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#283288 - 12/21/09 01:00 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: CatBrat]
Happy Birthday ClubNeon Offline
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Registered: 02/06/09
Posts: 3466
Loc: Western Maryland, USA
Hmmm, -18 dB is where I watch just about everything. I don't ever notice what seems like extra bass (I don't use the Tone control at all), actually without the Loudness things seem a little anemic in the bass range. Have you run the MCAAC? With 3-position standing wave attenuation? I think that would still have a little effect even with 2 channels, because it does make adjustments for the main (center, and sub too, if you have them).

Though as I'm always quick to say, what ever sounds best to you. \:\)
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#283296 - 12/21/09 01:53 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: ClubNeon]
CatBrat Offline
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Registered: 08/05/09
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Loc: Milky Way Galaxy
The first thing I did on setup was run the MCAAC. Then again when I used a tripod. The loudness setting was very noticable when listening at -18db to the Dave Matthews and Tim Reynolds, Live at Radio City concert. I had the Tone Bass set at +3db. But, for acoustical guitars, that still seemed like too much bass, +2db would probably have been better. I think the recording was probably engineered with bass emphasis and not flat at all.

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#283310 - 12/21/09 02:16 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: CatBrat]
Happy Birthday ClubNeon Offline
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Registered: 02/06/09
Posts: 3466
Loc: Western Maryland, USA
It could very well be the recording. The DTS versions of Bjork's Surrounded boxset are so bass heavy they sound completely unnatural--regardless of the settings. That's one problem, as your equipment gets better, flaws in the material being played become more obvious. But from what I've heard, that recording is supposed to be a very impressive.
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#290318 - 02/03/10 08:31 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: 2x6spds]
bonobothegreat Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 3
Hi folks,

I'm shopping for speakers for the first time in 17 years and can't decide which bookshelf units to get and was hoping to get some sense of perspective regarding the M22. Many comments and reviews say that they need a sub-woofer but I'm wondering how much this really matters to the casual listener.

As a point of comparison, I was recently gifted some Audioengine A5s for my computer and think they sound pretty good but feel they lack any decent mid-range. Their 5" woofers put out as much bass as I'll ever need, so I figured that the M22, with two of these sized woofers, should have at least as much punch. Is my thinking right about that? The Audioengines are so well reviewed, I wondered if I my mid-range hearing isn't what it used to be and googling has led me to the M22.

I listen to Eno, Bowie, older jazz, power pop, blues on a '93 low-end Denon DRA-345 receiver (8 ohm, 45W x 2). The living room (12x20x9' ceilings) is in a biggish, creaky 90 year old home with hardwood floors. My recently toasted Paradigm Titans (Performance Series) always sounded fine to me (and I always had the bass way down).

So I guess it all boils down to wether or not my cheap old receiver can drive the M22s and if the lack of bass is really a problem if I don't plan on upgrading the receiver or adding a sub for the foreseeable future. Would I be just as well off with the M2 or M3?

Thanks,
Paul

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#290323 - 02/03/10 09:32 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: bonobothegreat]
SirQuack Offline
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Paul, to be honest, I don't think the A5's are even in the same ballpark as Axiom speakers, maybe some other members will comment. The m22's will probably do a fantastic job, as would the m3's. The A5's appear to be a powered speaker like one would use for a computer setup. The Axioms are audiophile speakers used for Home Theater or Music listening.
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#290324 - 02/03/10 09:33 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: SirQuack]
Happy Birthday Ken.C Offline
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If you're not using a sub, I'd probably go with the M3 by preference, although the M22s are lovely.
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#290339 - 02/03/10 09:57 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: bonobothegreat]
JohnK Offline
shareholder in the making

Registered: 05/11/02
Posts: 10644
Paul, welcome. As a highly satisfied M22 owner for almost 8 years now, I can assure you that for most music a sub isn't essential with them. In-room, my measurements show strong bass down to about 50Hz and much lower, but still usable response around 40Hz. I now use the EP500 sub I got about three years ago full-time for very low frequencies(e.g., pipe organ, some movie low frequency effects)and for even better bass response in the 40-80Hz octave. However, on most music the bass is very satisfying with the M22s alone, and I highly recommend them for such use.
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#290340 - 02/03/10 10:09 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: SirQuack]
bonobothegreat Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 3
 Originally Posted By: sirquack
The A5's appear to be a powered speaker like one would use for a computer setup. The Axioms are audiophile speakers used for Home Theater or Music listening.


Yes, that makes sense. I guess my question (buried in there somewhere) is whether or not the M22 are likely to have acceptable sound when powered by such an anemic receiver or if I'd be better off just getting the M3s.

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#290341 - 02/03/10 10:23 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: bonobothegreat]
Wid Offline
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Registered: 06/22/03
Posts: 6806
Loc: The Peoples Republic of Il.

As long as the receiver is functioning properly you will have no trouble pushing the M22.
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#290342 - 02/03/10 10:38 PM Re: Which bookshelf to get? [Re: Wid]
CatBrat Offline
axiomite

Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 6015
Loc: Milky Way Galaxy
I started out with the M22's and a cheap Sony 100 wpc (so called) and I didn't get hardly any bass. Then I switched to a Pioneer Elite model with approx the same wpc and I get plenty of bass. Not deep bass, but enough for most music. Sometimes I'm supprised by the amount of bass I hear, especially at higher volumes. There's been a lot of talk about it doesn't matter which receiver you use, that it all sounds the same anyway. That is true if you are comparing comparable receivers, but to go from a cheap receiver to a much more expensive one, there will be a noticable increase in power and in bass response.

Edit: I've listened to both the M22 and the M3's. While some prefer the M3's, I prefer the M22's because of the clarity of sound over the M3's. I would get the M22's if you plan on improving the receiver sometime. If not, then the M3.


Edited by CatBrat (02/03/10 10:41 PM)

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