Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion The Water Cooler Trigger pulled!!!

13 years after building my M80+4xQS8+VP150+EP500 (later on replacing VP150 to VP180 and EP500 to EP800), I have just pulled the trigger on... (drum roll)... 2 M100 and 4 QS10!!!!. Can't wait to slowly rolling them in (M100 are ordered directly while the QS10 are from "I can wait 21 business days"). Now "I can't wait one day"... Very excited and looking forward to break my back trying to move the M100s!

You are going to love all that. What finish did you choose?

Completely diffrent than everyone else: Boston Cherry!

Wow! Pretty exciting upgrade.

It's actually a multiple cascafing upgrade. M80s moving upstairs to replace m22s operating without subwoofer. 2 QS8 moving into the same room for second surround room. Then 2 qs8 go to reading room for 3rd surround room! Then going to use the replaced m22s into a zone 2 new room.

Man thats awesome! I can't wait to hear your review of the 80 to 100 upgrade as i'm currently struggling with choosing between the two myself. You're smarter than the average bear for clicking the "I can wait 21 days". I ordered my rear channels (80ow & 600EP)speakers on July 28th (couple days later I couldn't help but order some M5ow's for the kitchen) and of course I didn't think "I could wait". Turns out, my wife was right, I am dumb, and I can wait! lol Hope to hear something soon. I guess if you go with the piano finish it's really a dumb move not to get the "I can wait discount". As i've not heard when these things may be shipping. Really hope to hear when you listen to those 100's. Boston Cherry should be an easier build. I went with a white piano, which is probably the worst order they get. So I will be patient, till day 21. It's day 17!!!

Did you go piano?

Be patient. They are busy and you are right, piano is a tricky finish. I ordered a custom speaker finsh as well and remind myself they are made to order one pair at a time.

They have pretty strict QC so rest assured they will look excellent.

I built some speakers a while back and learned just how hard it is to get a polished look. Very labour intensive! I finally just gave up at really good but not perfect by any stretch. They cant do that.... yikes! Would be a tough way to make a buck with all the custom choices. Pretty cool for sure for us though.

My comparison between M80 vs M100 will be a bit skewed as my M80s are V2 and there seems to have been significant improvements between V2 and V4. Piano finish sure would look great, but since I use a projector, i presume the light reflections from the speakers would be too distracting.

Yeah, waiting is the toughest part. Not realizing that clicking a box would save me $600 hurts a little more. Ian, if your listening, a pair of used/any finish M5hp's will make all the pain go away!

Smart not getting the piano finish in that listening environment. Do you use a power conditioner or amp?

No conditionner, but an ADA-1500 for amplification, fed by an Anthem Statement D2v

how many channels is your ADA?

8

Fingers crossed for my M100s to ship today! Would be nice to take tomorrow off and just wait for the FedEX truck! :anxious:

I feel your excitable anxious pain... all good things comes to those who wait, or so i'm told! I'm looking forward to your review. You may want to invest in a ring cam, you'll be able to goto work and still speak with the delivery guy via video chat. Comes in handy when the wife gets crazy on amazon! lol

I work from home these days and use a ring dog to warn me someone is at the door and I don't hear the door bell!

En route!

Interesting day yesterday. I decided to do my cascading upgrade gradually. So I turned my home theater into a stereo system and upgraded my reading room with 2 QS8s, reusing my old QS stands that I kept for all those years even if I didn't need them anymore. Quite nice. It makes the room very envelopping. So +1 for that upgrade. After a few hours of listening there, I went back to my home theater and watch an episode of Good Grils.

Then I shut off the lights and the projector and reloaded my playlist with the material that I had originally used when I got my M80s and fell in love with them. (S. solo violon Bach/Zehetmair, Kodaly's cello sonata with Tortellier, Cello solo suite 1 Bach/Kuijken, Beethoven Grosse Fugue with Juilliard, Miroglio's Extensions (percussion) and then some JIT selections. And... I FELL IN LOVE WITH MY M80v2 ALL OVER AGAIN. What a speaker!

Too bad my day is filled with meetings today, but I will try to get my "family room" first surround, then replacing the onwall M22s by the M80s.

It quite interesting ... when I first learned of Axiom, the V2 was new and people on this board were all over them. Fast forward to today, where some on these boards diss the V2 and promote the virtues of the V4 makes me wonder. I mean ... how bad could the V2 have been. Have a feeling it was a very good speaker line at that price point and in that day.

My initial 7.1 purchase from Axiom was all v3. M80s, QS8s, VP180 and EP800.
My M3s are the only v4 speakers I have purchased. They all sound great, v3 or v4.
Of the v3 I hear nothing that gives me pause to consider replacing them in my Theater. That’s my experience, others I’m sure may feel differently.
Jeff

Ok. I'm one upgrade away from needing a roommate or a girlfriend! Those M100 are TALL and HEAVY! Still sweating from the effort. Now, 2 more hours of meetings before heading back to Home Theater!

So far, so good. Just taking them out of the box is a challenge. So tall, you can't just pull the box up like the M80s. You need to carefully pull, bend, pull, bend, pull, bend and then eventually, the box will clear the ceiling. And 81 pounds ain't light. I can't wait for the QS10 to be here, but right now, I am under the impression that I have surrounds (and good ones) and a subwoofer.

Very early comments:
1. Incredible pin-pointing of players. Solo instruments do fill the stage, but you can "see" the source and it's not the speakers, it's just "in front of you, on the stage" (solo violin, solo cello, piano tried so far).
2. Listening to records I am very familiar with, I was surprised more than once with greater than usual dynamics.
3. Pipe organ is so far what shone the most. Intentionally picked a few works with light, rapid fluid notes inter-mixed with heavy and low pedal works. That was genuinely a nice experience! Some of the deep, long notes from Kneller's preludium in C were AWESOME.
4. Chamber music was very sharp and detailed with accurate sound stage.
5. Small orchestra extended a little past the speakers. Instruments more clearly identifiable. In the first movement of Mozart's piano concerto in C minor, you could recognize the smaller orchestras within the orchestra. Something I wasn't able to do very well before.
6. Large orchestra extends beyond the walls of the room. That was unexpected. Straight stereo and you get an effect more frequently delivered by multi-channel recordings.

Not sure what is due to V4, what is due to M100. Pretty sure the strength and quality of the bass and possibly higher dynamics comes from the M100 HP woofers powered by an ADA-1500, but I would tend to think that many of the above are just from the version. Anyhow, this is after just 90 minutes. Hopefully, I will be able to get back to it after 18:00! And hopefully at some point neighbors will leave for a while and I will see how loud this can get!

(on another note, my family room with the M80s is a HUGE improvement)!

Since then got lots more listening.. Bruckner's 8th (complete,), and had tears coming up many times. Now giving pop its turn with a few tracks with supertramp and pink floyd. I think non-classical listeners would be just as happy my those GOD LEVEL SPEAKERS as i am. I'm so happy to have decided to pull the trigger on this cascading upgrade. Will likely put me in good mood for like.. 3-4 days at least

"It's like if a veil has been lifted"
I forgot to make that joke yesterday quoting soooo many reviews everywhere.

A few more hours of listening in. Everytime I feel my ears have adjusted, I hit something that surprise me, especially with dynamics. At times my heart almost stops as the music gets suddently so punchy and loud! And then soft again...

So, my summary to date is:
1. The difference is NOT "it's like a veil has been lifted"
2. Pretty close to my 13-year old M80v2, but everything "a bit better"
3. Power from the M100 is noticeable, to be actually impressive
4. Bass is also much closer to a subwoofer than my M80s
5. I only did music so far... I will report later on TV, but until I get the really future expected large improvements with the QS10, I'll probably just wait (2-3 weeks to go)

Looks like my access to the boards has been restored. I kept getting a message that my IP address was listed in the Stop Forum Spam database as a known spammer/spambot. Since this is the only board I am a member of, I assume an Axiom AI had enough of me until it no longer didn't.

Eric, I had no doubt you'd like your M100s. I replaced my M80v2 with M5 and that was an incredible difference. The move to M100v4 from the M5s had some sonic pros and some sonic cons.

The biggest differences I found between the v2 and v4 were deeper and wider soundstage, a more believable soundstage that started at the front plane of the speakers and spread back to the front wall, significant improvements in mid-bass, mids, highs and image placement and space between the images.

One big surprise with the M100s was the greater emotional satisfaction for movies. Instruments and vocals were more realistic with M100s than M5s but imaging and soundstage was better with the M5s.

Of course all this depends on the listener and the room but those are my impressions.

Jacques Louissier sounds far more satisfying on the v4 BTW. And get a load of the mid-bass and virtual images the following track offers.

https://open.spotify.com/track/7FE3yVQkgwifYMAxUko7rO?si=yJk563UyRZ2fX8Vyfz977w

First time I turn on the projector since I got the M100s. Very intense playback. You can almost feel the objects in the room. I was not expecting that. Now really can't wait for the qs10 to here and my ep800 amp too! Kudos Ian and Andrew! One day I'll have a dedicated music room and go for LFR1100 active, but right now this is as good as it gets.

How this is working...

As I took sight of them, I told myself... now how am I supposed to unpack this??

[img]https://app.photobucket.com/u/efalarde/p/897d822e-783d-4752-8c00-9b113ec2a142
https://app.photobucket.com/u/efalarde/p/897d822e-783d-4752-8c00-9b113ec2a142[/img]


M100 all naked

[img]https://app.photobucket.com/u/efalarde/p/8178f2ed-fc42-4d1e-8c48-59886268d72f[/img]

Fully dressed


[img]https://app.photobucket.com/u/efalarde/p/8662c179-bcf3-4e18-b7bb-9bf176100e76[/img]

In front of 90" screen (I since then swapped the grills so they look as if the system is radiating outward)

[img]https://app.photobucket.com/u/efalarde/p/16e9475d-518a-431b-815a-354ba7e97aaf[/img]

I prefer the look and sound of naked Axioms.

Great news.... love to hear you first impressions!

OMG! OMG! OMG! ONG! OMG! The QS10HP ARE SHIPPED!!!!! Crazy !!!!!! THANK YOU AXIOM. I wasn't expecting them until Sept 11. Now i might have to change my vacations

Love the excitement!!!! That’s a great feeling!!!

Congrats. Fun times.

Is that a delivery truck pulling up to the house?........

The QS10s will take everything an ADA-1500 can dish out. LOL!

OK, after lots of listening (and some watching today), I am ready to provide early impressions of M100v4s+VP180v3+4xWS10HPv4s. First thing first, NOTHING sounded worse than before! Always the minimum bar for an upgrade!

For some reason, the first word that came to mind, both for the first music experience and video one is "intense." Not sure why, but for some reason, it still feels like the right one. First attempts where: Pire Organ (in large venue), String Quartet (in smaller venue), Sacred music recorded in a church. Then I went for true MC records (ex: Berlioz' requiem with the four brass orchestras in 4 corners, a mass by Biber recorded in Salzburg cathedral, which is one of the few remaining one still laid out as per prior-1900s with orchestra and choirs on the sides rather than the front, and some other music written with for instruments all around the listeners). Impressive.

The QS10 brings a very stable room reproduction. I always found the QS8 to be a little bit "airy" for music. Not fundamentally bad, but maybe more appropriate for movies than music. The QS10 are THERE. Even if they disappear and you don't actually "hear" them, you know you are surrounded by virtual walls that feels just as real as the gyproc ones. In a church, the walls feel so far away. For small chamber music, the room becomes very intimate. For MC music with actual instruments in the back, it's still not as good as having "regular" speakers (I would likely have M100s as surrounds in a music-only setup, or use that for an excuse to get a pair of M5s), but the QS10 are a significantly better compromise for a multi-purpose room.

My neighbors left early this morning so I was able to crank it up quite a bit for a little while (still have to work...). OMG! There were fortissimos that litterally exploded on the ceiling! And I still don't have my subwoofer back. The M100s generate so much powerful and clean bass, it's uncanny. And I could feel air displacement coming from all directions. Those QS10 sure ain't scare of the ADA-1500 (as Mojo mentioned). So for music, appreciation goes: probably better, better, impressive and quite a few WOW here and there. Sometimes you feel like the music is just "grabbing you" and so spacious at the same time.

Now, for video, I had watched a few episodes of Startrek Enterprise (just because I have finally decided to finish that series) last night. Once again "intense" was the first word that came to mind. But today I check some specific stuff (like the car race in Cars). In general, all the action and interactions seem more "immediate" as they were happening for real. Quite a few helicopers moving a round. D-Day in Band of Brothers was so "intense" that I stopped watching after just a minute or two. Just too real for "testing." Then I watched the opening sequence of Lost. The bass was almost defeaning. I watched a few more scenes as it was mesmerizing, almost like seeing it for the first time all over again.

I think next upgrade might be to tackle center channel, but low appetite for now. My setup is tough because I am using a short throw projections in a room with 5'8" ceiling. That causes the VP180 to be only 6.5" from the ground, which is a bit low. I was actually toying with the idea of eventually replacing the VP180 by 2 M5s (Mojo?) that could be put higher and on the side of the projector. I'm not sure. Might try something out with M3s first. My D2v supports 2-centers and I have a spare channel on my ADA-1500.

That's all for me now.
Pretty happy with the results. Not a cheap upgrade, but it allowed me to get 2 rooms surround, one my M80 (and moving the M22 as Front Heights).

I know you bought a house back in 2012 I think and your HT room is 14 x 17? But I didn't know the ceiling was so low.

Regarding the M5 as a center, it depends on how far back you are going to sit from it. I tried it and at 14 feet back, I didn't like it. Don't get me wrong. As I've written many times, I love the M5 sound. It just doesn't work as a center for me at that distance. Your results of course may vary. Try one of your M22s or M3s. If one of those work, the M5 is a sure bet.

As for dual M5s as a center, I'd shy away from that.

Unfortunately Mojo, i had some very dark years and had to sell the house. I'm impressed you remember the dimensions of my ht room. Now it's smaller but hopefully in a year or two it will be big again

I am very sorry to hear about your situation.

I have uploaded the QS10 images into my bucket: https://app.photobucket.com/u/efalarde/a/e0ef8b63-6525-4e97-b9a4-233af71a336b

That Boston Cherry is very nice. It goes well with that booze I bet.

Yeah, and almost the same price!

QS10s look great! I moved to M5HPs for my surrounds, but QS10s look like they also would have been a great upgrade from the QS8s I was using previously.

As pretty much a final set of thoughts. Had the chance the be without the neighbors for a whole day so I could give it a tougher run. I watched things like San Andreas with lots of earthquake and helicopters time (always great to test surrounds). Then I watched Godzilla (the one in 3D), more of Cars and many other "Catastrophe" movies or with heavy dynamics like some Star Wars scenes.

So many times I almost got on my feet to "dial down the sub a bit in case neighbors are coming back"... Just to pause and remember that my EP800's amp is actually in Axiom's facilities at the moment. The bass output of those M100s is quite simply astonishing. During the earthquakes the walls were shaking and I could have sworn someone had installed an butt-kicker to my chair! And not some bloated bass either. No, very deep, clean and sustained.

Well... let's just say that all those movies and scenes have gotten more... Intense!
Now I can't wait to add the EP800 and see how it behaves... when the neighbors will be gone again!

Woot! Woot! EP-800 amp is on its way back!

Eric, was that a v3 amp? Was it repaired or replaced with a v4?

Yes, V3. Not sure what has been. It might not have shipped today actually. Just the "order" for the return created.

Eric, based on what I've heard today in a 13x20x8 foot living room, I now believe you don't need a sub with the M100v4. And the goodness doesn't stop with the incredible bass. They were made to be placed on the short wall in such a room size. Wow. Just wow!

I agree. I have my sub amp back (looks like a new one) and although I do think that with very deep bass (pipe organ and action movies) the EP800 does add move volume, I pondered multiple times if I would recommend someone to get M100s without sub (and then add it later) over M80s + sub if price is an issue. Very interesting question. Right now I am using the dual config of my D2v to have one with sub and the other one without. I added a "pick random config" to my remote software. I have to admit, so far I didn't really managed to consistently be right, especially if I leave the room for a few minutes and then get back in (to make sure I don't hear the slight telltale sign of the switch). But I'm at least 50% of the time right, so I'm halfway there.

Even with pipe organ with very low pedal works, the M100s wowed me too!

Yeah, in my living room, the M100s are way over the top when it comes to bass. My living room provides a nice boost that gets the M50s to play well right down to 30Hz. The room is good for the M2s also. The M50s, M2s and A-LFRs are the only Axioms that don't need bass EQ in my living room. The A-LFRs are better than perfect in that room as far as bass is concerned.

I turned my subs off last night. I was taking measurements and forgot to turn them back on. Today I listened for over an hour before I realized the subs were off. The old M50's kick a heck of a lot of bass out. IMHO, the 50's are the best speakers made...M100s arrive later this week, looking forward to my opinion being changed.

I do like their laid back, low res sound. You'll see what I mean when you get the M100s.

Ok. I gotta comment here too. Laid back? Really? I thought this tower was touted as dynamic big time? Sarcasm maybe mojo? Or do you mean they just play effortlessly ?

When I said laid back low res sound, I was referring to the M50s. I was expecting you to hear the difference between the M50 and the M100. I guess you did. The dedicated mid-woofers make a huge difference.

Gotcha. That makes more sense. I couldn’t live with out the mid woofer. It’s the best. In my opinion of course. I bet the m50 plays V curve tunes really well.

It plays everything well actually. Some complained the M50ti needed to be turned up loud to sound good. I don't find that. Loud does sound very good though. The mid-woofer does add a lot of detail and clarity but the M50 and M3 sound is very relaxing.