Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater Digital Upsampling

Hello All...In looking at the current Onkyo line of receivers I've noticed from the 801 model and up they list 'digital upsampling' as a feature. I am unable to locate on their website what this feature means. Anyone out there know?

it's for improving the audio from compressed files like mp3...I think it does a little more as well. sorry I can't help more, that's all I know about it.

Willy, I don't believe that's correct.

As I understand it, digital upsampling converts CD audio from 16-bit/44.1kHz (one sample every 44,100th of a second) up to 24-bit/96kHz (one sample every 96,000th of a second). Basically, the upconversion processor examines the original data stream and, using some mathematical functions, creates more data to put in between the existing bits -- a process called interpolation.

Theoretically, the new data steam more closely represents the original waveform, resulting in a more natural, less digital sound. The results of upconversion can range from significant -- meaning you can easily tell the difference -- to none.

I concur with pmbuko in all he says. I would add that most people would not notice much with the upsampling unless your player is more than 5 year old or soo...
You would get a more "percieved increase" of sound detail in HDCD and SACD. Some receivers even go further than upsampling and have a digital noise reduction such as in Pioneer Elites...I have yet to hear a CD in my collection to hear a gigantic difference. But as in all harware you get what you pay for ... some really low end CD players and receivers do have really cheap DACs...and you would notice a difference in sound in comparison with the higher end electronics. Based on "my experiences" stay away from electronics with Ashai Kasei AKM DACs. Stick to Burr Brown, Crystal, Wolfson, Delta Sigma and Cirrus Logic DACs.

In reply to:

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Willy, I don't believe that's correct.

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You are right, I was wrong (just don't tell my wife I said that).

Hi,

My experience with Digital Upsampling has been very good too. But it was not done by any receiver but a pretty good PC soundcard.

The first time I used the EGO-SYS Waveterminal 192x soundcard using some cheap desktop speakers, I was stunned by the clarity when I tried the upsampling features available on this card.

My source was a CD (16bit/44.1kHz). I first selected the matching output on the control panel of the card. i.e. 16-bit/44k. The software driver allows you to select from the foll. sampling frequencies - 44.1, 48k, 96k, 192k and bit lengths - 16-bit, 20-bit and 24-bit).

At 16-bit/44k, it sounded very similar to the output that we were always getting from our good old Soundblaster Live soundcard. But when we changed the setting to 24-bit/192k - WOW. The CD recording just came alive with detail on those lousy desktop speakers. The difference was huge in between the 2 settings.

My DVD player DVD-RP82 also has some upsampling features - it can bump up the 44.1k signal to 88.2k max. But I cant hear that much difference between the 2 settings.

Sat, are you getting rid of your 53TX because of those inferior Asahi Kasei DACs it uses ?

You don't miss a thing, do you?

Oh ho and JohnK comes out with a strong left jab (pardon the pun).
I swear John has a research staff working with him now. Either that or he's a full time retiree with alot of spare minutes for reading.

I have it on my 53TX but don't use em for 2 channel listening... I use the Wolfson DAC is my Cambridge player and use the DIRECT mode the 53TX as most of the Elite series have. I enjoy my music that way. I have numurous times compared NAD 753 Cirrus DACs and Arcam Wolfson DACs both with the Elite 53TX DAC and Rotel 1065 DAC which both use the AKM DAC and I still personnally prefer listening to the Cambridge Audio Wolfson DAC, Marantz NPC (Delta Sigma copy) DAC, Rega Planet Delta Sigma DAC. The DACs in the Rotel receiver has seemingly a lower grade AKM vs the 53Tx. I could not listen to 2 channel stereo on my old Rotel RSX1065 flagship reciever. I found the sound too restraining or lacking detail. The 53TX AKM dac is a little higher and provided a better sound. But even today with numurous test using the DAC of the 53Tx vs going direct using a passive preamp from the Cambridge player to my Bryston power amp to my Maggies, I still prefer this method.

Good try though.
I enjoyed that link. Now I do not have to go further to dig into whats inside.

cheers.

The main reason I sold my old Flagship Rotel RSX1065 for the Pioneer 53TX was strictly for MCACC. I always had issues to tonally match any center speaker or rear surround with my Maggies. MCACC gave me the closest match after EQ calibration. I do not use its DAC or even power since I use Brystons to power my speakers. Since Motorola does a great job in the DSP arena I did not have any issues with that...since also used by Meridian system.

I'm relieved, Sat. I was concerned that because of those bad-sounding DACs that you weren't experiencing true purity of sound, but didn't realize it. Now just so that nobody using those B&K, Pioneer, Rotel, Yamaha, etc. receivers who think that their units are transparent reads these revelations.

Sorry it my must be my godlike ears...the ones that ring with tinitis.