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Lets download some music
#267377 07/28/09 05:50 PM
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Last night I was reading a blog from GM DAVE. If you have never played Final Fantasy online then you will not know who he is. Any way I found this post he did and I thought It was very well written and made many good points. Remember this is not my story. Oh, I do not use torrent sites, not cuz they are wrong but b/c I use Newzbin.

 Quote:
Avast, Mateys

It is nearly impossible to be a member of the internet or gaming community and not think about piracy.

We, as a people, are infinitely aware of just how pervasive piracy really is.

Now, while the debate has raged on for a long time, the idea of piracy has come back into focus as possibly the largest torrent site on the net, The Pirate Bay, has been sold to a gaming company.

Oh, it gets better. They're going legit. They plan on changing the site so that people would have to pay for downloads.

Basically, they believe that the massive Pirate Bay user base will follow the site and eagerly sign up to pay reasonable prices to download content.

This is both:

a) incredibly logical

b) doomed to epic failure

Their idea that people would be willing to pay very low prices for such a helpful service makes sense. It makes a lot of sense. People flock to the Pirate Bay every day looking for the latest content.

It only makes sense that those users would be willing to pay a small fee to continue using the site.

Unfortunately, they have failed to realize a fundamental flaw in their plan:

Free > Cheap

That's a big motherf&%@in' flaw.

It doesn't matter how cheap they make their service. They just can't compete with free.

iTunes sells songs for 99 cents each.

99 cents.

That's basically as cheap as anything can be and still cost money.

And yet, if this is such a reasonable price, then why in the hell are there so many mp3 download sites? Why are there so many torrents for music?

The simple answer is "free is better than cheap".

One dollar doesn't mean a hell of a lot to me. One dollar is a price that I would gladly pay for pretty much anything on our planet.

I paid a dollar for the Brady FFXI guide.

That's not a joke.

Hell, even if I lost a dollar, it really wouldn't bother me.

But, if given the choice, I would rather have a song AND still have my dollar.

Here's a quick quiz. Someone offers you:

a) a song

b) a song and a dollar

Which are you going to pick?

If you said 'a', you are a damned liar and you know it.

That's basically what these pay sites are telling you. Yes, those other sites have this shit for free, but we have it for next to free. That's almost as good as free, right?

Not really.

Yes, the service you provide is incredibly helpful. The Pirate Bay is probably one of the most popular sites on the internet.

Unfortunately, there are like seventeen bajillion sites that provide the exact same service.

For free.

Remember Napster? Remember how they tried going legit and charging for downloads?

But they're still totally popular, right?

Right?

Not so much.

As revolutionary as Napster was, there were a bunch of less revolutionary, but still free P2P programs standing right behind them.

Again, free wins.

Now, don't bother talking about morality and legality. Neither of those concepts really plays a part in the decision making process here. Everyone knows you're not supposed to download and they do it anyway.

Besides, we the consumers have spent so many years being dicked around by these companies that they really can't start playing the "fair" card now. They ripped us off on CDs, so now we're ripping them off for CDs.

Hell, half the songs you "buy" from these legit sites come packed to the brim with fine print just so they can dick you over all over again.

It's perpetual dicking.

And they make you pay money for it.

Isn't that backwards? Shouldn't the pay sites be easy to use and helpful, and the evil pirates be useless and difficult?

I just think these companies don't quite get it. They keep giving us these long speeches about how wrong piracy is and how they're the good guys. They talk about how piracy helps terrorism and costs people's jobs.

That's all bullshit.

They're mad because they used to make a shitload of money ripping people off and now, people have found a way to not get ripped off.

No more moneys.

They mad.

And that's it.

It's like Understanding Piracy for Dummies.

Piracy costs them money and they like money. Hell, everyone likes money. Since piracy costs them that money, it is bad.

I might at least respect them if they just came out and said that. Just give us the benefit of not assuming we're retarded or something.

There will never be a solution to piracy until they can provide us with a product that is actually worth what they are asking us to pay. $60 games and $20 CDs are bullshit and we all know it. Especially when 95% of them are complete and utter crap anyway.

They're just mad we've finally figured this shit out.

All the lawsuits and trials are just them trying to put the genie back in the bottle. They need to reprogram us to think that they're the good guys.

And that is working out really well so far.

I don't blame the guys who sold the Pirate Bay. They got offered a hell of a lot of money for what basically amounts to a brand name.

I'd have taken it, too.

But we all know it isn't going to work. We all know the NEW and IMPROVED Pirate Bay is going to crash and burn.

And why?

Because someone out there is always going to be giving it away for free.

And we like free.


http://bannable-offenses.blogspot.com/2009_07_01_archive.html

Last edited by rage96; 07/28/09 05:53 PM.
Re: Lets download some music
rage96 #267381 07/28/09 06:48 PM
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He may have raised a few points, but he didn't back them up.

"There will never be a solution to piracy until they can provide us with a product that is actually worth what they are asking us to pay. $60 games and $20 CDs are bullshit and we all know it. Especially when 95% of them are complete and utter crap anyway."

Where's he getting that 95% number from? At the end of the day this is just his personal somewhat childish rant.
Oh, and 'very well written'? He sounded like my 13 years old niece. If you consider informal/casual communication between teenagers well written...


The sailor does not pray for wind, he learns to sail. --Lindborg
Re: Lets download some music
JaimeG #267383 07/28/09 06:59 PM
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For a blog yes I do think it is well written. I myself like what he had to say and feel that he did make a few good points about the subject. Yes it is not meant to be taken as a magazine article or other such things. Its a blog.

Re: Lets download some music
rage96 #267412 07/29/09 01:46 AM
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The most compelling argument for downloading is that, at least for the major labels, the studios get 99% of the money.

Want to support the artist? Download your music and spend what you saved on concerts of your favorite artists.

With the cost of production electronics as cheap as they are and the internet, I think the Big studio model is dead.

Maybe we are going back to the roots of music where minstrels rely on public good will for their living. Back in the 70s there were very few festivals. Now, there are multiple festivals in any City over 100K in population. I sometimes wonder if the pool of money for artists is just as large as it ever was, but now its much more distributed.


Fred

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Re: Lets download some music
fredk #267424 07/29/09 03:32 AM
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There are definitely too many artists out there competing for attention, and I get distracted by a lot of foreign groups now, which, thanks to the internet, can be fairly easy to order. It's not just what you find at your local music stores anymore. I support every single band that I enjoy by purchasing their music, and for the ones I really like, I usually buy cool merchandise they offer. I wish I could see them all in concert, but I live in an area that just doesn't attract enough culture. I always have to go out of my way to see any of the bands I like, except for one time, when Alien Ant Farm played at a small local club.

Re: Lets download some music
CV #267426 07/29/09 03:37 AM
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Charles, you need to hitch a ride with Bbigwyres. He's truckin' all over the continent in search of vinyl euphoria.


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Re: Lets download some music
Adrian #267430 07/29/09 03:49 AM
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I think I'd rather go with Bbigbarrests.

Re: Lets download some music
CV #267432 07/29/09 03:52 AM
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\:D ....or Bbigbareass?


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Re: Lets download some music
CV #267436 07/29/09 03:56 AM
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\:D


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Re: Lets download some music
St_PatGuy #267459 07/29/09 11:43 AM
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Well, I'm going to go out on a limb here, and likely piss a few people off.

[soapbox]
To me, stealing is stealing. Justify it 100 ways... stealing is stealing. Yeah, I know the record companies have been screwing many artists for years. Not paying for the artists' current music doesn't help that artist get a better contract.

I think WalMart is big and greedy. Should I walk in there and take some merchandise? Will the security guards and cops let me off when I explain that I think WalMart screws some employees and price fixes, and therefore it's OK that I took that beach umbrella?

I'm no artist, but for many years some of my income depended upon me being able to protect my copyright. If someone duplicated and distributed one of my video productions or re-sold a photographic image, it got harder for me to pay my mortgage that month.

Copyright laws are there for a reason, and it irks me when people try to justify their theft of music, ideas, written works, software...whatever... by thinking they're Robin Hood and just stickin' it to 'da man.

[/soapbox]

PS- I don't hold any ill will towards anyone here.... just thought I'd offer an opposing argument.


::::::: No disrespect to Axiom, but my favorite woofer is my yellow lab :::::::
Re: Lets download some music
MarkSJohnson #267494 07/29/09 04:10 PM
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rage96 Offline OP
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You make some very good points mark, I myself download but I do know it is stealing, I don't think of my self as a robin hood b/c I know what I'm doing is wrong, but its free. Free is very tempting. Thanks for making us look at the other side most people would not care to know.

Re: Lets download some music
MarkSJohnson #267495 07/29/09 04:35 PM
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100% behind you, Mark!

[sandbox]
I offer some of my novels (temporarily) for free, but it is MY choice and MY rights. I always make it clear it is copyrighted work, not public domain, and I would be livid finding some web-site offering them without proper authorisation.
[/sandbox]

PS - Read my novels! ;\)


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Re: Lets download some music
MarkSJohnson #268304 08/05/09 03:30 PM
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 Originally Posted By: MarkSJohnson
To me, stealing is stealing. Justify it 100 ways... stealing is stealing.
Amen. I've downloaded one album, well, had it downloaded for me, one that I own on vinyl, but it's very damaged. I tried to buy it on CD, but the band themselves are trying to rerelease it, since the label went out of business, but they're having trouble getting the rights to revert to the authors.

Run on sentence, anyone?

Bren R.

Re: Lets download some music
BrenR #268804 08/10/09 01:47 PM
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Without getting into the morality of it, I thought that you might be interested to know that even in Canada where there has yet to be a law passed that accurately covers the downloading of copyrighted material, Big Brother is watching. As an ISP, every week we get lists from watchdog agencies that somehow monitor torrent sights and such. These lists contain literally thousands of IP numbers that have downloaded something or other. These letters generally ask us to do something about it but with no actual law banning the practice, we just archive the lists in case we are ever legally obliged to produce or act on them. They have a shelf life, but I won't tell you what that is.

For a while there, a law was moving through parliament but it was lost in the recent election. It was stupid anyways, in my own personal opinion, no matter which side of the fence you were on. It basically stated that for each IP address reported to to an ISP, we had to identify the user and mail or email said user to inform them that they were doing wrong. However, it still had no law to prosecute nor was any follow up action included in the legislation. Basically, all it created was a HUGE make work project for all ISPs that would have, in my opinion, very limited results.

Such a law would have made a considerable strain on resources for ISPs as these lists can total 7 to 10 Thousand IPs a month for us. Static IPS are easily identified but dynamic ones require searches through logs. The info is there, it just takes longer. In any case, how long before people got tired of hearing the cry of wolf and learned to ignore these letters?

Could you be stopped, blocked or booted from your ISP in Canada even without a law?
Technically, yes, but it all depends on how your ISPs "Acceptable Usage" policy reads. Technically, running a server goes against the "Acceptable Use" policy of our 'residential' internet service so we 'could' threaten, block or shut down every user using a peer to peer service. However, we wouldn't have many customers left would we? Still, if you are hogging bandwidth like crazy, hosting something that gets noticed as improper, or other infractions, we do have that option and have exercised in in some cases.

Anyhow, I just thought you might find it interesting that obviously there does exist a technology to watch torrent and other peer to peer services and the watchdog groups are indeed using it. Even if they can't touch you for now,
You Are Being Watched.......


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Re: Lets download some music
Murph #268834 08/10/09 07:43 PM
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The funny thing is that you can find a ton of stuff on youtube. If the RIAA can't even manage a single entity, how can it hope to manage all its cutomers and potential customers.

The model is broken. The industry still refuses to recognize this. This seems to be human nature. The guys at the top are the last ones to notice the ship is below water.

I sample stuff by listening on youtube if its available. From their I make a list of discs to buy. I would still be happier if the artists got a reasonable chunk of their disc sales.


Fred

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Blujays1: Spending Fred's money one bottle at a time, no two... Oh crap!
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