Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Projector problems??

I have been thinking a lot lately about getting a front projector. Namely the sanyo plv z5, or panny 100 or even possibly the 1080 versions the epson 1080 home or the panny, but I am kinda concerned because on the avs forum they seem to have a lot of problems? I am asking individuals that have or have had projectors in the past. How long do these projectors last? Is the quality control for projectors that bad that a person is lucky to get one that does not have some sort of problem within a year? Let me know what you think? Looking for good experiences and bad? I really don't want to spend that kind of money if it will only work for a few years (or less). I definitely want the big movie theater experience, but I sure would hate to have my wonderful tv I already have and sell it and then have a projector that craps out on me within a year. I wouldn't think that would be a very smart investment. Has anyone had experiences with any of these projectors??

I've been a long time member of AVSforum and other forums. While it is possible to get a lemon with anything you buy, I really am not sure that I follow your comments. Most people don't have many problems with projectors, and they don't crap out in a year.

I've had a Sanyo Z2 for over 3 years and it has been great. Recently, I've had an issue with some faint vertical lines, but I'm still troubleshooting the issue. I'm looking at the cable and HTPC video card I'm using as the problem.

If you get at least a 720p projector or higher, HD material is stunning. I guess it all depends on if you want a big screen experience or a smaller experience.

For me, if I ever need repair work done, it is a lot easier to send a 12lb unit to Sanyo for 3 day turn around, than it is figuring out how your going to get your large TV repaired.

Spending "that kind of money"? Projectors cost less overall than HDTV's, Plasma's, LCD's on the market.

I'm not giving up my 130" image anytime soon.

Good that is the kind of response that I was hoping to hear. I have recently been reading about individuals having problems with their panny 100ax in that forum. Anyway, I meant that kinda money in respect to the fact I bought my big tv just two years ago. I have built a theater room out of my basement with the help of my dad and ran wires for a ceiling mounted projector. I am really wanting to go to the projector. So you really like the sanyo? I have been leaning that way because I kinda like the auto lens cover, but also the fact I love movies and have a totally light controlled room. What projectors would you recommend? Thanks

Well, I don't really have much input on other projectors, however, check out projectorcentral.com as they have great reviews and recomendations.

I've had the Z2 for over 3 years and it has been great. In fact, I'm typing on my 130" screen right now, while I'm listening to a little Stevie Ray Vaughan on my Axioms.

There are some other Z2, Z3, Z4, and Z5 owners around these parts, so they may chime in...you can check out my website below of some pictures. Here is a pick of Star Wars at 130" with my cheap digital camera.

Ditto Randy's suggestion to check out Projector Central. They have a lot of info to consider in selecting a projector including list and reviews of their most highly recommended projectors and most popular models.

I purchased a used NEC 240K and had it for about 2.5 years with no troubles at all. I recently replaced it with the Mitsubishi HD1000 (for a while was rated one of 3 best buys on projector central) and am very pleased with it. It isn't as versitile to place as say the Sanyo Z series or some other popular models, but is fine for my situation.

Unless you are going to go the Blu-ray or HD DVD route I wouldn't recommend going to 1080p as they run around $5000 to get a highly rated model. Excellent 720p models can be had for $1000-1500 and are going to look just about as good as any 1080p model showing standard DVD's or HD TV (which is mostly 720p content). It'll likely be a couple years before there is a fair bit of 1080p content on HD TV and Blu-ray players are a more reasonable price and by then the 1080p projectors will probably be as cheap as the 720p ones are now.

My 2 cents

Projector prices have been dropping as fast as those for TV displays. Since the introduction of the JVC-RS1 purchases of other 1080p projectors declined. The Sony Pearl which was regarded as the top 1080p projector of 2006 can now be purchased in the $3000-$3,500 range which is around the price of a good 60" flat panel TV. 1080p Panasonics and Sharps are cheaper still.

720p projectors are excellent buys right now and probably represent the best bang for the buck. While resolution is important there are other projector properties which more significant to image quality such as luminosity, contrast ratio, greyscale linearity and color accuracy.

3+ years and running.
http://www.quadloft.com/h30/

I picked up a Z4 maybe 6 months ago after the prices had dropped -- the value for dollar was just too good to pass up. I have been very happy with it.

The final decision was between the Z4 and the corresponding Panasonic -- AU900 I guess -- with the final decision being made by local availability and pricing. I probably would have also been very happy with the Panny but on balance I think the "sharp Sanyo" is closer to my viewing tastes than the "smooth Panasonic".

If you have some wall space and the ability to control ambient light then a projector seems like the obvious way to go. As others have said, getting a projector to a service depot is much easier than moving an RPTV, and there is really nothing more to go wrong in a projector than in an RPTV.

Someone made a comment about Axioms never being criticized in the media. Not sure that is true -- I distinctly remember someone complaining about blood pouring out of their ears after the first listening session

I own a Sanyo Z5 (only 30 or so hours on the bulb), I have been in love with the sharpness and clarity ever since I bought it.

Its an amazing projector for the price! Highly recommended.

I need to sell my Z2 and get a Z5, ooops, sorry forum rules.

Can't go wrong at $1695 for a Z5.

Stop teasing me guys.

Don’t get sucked into the resolution game. It makes little to no difference going from 720 to 1080. Where you need to be looking /comparing is true contrast ratio, color accuracy, blacks, projector noise (they are not all the same), mounting limitations, bulb replacement costs, ease of use, lumen output, lens shift limitations, cost and whatever else is important to you.

Most of these things are incredibly overrated (as advertised). After calibration is when a projector should be measured for competitive shopping perposes. Also, look for unbiased professional reviews. The best I’ve seen can be found at projector reviews. http://www.projectorreviews.com/ Art does a great job at reviewing these things and reporting what the general, non obsessive tweaker will want/need to hear.

The current crop of 1080P projectors all pretty much outperform the 720’s on a whole with the above considerations. Don’t knock them off your list just because someone living in denial thinks his/her 720 unit is the Holy Grail. They are coming down in price almost daily right now. You can get both the Panasonic and Epson for under 3K, right now today. In three months there will be more. In six months, more yet.

One of the biggest bitches I’ve seen over and over again regarding the 1080P units is their lumen output. I’ve got the dimmest one of the group and in my particular set up (throw distance / screen size / room); I am looking at filters right now. It’s too bright for me on its lowest setting. So don’t let that scare you.

I bought my Panasonic 700 in Jan. 2005 (just before the "Big Game"...don't want to get sued by the NFL) and was in awe especially of broadcast HD (still free off the air) and the Dish HD broadcasts. I have used it more as a TV set than a theatre experience. (btw...LOTR and other DVDs look stunning in their own right)

Some things to think about...

You pretty much need to dedicate a decent size space in relative darkness to view a projected image of any definition type. If you are used to a 720p or 1080p LCD, Plasma, or other type of image, you may not be as impressed as I was going from a 480i 32" tube.

There are issues with projector bulbs. Mine went at around 1000 hrs. However, thanks to Evan at Projector Central I was able to contact the correct person at Panasonic and received a replacement bulb (had to wait for service stock from Japan about a month) at no cost. That bulb is going on 2600 hrs.

But......

I did some things differently with the new bulb.

1) lamp power is set to low
2) fan speed is set to high
3) I added a fan to blow on the projector...one of those miniture steel fans that move a good amount of air

I know people are concerned with fan noise, but even with the extra fan, at normal listening levels I do not notice the fan noise. And, I have got to believe dissipating the heat is a good way to help bulb life.

As far as 1080p vs. 720p, I am totally happy with a 720p image.

The images do vary...GIGO.

My problem now is, with the newer projectors coming down in price (and, will go even lower when the new models come out in the fall), do I spend $350 on a new bulb when it goes, or $1500 (or less) on last years model and get improved specs?

I think I need to find some side jobs soon.

I've had my Z2 for 2 years and I have about the same amount of hours on it as Sirquack. I love the picture it gives and I would definitely upgrade to the Z5 in a heartbeat if I had the money and the authorization from my "boss" eh... Anyway I definitely recommend the Z5.

thanks everyone for your input. My plan was to get a projector and get a blu ray player. I had the samsung 1200, but didn't want to keep it cause the sound coming from analog was off especially in the bass area so I didn't want to have to keep switching back and forth from analog to digital for tv and mess with the sub gain every time I wanted to watch the other. Anyway, I am planing on the new onkyo 1.3 recievers with the new audio codecs and the 1200, but I read somewhere that it won't send the bitstream lossless to the reciever. Is this true??? That just doesn't make any sense. Why design something to be able to do it, but not use the capability? Anyway, since I love movies, would the move up to the 1080p be noticable for the price, or should I just stick with the sanyo. I am going to use a 92 in screen I believe. I think that is the largest I can go. Maybe a 100. I will be sitting back about 19 ft from the screen, but there are other seats that will be as close as probably 10. Advice???

19 ft from a 92 or 100 inch screen is an aweful long way away if you are looking for the theater experience a projector can provide. The usual rule of thumb is viewing distance is 1.5 to 2.5 times the diagonal size of your screen with higher resolution projectors and blu-ray easily supporting the shorter viewing distance.

I've never viewed blu-ray, but if you are going that route and watch lots of movies then going with a 1080p projector will likely give you a noticably better picture than a 720p projector as you are using the full capability of the former (assuming it produces comprable black levels, lumens relative to room darkness and throw distance etc.).

I have a constant height setup. First row is about 13ft back, second row about 18ft or so. For material using my entire screen 2.35 (130" diag.) the back row is best, however, the front row is ok if your not watching a lot of fast paced action movies. Otherwise, your eyes dart back/forth a lot.

For 16:9 HD or 1.85 ratio movies either is fine and 18-19ft is not to far back. The diagonal then is about 105".

A good rule of thumb is 1.3 to 1.5 times the screen width for the first row. However, a lot depends on the type of projector your using. You should not have a problem with the latest technologies.

Randy

I have a Z3 and sit almost exactly 1.5x the screen diagonal. No SDE at all. I used to sit at about 1.25x the screen diagonal, and still didn't notice anything with the Sanyo product. My screen is 104" 16:9 format I really like the size. Nice and big. I've viewed some HD content from over-the-air sources, and they look great at 720p. I know that there are some 1080p projectors that are getting to be more affordable ($3000 price range), but Hutzal is right. The Z series from Sanyo is the best bang for your buck. At about $1500 from an authorized dealer for a Z5, it is cheaper than what I paid for my Z3 2 years ago. A close contender is the Panasonic PT-AX100U. It sells for about $1900, but they have a $400 rebate right now. (The Z5 is like $5 cheaper after you factor in a rebate. I hate rebates though.) The Sanyo also has a 3 year warranty vs. 1 year for the Panny.

Information about both:

Sanyo PLV-Z5

Panasonic PT-AX100U

Depending on seating location and the size of the screen, you most likely will do great with a 720p... But, some people just can't accept that, and have to have 1080p... My father-in-law "HAD" to have 1080p in his new 50" flat panel. 1.5x is 6'3", but the closest seat is almost 10' away... He wasted money in my mind...

I don’t know all the BR quirks, but I did read somewhere a while back that some of them do not support lossless audio. This was one reason I use a PS3 for BR playback. It supports L-PCM via HDMI. But be careful with your terminology. Bitstream is a compressed format. L-PCM is not. Only HDMI 1.3 devices can pass the DD-HD and DTS-M audio streams, with is basically a bumped up bitstream file that the receiver will then process.

When I went from a Pany 900 to the Pany 1000 I did not notice a considerable difference in regards to resolution unless I stand less than three feet away from the screen. Where I noticed a significant (for the better) difference was with Contrast, Color, Blacks and Sharpness. For example; the HD/DVD version of the Mummy II has a dark scene where they are all traveling in the balloon with a dark scene with starts in the background, close up facial shots and a very colorful balloon. Watching this on the new projector just slams the senses because you can clearly see everything. Even all the shadow detail whereas with the 900, some was there, but much detail was lost.

It’s that way with all movies I watch now. I’m constantly thinking “dam that looks good” almost to a point of distraction.

I think that you will be very happy with the Z5 seeing how this is your first projector. But if you really want some eye candy, consider the Pany 1000 or Epson 1080P units. They are both about the same price. The Epson has more lumens whereas the Pany has a more film like image and is quieter. They both come with a three year warranty as well.

Again, read the reviews at projector review. There are a couple very good reviews comparing all the new projectors.

I am looking at the new onkyo receivers with the 1.3 for my blu ray/ hd dvd if and when I get those. I was wondering, if there how much diference is there between the color and the black levels of the epson 1080 and the sanyo z5. Are there noticable differences in pq to the point you would definitely prefer one over the other. ieEnough so that it would be worth the extra money at this time. Setting aside the 1080 vs 720 resolution. Or does it make since to just buy the z5 for really a great price and just wait for 1.3 1080 projectors in a few years that will be the sanyo's price now??? Also, does anyone know how much of a difference the reon chip in the new onkyo's will work? Will this work to upscale all input signals for a better picture on my screen(cable satellite, dvd, video games?)Will this be worth it or is this a money wasting feature?

JH, the presence of Reon video processing in the new Onkyo 875(due mid/late June)has been exciting a lot of interest. It's said to have the best deinterlacing/scaling available. As usual, the question would be if the processing would be in fact visibly better than what the TV set(or projector)would do itself.

Though it is not widely stated the Toshiba HD-XA2 uses the Silicon Optix Reon HQV processing technology also.

Right, but note that the processing in the player would affect only the discs it plays and not other source material(cable, OTA, etc.).

The Epson is the only HDMI 1.3 projector on the market right now. So you’d have that covered. I have not seen the Z5 or the Epson in person. Sorry, I can’t tell you if one would look better than the other. I can only speculate, and that speculation is that the Epson would be better overall.

Another promising 1.3 AVR is the upcoming Sherwood Newcastle. Axiom will be selling it this fall I believe.

The new 1.3 Denons are also rumored to have Reon processing.

But keep in mind that anyone can screw up a wet dream. Just take a look at how bad JVC screwed up the RS1 projector with the Reon chip. Just cause a gadget has the new toys, doesn't mean they'll work worth a crap.

And in all truth, you don’t need HDMI 1.3. It’ll be a good two years before true color is on disks. Per my crystal ball.....

thanks for all the input guys. I ask about the receiver because if it would scale my satellite image up to look good then I could actually watch a lot of the channels I like that are not in HD. Funny, now that I have hd I can sit and watch a show that is just a tree blowing in the wind for hours, but have a hard time watching any other chanel. WEIRD!!! ANyway, is there much difference between the dcdi chip in the 805 in comparison to 875 onkyo? I had the bd 1200 for a few days and I was impressed with how nice it made my regular dvd's look. A little bit sharper, but mostly the color saturation and I guess the depth of the image was much better. Oh, and jaggies were NO WHERE to be seen. Sorry, my mind is wondering. So does anyone know the diff between those two chips and does anyone think these chips will do anything for the highly compressed pictures we get sent to make a difference. It's hard to make garbage look good. Finally about the projectors. Who votes for what??? Do I do the sanyo or spend the money to get the epson 1080? I am afraid of the Panny 1000 cause I don't like rebates, they always seem to get lost or denied for some reason. Not to mention it's like waiting for your taxes to come back. I'm allso afraid because of all the problems I have heard about with the 100ax. Are these similar builds? So that kinda leaves me with the epson for a choice. When do the new projector models come out?? How long till we see a Z6 or better?

Cool…..someone else with ADD on these boards.

The Epson is already out.
No idea on a Z6.
The Pany 100 is plagued with issues. Panasonic is general puts out a trouble free product. No issues with the 1000 yet.
The rebate takes about three months, but don’t worry, you’ll get it. Thousands have.
I have yet to see an AVR that does video processing well. DCDI is old news. They used to be good, but now they are just living off their good name.
Nothing will fix bad cable or sat TV. Sorry, you’re screwed. I know, I’ve invested thousands trying to improve it.

Before recommending a projector, need to know screen size, throw distance and how much ambient light you will have. And where is the projector mounted in relation to you seating.

Well guys, to give you an update on my projector.

There is a faint "Blue Haze" in the top left and bottom right of my projector that is only visible in dark scenes. I am quite disturbed about it and will probably send my projector into warranty repair on monday.

This has come up before on avsforum.com. Hopefully Sanyo Warranty will work with me and not try to just get rid of the unit and send it back to me. I noticed it last night when watching the Bourne Identity. I am having a LOTR trilogy viewing this weekend, I am hoping that I will be able to enjoy the movies and not focus on the top and bottom black bars showing a blue haze.

I'll keep you all posted with updates as they come. Another user got his LCD panel replaced with Sanyo Warranty, and it came back with no blue haze.

-Hutz

Good luck Rob.

If it bothers you enough, as a temp fix you could zoom the image a little and drop the blue haze into the frame. Not sure of the relative size of the haze, so this may not be doable.

I think the best I can do is to lens shift the black bar into the bottom of the frame. The top black bar will still show. However, getting rid of one black bar should be good enough.

-Hutz