Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners VP160v4 Impressions

For the benefit of those who are looking for a center, I'm posting my thoughts.

My MLP is pretty much in the center of a 4200 cu. ft. room dedicated to A/V. I sit 14' from my M80v2, 13.5' from the VP160v4, 13' from each side QS8v2 and 12' from each rear QS8v2. The EP800v4 is 13' away almost under one of my right sides. The 160 is up high enough that it's tweeter is aligned with the tweeters of my M80s. I'd categorize the room as somewhat lively but not overly so. There's no wild ringing from a hand clap but it's not dead-sounding either.

I'm powering everything with the last great receiver Onkyo made - the tx-nr818. All speakers are calibrated within 1.5 dB of 0. A more than comfortable listening level for well-recorded movies and music is -15 dB on the Onk's gain knob. -10 dB is about as loud as I'd want to go to not risk hearing damage. I watched Bright yesterday which I consider as having a very high production value including the audio. -15 on the gain knob didn't leave me wanting for more. It sounded like a movie theater with better bass.

My previous center was a VP150 v2. BTW, VP stands for vocal point. My VP150 has found a home at my good buddy's where it has replaced a small Mirage. The VP150 is leaps and bounds better sounding than the Mirage at his place. I will say however the Mirage has better off-axis response but his room is narrow and therefore off-axis response is not important.

I lived with my 150 for 11 years but I can't say I've been happy. Rather, I have tolerated it. I've been patiently sitting on the sidelines watching what Andrew and Ian have been cooking up and how they've been cooking it. I know Andrew is a very talented engineer who worked with Ian Paisley; the 160 was the first product he worked on at Axiom back in 2010. With my renewed confidence in Ian's and Andrew's abilities, the v4 tweeter introduced 3 years ago, improved cross-over, improved cabinet stiffness, improved mid-range driver baffle, improved drivers, Black Friday bucks, my loyalty discount, a trade in for my old sub and a very generous offer from Ian, I decided to go for the 160 and 800 (to replace my 600v2). I felt it was time to end my torture and support what I feel is the most innovative company in audio today.

I couldn't be any happier with the 160v4. It's everything a centre should be. The horizontal response is almost flat +/- 45 deg from the normal. Up to 80 degrees from normal it's still usable and sounds better than the VP150v2 when listening dead-on. The 160 sounds the same from 6' away to 16' away. I've even listened +/- 20 degrees vertically and there was negligible change in response. The detail across the entire spectrum is fantastic including the bass which is tight, deep and controlled. I have not heard any breakup from the 160; I can't say the same for the 150. With the 150, I found myself turning it off and listening to a phantom center. The 160 sounds natural for both movies and DPLII music. BTW my Onk found the cut-off for the 160 to be 40 Hz (same as my M80s) but I know I can get usable bass down to 32 Hz from this centre in my space. I left the setting alone because it sounds awesome.

With the 160, Axiom has nailed the center speaker. There is nothing more to be done. While I have not heard the 150v4, it's the same driver configuration as the 150v2 so I'd caution buying it. Instead, buy the 160v4 and be happy knowing you have a well-engineered speaker you'll be happy with the rest of your life.

Nice write up.

I love my vp160 v3.

I really wish I had v4 for my whole lineup, with all the improvements made, but they will constantly continue to improve even beyond that. With their passion and dedication, I don't really see a ceiling for axiom

I agree with your assessment. Axiom is a gem of a company. I'm a customer for life.

They have been incredible accomdating, helpful and generous to me.

I truly believe Ian has only one goal and that is for listeners to experience audio like they've never experienced it before. That's the way it should be. Those of us who have worked on products our whole lives live to create experiences for industry that are pleasantly unexpected and excitingly surprising. This is the ultimate expression of design-thinking. I don't work on anything any more unless I see an appetite and opportunity to make a significant and completely unexpected change to people's lives. Life is too short for unexciting products.

The v4 tweeter is very well done. It's quite amazing really. My v2 tweeter broke up and I proved it to myself by swapping out the 150v2 with the 160v4. The v2 tweeter really was harsh to listen to and the v4 is perfect. I always thought it might be the Onk but no. I now need to upgrade the M80s and surrounds but damn that's a chunk of change and I'll likely have to be patient and wait for more Axiom bucks.

The 160 is completely optimized within the existing architecture and I don't need any measurements to have that proven to me. The only possible improvement that can come from a future center is an active cross-over. There's also the LFR center but I think you really need a very wide and long room for that one.

Congrats

The VP160 is an awesome unit totally a compliment to your M80s. Originally brought out for customer demand as the driver array is supposed to be the best for off Axis response although with either the 160 or 180 you likely have similar performance.

Yeah I almost hit submit on my cart for the 180 the day I bought the 160. I sometimes wonder what if. But for the reasons mentioned, it's why I went with it.

When I upgrade all equipment in the future, I may consider whatever the current flagship center is.

I'm just going to say you made the right choice and leave it at that. Truly...don't look back.

Just fix your damned room because I get ill thinking of those M80s that are almost next to each other and the QS10 headphones...LOL!

Lol it's fine and sounds great

...if it's any consolation, I get also get ill thinking of your speakers football fields apart...not to mention a self admitted neglect of aesthetics to the monstrous room itself

:p

..and you call yourself an engineer...LOL

Everyone can benefit from seeing how their system measures. Its not the same as the anechoic graphs. At least I hope not!

The 160v4 is so incredibly awesome! Crystal clear! The new midrange and tweeter combo is wicked!

Anyone with a 150 should stop robbing themselves and enjoy the hedonism the 160v4 offers.

Real hedonists run a VP180v4 HP!!

I just didn't feel confident with that driver configuration after owning a 150.

I received my HG Rosewood VP160V4 - all OK. Quite a spiffy shipping carton in use now - same style as the Axiom Air box but much larger. The external shipping straps make it easy to lift & move around.

Once it was installed (a bit of a PITA due to its weight), I fed it Clapton's 'Slowhand at 70' Blu Ray in surround sound mode. It got a good workout & sounded great as I expected that it would...

TAM

It's a very good center and, like the 800v4, I have absolutely no complaints. I'll be at JBrad's place on Sunday to listen to his LFRs and 180. I am very curious to compare the 180 against the 160.

I am interested to hear your thoughts - but strictly on the two speakers LOL - as I am looking to upgrade my 150 and I am not sure which I will purchase.

I will give you as honest an opinion as my two ears and brain can muster.

I couldn't find anything wrong with how the VP180 sounded. It blended into the soundstage with the LFRs. I'm thinking of upgrading the 160 I got a month back to the 180. Maybe even the HP.

To me the 160 is very cumbersome looking and could be distracting even when up against a 70 inch panel. I built mine with the layout similar to the 160 but more sized towards the 180. I may entertain buying some HP drivers to replace what i have now. The 180 could potentially play louder i suspect but i dont listen really loud ne way .

You been hitting the hooch and ganji, Richard? The 180 has twice the nad mass of the 160. It's the Mandingo of centers...lol!

I have been contemplating the on wall version of the VP180. I figured the 4" depth is reasonable to mount below the 70" flat screen without appearing too big. Anyone heard the on wall VP180?

IMO, when there are 2 EP800s in the same space, the VP160 doesn't really look out of place, even beneath a 55" Sony screen in my room.

The HG Rosewood really is pretty & classy...

TAM

Did you end up trying the 180 in your setup? Or stuck with the 160?

I did not try it in my space. I just could not justify it because the 160 sounds very good.

I've been thinking about all the discussions lately around power levels and SPL. It could very well be I don't like to play my system loud because I detect distortion and find it obnoxious. We'll see what happens with the ADA and the M5HP. Maybe I'll discover I like to turn it up.

Having said that, one of my buddies came over yesterday and I had him listen to the track Ian posted. There were things he could not hear, others he could not hear clearly and most bizarre of all, no matter how much he tried, he couldn't perceive depth which was so very obvious to me. He's older than me by 5 years and has trouble hearing people when there's a lot of noise. Where I'm going with this is we have to protect our hearing because it would suck if we can't enjoy our music.

Good point. The best speakers money can buy are wasted if your hearing is permanently compromised. I can't say for sure what volumes I listen at without an SPL meter, but I feel like I'm in the same ballpark as you in terms of preferences. Sudden loud moments in movies need to be loud enough to make me jump a little. Clarity and detail are most important.

"Clarity and detail are most important."

And soundstage which includes width, depth, height and clear imaging rather than fuzzy outlines (within the constraints of the venue and recording of course).

Curios how much speaker toe in used during the original mixing comes into play, if at all

Or a poor source....

Or poor cables...hee hee...

So I'm now seeing a refurb vp180 in stock in the exact colour I need. Should end up being cheaper than a new 160. Would I be crazy not to go for the 180?

Consider that the new 160 may have upgrades the refurb 180 doesn't. The v4 of 4 years ago most likely is not the same as today's. The 160 also has buttholes on the rear. If it's too close to the wall, taming the bass could be a challenge. Finally, will you drive yourself crazy wondering what the behemoth sounds like compared to the 160?

Damnit, forgot about the rear ports. Didn't realize that they made incremental improvements outside of the version #, and that v4 has already been around for 4 years.

I keep coming back to the 8-ohm vs 4-ohm thing. Seems like such a bonus that the 180 can pull twice as much power from the amp vs the 160. But I suppose that only matters if you're looking for huge SPL.

Incremental improvements are made throughout the lifetime of a version. My sense is the v4 is now fully baked.

If you look at the impedance chart, it's 4 Ohms in limited bands. You'll be very happy with the 160.

If not for the >2" height difference, I'd be totally set on the 160. I've got 62" of wall height to accomodate a 65" TV (33" screen height), the center channel, and a media stand, so it's gonna be tight.

I ended up calling Axiom this morning and Ian happened to answer. He confirmed that there were no incremental 'tweaks' on the 180v4. While I'd be under-utilizing a 180 in my setup, he saw no drawbacks to using one vs the 160. I also asked about the rear-firing ports and he said 2" from the wall should be sufficient (and port plugs are always an option if needed).

Still unable to make up my mind, I opted to order both, with the option of returning one.

Good to hear. It'd be great if you let us know how the two compare in your set-up.