owning a used Axiom EP175 (might have been modified and not performing as it should) what other experience and/or qualifications can you offer to support your statement that "Axiom subs just plain suck for the price" ?
_________________________
jc
Axiom Audio Expert / jc@axiomaudio.com
Recrutement d'Intégrateurs/Installateurs professionnels Québec

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#359846 - 12/01/11 01:14 PM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: MarkSJohnson]
gtpsuper Offline
old hand

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 80
EP800 no measurements though
http://www.soundstage.com/equipment/axiom_ep800_v3.htm

EP600 reviews Feb '06 and June '06 only ones I can find.
http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/axiom/axiom.html
http://www.hometheatersound.com/equipment/axiom_ep600_v2.htm

EP500
http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0306/axiom_ep500.htm
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/speakers/subwoofers/axiom-ep500
http://www.hometheatersound.com/equipment/axiom_ep_500.htm
http://www.hometheatersound.com/equipment/axiom_m22v2_m2v2_vp150v2_ep500v2.htm

I mean if theres reviews out there recently of the EP800,600,500 that have measurements and is objective by all means post some, theres nothing out there. Like I said the majority or all of them are '04-'07/08

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#359847 - 12/01/11 01:32 PM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: Jc]
gtpsuper Offline
old hand

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 80
Originally Posted By: Jc
gtpsuper,
Other than owning a used Axiom EP175 (might have been modified and not performing as it should) what other experience and/or qualifications can you offer to support your statement that "Axiom subs just plain suck for the price" ?


Nope the EP175 performs just fine, comparable to Polks PSW110 and Mirages S10.3. A friend has each one for his hometheater, Newegg clearances. Luckily I didn't pay the almost $600 price for it.

Most of your competitors offer better performing subwoofers at sometimes half the price of Axioms. For example
HSU STF1 $362
eD A3-250 $415 (destroys the EP175 for HT)
Epik Legend $559 close to same size not a monster subwoofer, outperforms the EP175 and still does it under the EP175 price.
Rythmik FV12 $565 includs shipping. Again cheaper than the EP175.

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#359848 - 12/01/11 01:40 PM Re: Multiple Subs [Re: gtpsuper]
J. B. Online   content
connoisseur

Registered: 01/19/11
Posts: 1262
Loc: Quebec, Canada
i get the feeling this is going to be interesting reading.
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