Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater receivers? Sherwood, Denon, Yamaha?

Thank you Alan. And I agree 100% with the idea that everything should be done to improve the sound BEFORE running any EQ. I agree with others that it will not fix a poorly designed environment. What it will (and does for me) do is take my best effort and make it better (flatter), especially with my sub.

Some folks do not like flat bass. They 'prefer' some boomy-ness. That is fine, but it is their preference and not what Audyssey was designed to do. Saying that Audyssey does not work because it doesn't make your preferred sound is just not fair.

Well, this is one of those "everybody is right" cases. I was all jazzed to upgrade my geriatric Denon AVR 3300 to something with an auto-set up to cure some problems i had. Then I moved into a smaller, but dedicated HT. Many improvements right off the bat.

Then I ejected the TV for a projector, which let me move the speakers further out into the room, and further from the sides. Big improvement in imaging and clarity.

Then I moved the sub to dead center about a foot from the front wall. Bass leveled out very nicely. From a small 10" B&W sub I can feel LFE in my toes, butt and intestines with a general absence of boominess - although I don't claim my little B&W is like the Axiom big dogs.

The point is, with options to change the sound path (including sound deadening and less furniture) you can achieve great results. I honestly see no need to upgrade my AVR now. [Well, buying a pro amp did a lot on that front as well as it fixed the harsh top end. ]

But, if you don't have those options, as many don't, and I did not for years, the hope and search for dramatic improvement from a computer chip is not a fool's errand. To me, it is no different than the debate over bass and treble adjustment. Purist say fix the room, get new speakers, etc. But the fact is, sometimes you just gotta turn down the treble or push the bass to make your room sound 'right' on your budget. The chips are no different...use it if it works, but don't count on a prefect fix to room interaction by changing the sound at the source.

Great post, Charles.

My, such a learny thread. I think just opening it upped my IQ by a point or two.

My original question still stands. I still don't know what we are helping with other than "doesn't sound as good as my dad's."

Hopefully making some adjustments helps things, but it is still worth while trying to give a little more detail to pinpoint issues.

Maybe it's just the difference in the rooms? I've had noticeable shifts in performance just based on having my set-up in different sized and shaped rooms.

How many times are we going to debate Audessey anyhow?

Until I get an actual answer as to "why not use it"? To this point Alan keeps saying don't use it but never states why he believes it is bad. Finally, he responded in this thread. I still don't know why, exactly. "Acknowledged erratic behavior with subwoofers" is news to me. References would be nice.

The point is for the original poster to first look at his room and speaker placement. That is always the first step. Get the system sounding as good as possible then add Audssey.

I know it seems like I'm a fanboy. I'm not really. I just know it works if setup correctly and do not like it when something is dismissed without reason. I react similarly when someone says that Axiom speakers are too bright.

Auddessy and the auto setup/Denon did strange things with my crossover making them way to high, setting speakers to large and also maxing out my pre-out levels for my subwoofer to +12, another time it was set way to low, and the auto-on wasnt working as should. This would cause erratic, sub optimal performance. Gosh knows what it did with the equilization. I tried running it mulitple times and still was getting funny results but better. My speaker levels and distances for the most part where fine but overall I was not impressed. I did a full reset on my Denon and set up everything manually after that. Just my experience, I realize other people like it and that is fine by me.

As a generalization, I agree with you on both counts. But in the highly subjective world of audio, I have no doubt that in some rooms Axioms speakers might just be bright... at least to someone's ears. As a matter of fact anyone used to, and in love with the sound of laid-back speakers such as Bose and the like, I have no doubt my Axiom set up would be considered 'bright'. So I'm with you on debating anyone who comes along and says "Axioms are too bright". It's not a fair blanket statement... what I mean when I say 'blanket statement' is that it certainly doesn't cover every Axiom speaker, room condition, or listener preference. However, if someone were to say, "I think Axioms sound bright"... well, how can I argue with a single persons opinion?

To me this is where Alan stands with Audessey. I don't hear him saying, "nobody should use Audessey because it won't help anyone". What I hear him saying is, "Audessey shouldn't be considered a cure-all because it won't help EVERYBODY out in EVERY conceivable situation", and that's all I hear him saying. He personally doesn't like it, that's all. You do like it, and nobody can say you're wrong in liking it.

So just like someone else already said, you're both right.

Bottom line is that it works for some and not others. Different strokes, and all that Kumbaya stuff...