Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Denon users please help

I have my new receiver (Denon 3805) all hooked up and speakers calibrated. This is my first real A/V receiver. My old receiver was a Yamaha Home theater in a box receiver not sure of the model. There are not many setting/buttons on the Yamaha besides volume, bass, and treble.

At first I felt overwhelmed with the new Denon. I read the manual couple times and i have learn a little about it. But at this moment I don't think I am using it to it's full potential or using it correctly. In perticular the various listen modes direct, pure direct, stanrd 5 ch/7ch and so on. I know it is probably a matter of personal choice but what would be the best setting for listening to music, watching tv, watching dvd? Is there an auto select mode?
What I need is help using this new receiver to it's full potential.
Please help out a technically defecient axiomite.
Any suggestions would be kindly appreciated.

The best mode for watching movies and TV? Well thats pretty easy, Dolby Digital or DTS for DVD's and TV. As far as music goes, you have to play around a little but stereo mode, Pro Logic Music, and so on is what alot of people use.

Clarence, as you might guess, this could be a fairly long story, but I'll summarize. When you're playing a 5.1 DVD use DD or DTS, whichever the disc has. When you're playing 2-channel material(e.g. CDs, FM, TV)don't use any direct, pure or 5 channel stereo mode. If your setup is 5.1 use DPLII to extract surround ambience sound contained within the 2 channels(in varying degrees)and steer it to the surrounds where it belongs. Experiment with the center width and dimension adjustments available with DPLII to try to improve the effect.

I have not found a single "best" setting for listening to music. As others have said, choosing the right mode for DVDs is pretty straightforward and the receiver will usually figure out what to do as long as it knows how many speakers you have.

Music is a different story because you are normally starting with stereo content and choosing from a bunch of different modes which use different techniques to simulate multiple channel audio. Sometimes Dolby Pro Logic II sounds best, sometimes Neo6, sometimes Logic 7 (a Harman Kardon proprietary mode) and sometimes I switch everything off and listen in stereo.

Just learn how to play with the buttons a bit and enjoy. As long as you know how to listen to DVDs in "Dolby Digital" 5.1 (or 6.1 if the disk is encoded that way) you aren't missing out on much.

Thanks John's,

Time to play with the new receiver and learn. I am going to try to figure out if I am watching DVD in DD 5.1

One minor point to remember... the DVD / player combo is part of the equation, in the sense that it decides whether to play a 5.1 soundtrack or something else. With the latest DVDs everything seems to default to Dolby Digital 5.1 but remember that not all DVDs will do that.

re: Dolby Digital vs. DTS -- I think most of us here play the DTS soundtrack if it is available (again, you have to pick this via the DVD menu not the receiver menu) but I doubt any of us have had time to really compare the two soundtracks and see if there is a difference.

Interesting observations :

- a disproportionate percentage of Axiom owners seem to work in the IT sector. Is this meaningful, or is this a natural outcome of having everything we purchase in NA manufactured in China ?

- my other hobby (when I have time) is IPSC (handgun combat simulation) shooting, and again there seems to be a disproportionate percentage of software engineers, IT folks, real estate agents and lawyers. I think this is because of the massive paperwork you need to legally own a handgun in Canada, but again it's an interesting data point.

I agree with eveyone so far, except one thing JohnK mentioned. I disagree with him on playing CD's and/or FM tuner signals. For those options, all I do use is either direct or pure direct modes. The sound to my ears is much better than standard stereo modes. Even the manual states the sound will improve as you progress from CD to Direct to Pure Direct. With these options any internal circuitry not needed is shut down to help give you the most pure output. For me the sound is much improved, but that is just me.

I agree with you Sirclyde about the Denon's, there is so many options it is crazy. For DVD's that have both DD and DTS, I usually try testing both to see what I like best. For the most part, they seem very similar. I believe the DTS signals are decoded at a higher bitrate, but to my ears it is not a huge improvement.

I do agree with John on the PLIIx option. For 7.1 this feature is pretty cool as you get an even more enveloped sound from your rear channels. The problem is figuring out how to get it working. The other night I just happened to hit the right combination of buttons, and the display said Dolby Digitial plus PLIIx.

The other built in DSP things like Widescreen, Jazz Club, etc... have not proven to me yet to be beneficial.

good luck.

Randy

Depends on the speakers IMHO. I Personally dislike the PLII setup. I find that it takes something from the sweetness of the M80. My preferred setup for listening to Music is Stereo/Direct (very little difference). This way I can listen to the M80's doing what they do best. I feel that the PLII lacks the stereo imaging and lacks the sweetness of the M80's playing alone.

Another Personal choice in HT.

Ever tried DTS:Neo6? I think the same thing about DPLII, but Neo6 works pretty nicely.

I have yet to get Neo6 to work -any advice?
I can manually select it, but I'll get no sound...

On my H/K, Neo6 is separate from standard DTS. Is there a chance that you're selecting DTS?

No, I'm selecting Neo6 and gettin' nuttin'....So, Neo6 can be applied to any type of audio encoding or what?

Analog stereo input only, I think.

Ah, that would make sense, then! The only analog stereo input I use is for my turntable- everything else is digital.

Thank you, kcarlile!

Ah, then I'll just shut up.

I'm prety sure you weren't taking it the wrong way (wasn't trying to sound superior by saying I mainly utilize digital audio inputs), but just to be clear: I sincerely thank you for the info, kcarlile.

Nah, I'm fine. Something tells me it might work with a digital CD source, though. I'm not sure; my CD player only has analog outs.

"I'm not sure; my CD player only has analog outs."


Yea kcarlile, I think we own the same model. JVC XL-F254?
We seriously need to upgrade.

I have a couple suggestions for how to use some of the Denon 3805 sound processing modes based on my experience. The bottom line, however, is you’re going to spend the next several weeks to months exploring what works best for you and your material. It’s lots of fun. You feel like you still have new equipment months afterwards.

1) Mono Movie DSP mode is useful for the old classic movies or TV stations with a mono broadcast like the Japanese station I watch. This spreads the signal across all 3 front channels. It makes for a larger sounding stage and takes some of the load off my center channel.

2) PL IIx Cinema mode can do a very good job with CD’s or VCR tapes that have theater sound tracks on them. I’m amazed at how much surround sound material is still in the stereo signal on VCR tapes. CD’s from movie soundtracks also seem to have this information available.

3) PL IIx Music mode is a useful option for video games that support surround sound. This provides more separation for the signal than Cinema or Game modes. The Game mode tends to send too much volume to the rear speakers for some games. GT4 for instance is much better in PL IIx Music mode.

4) DSP mode parameters can help tune a DSP mode for a particular function. I agree with Randy that I’ve not found much use for most of the special DSP modes. I’ve used Stadium during a few football games and it worked so well I could barely understand the announcer because of the echoes. Adjusting the room size, effect level and delay helped reduce the amount of echo to a reasonable level. Each DSP mode also has adjustments for treble and bass so it’s possible to set one DSP mode for specific CD’s. I’ve tried to get one adjusted to handle my poorly recorded CD’s that are very sibilant by reducing the treble. My results weren’t too good and I used the manual room EQ instead.

5) If you have a 7.1 setup, try cycling through the various surround back (SB) speaker options. I find the non-matrix mode very good for DD 5.1 movies because it places a virtual sound between my side and back surround speakers. Since my side surround speakers are a bit in front of me this helps put the sound slightly behind me. The matrix mode will give you DD 5.1 + PL IIx Cinema where the signal for the back channels is created using the PL IIx processing.

thanks for all the feedback now here is a stupid question. How do I know if it is in dolby digital mode? Is 5.1/7.1 ch DD? If so it does not say it on the OSD. Is stereo mode DD? I think I am starting to learn a bit but there are times I think it is just a little over my head.

I looked at the manual again and there is a DD display on the front panel that will come on when there is a dvd with DD playing. I guess when watching a dvd set it to standard mode? I need to go get some movies and mess with this thing.

I'll do you one better--XL-F108. No remote control, no swapping discs while playing. $100. 5 disc CD changer I bought myself as a high school graduation present? Priceless.

And yes, we need to upgrade.

Clarence, this one has gotten a bit tangled-up in terminology or possibly in a misunderstanding of some of the modes. When you mention 5.1/7.1 you're apparently referring to the mode that simply sends the left side stereo to the left side and back(if present)surrounds and likewise for the right side. It applies only to stereo material(useful for parties, etc. to have the sound more nearly the same all over the room)and has nothing to do with 5.1 DVDs.

As I suggested, since you've paid for a receiver and speakers which can "liberate" the ambience imprisoned in the 2-channel format and steer it to the surrounds where it belongs, you should use this capability. This means that you couldn't use any stereo mode such as direct, pure or stereo itself, since DPLII(or Neo:6 which Ken prefers)is an entirely different processing mode. Experiment.

Thanks guys for all the input. I have been playing with my new receiver and it seems to be less confusing for me now. The speakers I am using is for my old HTin a box and they never sound why better than my old receiver. I can hardly wait til my Axiom's arrive(12-19-05).

Clarence, take a look at page 83 and 84 of your Denon 3805 manual. These tables are very helpful for understanding how the system operates for each type of input signal and sound processing mode. Unfortunately, they are not friendly to read, but there is lots of information there. I skipped over them several times when I was first learning my system before realizing how useful they were. You are correct that some options are not available until a specific digital input is provided to the receiver. Here’s a quick orientation to the tables.

Pg 83 Table 1
Lists how each sound processing mode listed on the left affects the speaker outputs and it lists which sound processing modes are available for the different input signals.

Pg 84 Table 2
Lists the adjustable parameters for each processing mode listed on the left. Usually these parameters are accessed by using the “Surr Para” button on the remote. Pay attention to the notes below the table.

Pg 84 Table 3
This table is actually an extension of table 2. Basically you could attach table 3 to the right of table 2 and have 1 large table that covers all of the various parameters for the different surround sound modes.