Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners VP 150 holding me back...

I am leaning towards purchasing a full Axiom HT setup, but the only thing really holding me back is the center channel speaker. I am concerned about the sound quality, off axis sound and that it is not a three way design. I have always beleived that you should never compromise on the center channel and if I upgrade from my current Infinity center, I do not want to the VP 150 to be a disappointing choice. Do I have anything to worry about? Most of the seating in my room is off to the sides and I want that to sound just as good as when I am sitting right in front.

Thanks!

Hi,

I bought initially VP100 and it was not quite there. Maybe because I have a large room. I exchanged it for VP150, it was the greatest improvement. Much better voice delivery, very clear sound.

I think it is hard to judge a speaker merely by looking at its design (ie, 2 way vs 3 way). See if you can find someone around who has one, so you can listen to it and judge it that way.

None of us can say if you would find the VP150 disappointing. How one feels about a speaker is completely subjective, and unpredictable.

However, give it a try in your own home, and should you NOT be satisfied, within 30 days you can return it for a complete refund. There is no better way to judge a speaker than in your own room, with your own equipment. It would cost you the return shipping, but I doubt you'd find the shipping charge to Buffalo, for one speaker, excessive.

I've owned lots of center channels from many speaker manufacturers, and the VP150 is the best one I've ever owned so far. Not sure why a 3 way design is so important to you? My VP150 fills my large HT room very nicely, of course nobody sits off to the side in my room.

My room is about 12 by 22 and I sit along one wall about 11 feet away with 2 chairs across from me.Sitting in the middle isn't a option and my 150 sounds beautifull anywhere in the room.For a center you don't really need a full range speaker.

I simply do not understand the discussion about the 150. It fits my 80s perfectly... and they would be the speakers that would tend to 'overpower' the 150. the 150... it works flawlessly in creating the so called 'seamless soundstage'...

As mentioned above, you can always return it....

You won't.

Neb

corsabrin,
YMMV but i love my vp150 it matches my 60's and has no prob off axis. room is 12 by 20 have 4 (all sound spots sound great) recliners about 16 ft away.

It blends well with the other Axiom speakers and is a very good speaker. Like the guys said above, you can always return it, or even order another one and connect them in parallet. It is really a very good speaker.

Nothing should keep you away from the outstanding M80's.

A couple have mentioned the only way to judge is to try it in your own home; agreed, but I understand EXACTLY where the OP is coming from.

To make a long story short, I have done EXHAUSTIVE web research on this very subject. In short, the typical 2 way horiztonally oriented MTM design is not the best design to use as a center channel. If your sitting directly in front of it, you won't have any problems. Sit off to the side, and that is where the trouble starts. I can't count the number of times watching a movie, and someone asks "what did they say?".

I have read a few nay-sayers reguard the design of the VP150 as a bad design since it has two tweeters on either end of the speaker, but I'll bet that it is actually a GOOD design when it comes to horizontal dispersion; probably way better than the typical horizontal-oriented MTM.

As to why 3-way centers are often desired; if you have a "MTM" center, but have a separate midrange/vertical tweeter, it really helps in the horiztonal dispersion, and you don't get the cancellation effects in the critical vocal range that you do with a 2 way MTM.

Oddly enough, a *vertically* oriented MTM would be a very good choice as a center if maximum horizontal dispersion is your goal.

I know this didn't help the OP, but I understand where they are coming from.

-Alan

I have and would also reccomend the VP150.

I believe the 2 tweeters on the outside of the VP150 TMMMT? is supposed to remedy that cancellation problem.

Maybe you can confirm this with someone at Axiom. I'll bet they have done tests on center channel dispersion

Firebird hit the nail on the head with his post. Those are my exact concerns with a a two way center speaker. The TMMMT array of the VP 150 intrigues me, but does it over come the short falls of a standard MTM two way center? It would be ideal if everyone could sit directly in front of the TV, but that just cannot happen with my layout.

As the others have said, you don't have to sit right in front of the VP150 to get the full effect. The area for my HT room is over 15ft wide and almost 30ft deep. The first row is recliners that have a slight arc to them across the room. I've sat clear in the left/right recliner and the VP150 does great. My experience having 2 tweeters in a TMMMT design, would do much better than any MTM design. Not sure why you think this is an issue.

Looking at the specs. and 2-way vs. 3-way makes me think about the fact that my LFE crossover is set to 80Hz and the VP150 is 7.5 dB down at 80 Hz. The center is not typically used for these frequencies and I don't hear anything missing either just spec. wise.

Not sure how many centers are < 3 dB down at 80 Hz with VP150 sensitivity and price. Probably not many.

Quite the opposite of some people, I have had to attenuate my VP150 to -4.5db on my Denon because it was louder than my other speakers. Of course room size, shape, and placement have a lot to do with this. Off-axis is no problem either. Like others have said in this thread: If you don't like it, send it back within 30 days.

I'd toss in another vote for VP150. I have a ~18feet wide sitting area that is ~12 feet from the TV/Center Channel and it seems to do very well.

Dude, the VP150 is more center channel than you will ever need.. If you have doubts about coverage on the side, go with an M22..
I've had my Axioms for years now, and not one problem with the sound or lack of coverage.. If I changed anything, it would be to swap out the VP150 for the M22.. Why ? I would like to hear what it would sound like used as a center.. My guess, proabably not too bad..
Oh, I might add, my M80's and the VP150 are all hanging from the ceiling ! Yep.. And they blow the doors off anything else I have heard to date..
With the speakers clear of the floor, ceiling, and walls, not to mention hanging at an angle to all those surfaces, I get about as close to zero negative reflections as a guy has a right to..
But I dirgress.. Go with the VP 150.. Nuff said..

Ok...you must have a camera handy, no? I for one would like to see pics of your speakers in their current state.

Ditto.

That's got to be a sight not often seen. I would love to see some pictures also.

If you walked up to one of your 80s and pushed it, would it start swinging, or are they attached in solid way that prevents that? If they do swing, you run the risk of losing some accuracy. Allow me to explain my theory.

Because every action has an equal and opposite reaction, when your driver cones move forward, your speaker cabinet will move backward, trying to keep the center of mass of the entire speaker in the same place. Likewise, when the driver cones move inward, the speaker cabinet will move forward. Because the speaker cabinet has much more mass than the drivers, you can't really see this happening. The effect would be a subtle muffling of soundwaves.

It's always a good idea to have the speakers anchored as rigidly as possible.

I fully admit that the motion of the speaker cabinets themselves might be small enough that it's virtually non-existent, so this may be a complete non-issue.

I had reservations with the VP 150, that's why I ended up buying two M22's and running them both as a center. I love them.....

They are currently laying horizontal on an angled shelf that ponts them downward. I tried laying them with the tweeters together, and with the woofers together. I prefer the tweeters together. They blend extreemly well with the M80's too. Much better than the M3's did when I was using them as a center channel.

When I move all this to the dedicated room, I'll position the M22's vertically, but for now, I have no complaints whatsoever. They friggin rock.

At long last, yes.. If you can believe this, they have been flying for years, and I put off taking photos as I was going to wait until I 'FINISHED' the room !!?? haha.. Like that will ever happen ?? hahaha..
Now, if I can just figure out how to post the shots..

Sign up for a free account at photobucket or imageshack and we will guide you through the rest.

In the past I would run a chain or heavy wire from the back side of the speaker box to the wall behind it.. That gave me 3 points of contact.. It was more for aiming the speaker at the sweet spot, and as I have never finalized the seating in my theater room (funding issues !) there has not been a permanent spot to aim at..
They weigh 57 lbs each, so with the laws of inertia in effect, not a lot of movement going on..
They play loud and very very clean.. Yes, you do have to drill pilot holes in the tops of them.. Many of my friends used to freak about that.. I've been doing this to my speakers since 1972, and never had a problem with a speaker falling, or coming apart at the seams, etc..
Again, I have photos, and will "TRY" to post them.. Soon..

What inserts do you use? MDF isn't known for great fastener holding strength. - be careful.

Just have to say that I had some conerns about the 150 before purchasing because of certian reviews / threads and I can not be happier with the speaker...

To answer off axis concerns... they simply do not exist for me.. the tmmmt set up works.

My question also is this: Are other speakers being used as centers as sheilded as the 150? Probably but I wonder if you see any effect of lack of shielding on the 22s etc...

From my testing, they are not as shielded as the VP series. The M22s were pretty much unusable next to my CRT. Well, the M22s were fine, but the CRT was another matter. It's just fine with the VP.

That makes sence due to design... thanks for the confirmation.

Neb