Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners M22 vs M5HP

Currently have two M3ti's in the office where I do a good bit of movie watching and music listening. Love the M3s, but it's time to upgrade, as they are 15 years old. Saw some M22's for $500 on the deals page, seems like a great upgrade? What's the diff from the M5hp? Are they the same cabinet?

The M5HP cabinet is a bit larger volume. The height is very similar. The M22 doesn't go as low. I heard the M22ti and it sounded thin but many others like it. Compared to the M3, the M22 and M5 sound more like real music. The M3v4 is very mellow and soothing but not as detailed (accurate).

The M22 is a fantastic speaker ... I’ve done a 3 second listen between them and an M2 as I swapped out one for the other ... My Impression was that they sounded very similar except that the M22 was much more efficient ... I mean noticeably louder by at least 3db. The M22 requires a sub IMO and I can highly recommend the M22/EP500 combo.

I have some M5s but I’ve only used them as surrounds so far. I guess I can try a quick a/b ... but I’m not sure I can do it this week ... too much going on.

Don’t let Mojo turn you off on the M3 ... it’s a fantastic speaker for what it is ... a small bookshelf trying to compete with much bigger speakers. It’s more forgiving (Then the M22) and very pleasant ... it can stand alone but a sub will also add quite a bit. The M5 is supposed to be the full range bookshelf ... we will see.

The M3v4 is more enjoyable than my old M80v2. That may sound surprising given the mid-range on the M80 but I place high weight on expanse of soundstage and imaging. Mid-bass is also better. I also find the M3v4 soundstage integrates into my rooms better. In fact, the less drivers, the easier and better the soundstage room integration. The bookshelves also acoustically disappear better than the larger speakers. Interestingly enough, the M50s are very good at disappearing and are also very good with the bass because they are more linear down low than the M3v4 and M5HPv4. You can see the M3 and M5 both have a low Q bump at around 100Hz and the M50 is flat. The bass depends on room size though. In my largish basement, the M3 and M5 are well-behaved in the bass. Not so in my other rooms including the living room.

Between the M50v4 and M3v4, all other things being equal, I'd take the M50. Note though both the M3 and M50 are more "laid back", less "analytical" than all other Axioms. This is due to the lack of the dedicated mid-range driver(s). Some actually like this a lot. I certainly do at times and wish there was some way to switch modes from analytical/detailed to mellow/laid back.

I like the M3's midrange. The M3's have a pure midrange which I attribute to the lack of a crossover. The M3s have a cap to protect the tweeter from low frequency signals but the driver is mechanically rolled off. The Reference de Capo speakers also rely on the natural roll off of the driver. They are expensive and interesting speakers.

M3s? I'm a fan.

My M3v4 have a pretty hearty cross-over. I spy an air core inductor, a few resistors and a few capacitors. It is not the M3 of old.

if you were not to add a woofer, M5 or M22?

Why discontinue the M22?

MeanIng no sub ...
Knowing the M22 ... and going by what others have posted on the M5 ... the M5 would probably be my pick.
But that said I’d like to hear them my self ...

The M22 was likely discontinued because of sales figures. Once the M5 was introduced, a conventional 3 way bookshelf, interest in the M22 dropped off. The cabinets are the same size almost and the M5 plays lower according to spec. I always thought the M22s looked a little odd myself. Really prefer the look of the M5s.

I think both are beautiful.
Typically more people will prefer the low end from the M5 as the M22 must have a sub. The M22 does play mids to highs really well just not much low end

I was drooling over the Bryston model of M5 in store for a couple years. Beautiful high end AV shop in the middle of Skid Row. For those in the know the shop is on the corner of Hastings and Carol across the street from Pigeon Park Vancouver. {Roughest neighborhood in Canada}.

Haven't yet tried the M5 my self. The 22 was my second venture into Axiom still one of my favorites. Though I now use mine as front heights/Atmos. My Anthem works them pretty hard as I run them as rear surround 7th channel reset to front on wall.{5.1.4}. They make my M80 massive entire front wall soundstage.

I like the tall thin look of the M22 ... and sound wise it is a great combo with the EP500

I'm kind of toying with making a proposal to resurrect an "M22 like" speaker as a floor standing one paired with a sub. This gives a complete full range package at hopefully a reasonable price point (no stands needed).

To differentiate it I'd accentuate the thinness by removing ~1" form the front and back (if that didn't interfere with sound or foldability of the box in some way). This would give it a much less boxy look than an M50 or M60 ... a sleeker, lighter look which might blend in better with some decors. The M60 is 37.5"H x 9.25"W x 15"D. I'm thinking this one could be the same height but say 37"H x 6.25W x 13"D with a grill going the full height to keep the visual tallness. Besides helping with offsetting the volume loss of making it thinner perhaps the extra volume in the cabinet could be used to extend the bass a bit or trade for another visually thinning element ...

ahhh, Once again ... I'm wasting time when I have stuff to do ...

Perhaps a transmission line design to get as much bass as possible?
Jeff

Just three drivers ... sounds good already (if that can be maintained) and it keeps costs sane.

I have listened to a transmission line design that had just three drivers although it was 40 inches tall I think or it could have been 44”. Reproduced down to a claimed 34Hz of very good sounding bass.
They were impressive for what they had.
Jeff

what are the woofers in a M22?

Here is the "hidden" link - https://www.axiomaudio.com/m22-bookshelf-speakers

I have both M3's and M22's. They are older, Ti versions. Have not heard M5's.

The M3's are a perfect bookshelf speaker for those areas in a home (or other space), and you just don't have room for a sub - and only want a 2 channel system.

The M22's almost "need" a sub, but sound fine OK without one. I am currently using them as side surrounds in a large room where they are about 8' away from the closest seat. When I have this system in mulit-channel stereo mode, and sitting near the M22's, I am often impressed by just how good they sound. They are a great little speaker. JohnK used to praise them all the time on this forum, saying they could compete with the larger Axiom speakers. He was correct.

Still sayin' it , Mike.

John,
Music, not equipment ... can we not enjoy both?

Maybe a completely different category of enjoyment in recognizing technical excellence. Dr. Toole has pointed out that music is emotion, audio equipment is science. He comments that "When emotions get transferred to hardware it can be problematic".

That comment by Dr. Toole was in the comments to a very informative article by Brent Butterworh of SoundStage here . Among the valuable commenters to the article were Dr. Toole , Dr. Olive and our Ian.

Thank you for the link Mike, that's just what I was looking for! I'm thinking the M5's are the way to go as I don't plan on adding a sub to the office. thanks again!

Glad to see you're still around, John.

Indeed!!



Much simpler to remain Borg, perhaps....

I look at sound & equipment as being separate ... I'm always on the prowl for best performance/$. In the 90's one of my hobbies was finding great speakers at a value. I trained on speakers which were beyond my price point (B&W 802's) and then went searching for ones which sounded similar at a fraction of the price ... less known brands usually fill that space.

When I bought my turntable, I knew I was buying cool tech for cool tech sake ... I didn't think it would make a bit of difference to the sound. Buying actives I was relying on trust of Axiom for the new tech. Big amps took me years to decide that they had a justifiable effect (as I always auditioned them at reasonable levels) ... Although I'll never justify an ADA1500/speaker. That was Axiom's doing in pricing the Active/ADA1500 intro package at a level I could not turn down.

Now, I think you and Floyd have a very good point ... Most High-End buyers are buyers of equipment not sound.

Rereading that last line ... I should have said "IMO, a lot of High-End buyers are ..."

to your comment rrLev: " The M60 is 37.5"H x 9.25"W x 15"D. I'm thinking this one could be the same height but say 37"H x 6.25W x 13"D with a grill going the full height to keep the visual tallness. Besides helping with offsetting the volume loss of making it thinner perhaps the extra volume in the cabinet could be used to extend the bass a bit or trade for another visually thinning element ..."

Well said, although I would like to go higher! Like T-Rex higher! lol, well maybe not quite that high, Middle-T? those active cabs are probably deep. Yeah, we need to stay in that 15" range. Makes you wonder, though, what does 2-3" inches of depth do to a cabinet? I guess Andrew would know.

Tweeter should be around seated ear level + or - ... So 37 to 42 probably works. I’m sure there are acoustic issues involved with the cabinet dimensions. I’d be happy with an M22 with the lower half just being a stand ... it might be perceived as being different enough. But going the extra mile to lighten its look even further might help with Getting decor approval while also differentiatIng the product from Axioms other offerings.