Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Advice from Axiom Owners Hsu vs Axiom sub woofer

I'm hoping some of you can help me out. I'm about to purchase my new HT system and am going small with m2i's for fronts, qs4's surround and vp100 for my center. The room is 10 x 14 and i'm looking for a compact sub. I'm comparing the Axiom EP125 vs the Hsu STF-1. They are approximately the size i'm looking for. I've read many reviews about the higher level Hsu's and it looks like I could save about $100 cdn getting it over the EP125. The specs seem to be about the same between the two subs however getting the EP125 will allow me to match the speaker finish as well as discounting the whole system. Any thoughts are welcome.

well, you just mentioned the biggest benefit of the EP125.. it will match the rest of the speakers.. but, if that isnt that big of a deal to you, then i would suggest the STF-1. this subject has been mentioned numerous times in this forum before, and the answer is always the same.. axioms subs are good, but the HSU's are better. plus, the STF is cheaper, so how can you go wrong!

so there it is, plain and simple.. if the look is most important, go with the EP125, and you will be just fine. if performance is most important, go with the STF, and you will be even better(just not as pretty)

bigjohn

How about a SVS PB10-ISD?

thats a good choice also.. i didnt mention it cause he seemed to have already investigated the STF-1.

go check out the link that tom has.. that is the new SVS 10 inch woofer. its frequency response is better than the axiom sub and the STF sub, so give it a peek.. i dont think they start shipping til oct or nov, but its a great sub from a great company..

thanks tom!!

bigjohn

What about the new Outlaw Audio Sub? I picked one up and am very happy with it.

The LFM-1 is more like a Hsu STF-3. Different beast altogether than the STF-1 or STF-2. The Outlaw is an excellent sub though (I have one too).

i think the SVS may be a little out of my price range. I'm also not sure how to get it here in Canada. I do know that Hsu now has Canadian distributors where before they did not take orders from Canada.

I'm really interested in know how the two subs i was asking about earlier compare in terms of sound quality. I'm not looking for blow the walls down bass but I do want a rich sound that complements the highs and mids of a complete HT system. My original thinking was to get the Axiom because i figured that it would be a better match with the other Axiom speakers I will soon be ordering. The many posts on this board suggested going with Hsu because it was a better bang for the buck. Did that mean most people think it sounds better than the Axiom or that sound quality doesn't differ but the Hsu can be had for cheaper?

>>Did that mean most people think it sounds better than the Axiom or that sound quality doesn't differ but the Hsu can be had for cheaper?

I haven't heard the Axiom so just going on reviews here. The general consensus seems to be that the Hsu goes deeper *and* holds up better at high volumes than the Axiom, but the Axiom may be better for a pure music application by virtue of having front-firing driver and ports. I don't know the mechanics of it but there seems to be a general view that down-firing subs are not quite as "quick and responsive" for musical applications.

I was ready to get an STF-2 but the dealer I spoke with suggested that I would be happier with the PSB if I was primarily listening to music. They sold a lot of Hsu subs for HT (great LFE *and* great value) but still leaned towards the PSBs for music.

I imagine the Axiom subs are similar to the PSBs in that regard. Don't know if this helps

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They sold a lot of Hsu subs .....

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Which dealer was this and when? Hsu sold very few subs through dealers. Reason being is the markup the dealer was allowed was small in-order to stay in-line with Hsu direct pricing. I have a friend with a PSB 6i....and it sounds good, but my guess is that dealer was trying to sell you what he carried.

American Sound at the north edge of Toronto. Great place, by the way. They went from selling mostly PSB subs to selling mostly Hsu.

They did have a stack of STF-2s in stock, and had both brands set up side-by-side in the showroom.

The guy I spoke with figured they sold 90% Hsu these days. It's entirely possible they might have been trying to keep both suppliers happy, but if you look at all the reviews and average them out there does seem to be a general bias towards front-firing subs for music and HSU/SVS for HT.

There is one STF-2 review which goes on at great length about how "musical" it is but that seems to be the exception.

OK, now I'm a "hobbiest". Huh ?

Shouldn't it by "hobbyist" ?

I liked being a frequent flier and I want to go back.

Ahh...OK, so this is recently.

I don't sense that bias though about front firing subs for music and Hsu/SVS for HT. If you said sealed vs ported, then I would agree. Experts agree that all things being equal, downfiring vs frontfiring makes no difference due to the length of the soundwaves a sub produces.

Did you compare the the PSB and the Hsu? In Canada, what is the price difference between the 6i and STF-2....here, I think it is almost $200....in Canada I would think it is much closer.

Yes, this is all in the last couple of weeks.

Hsu STF-2 was 599 CDN, PSB 6i was 765 CDN. Roughly $130 US difference. Arguably the STF-2 is closer to the 5i in terms of driver and cabinet size although IIRC it goes deeper than 5i OR 6i.

I have to admit I don't understand why a down-firing sub would be inherently less responsive than a front-firing sub. It's hard to believe that a one foot difference in path length could make a difference with a 30-foot wavelength, I agree.

I could come up with some explanations if you stuck me on stage in front of a surly audience but I can't say I would really believe any of them

Sorry, the Hsu was 549 not 599 so more like $160 US difference. Might have been a mistake going with the PSB, not sure, but I'm pretty happy with it. It has a few features the STF-2 did not, like line level and high level outputs for main speakers.

http://www.hi-fidelity.com/DVDCases.htm

Hello rad sci guy,

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I'm not looking for blow the walls down bass but I do want a rich sound that complements the highs and mids of a complete HT system.

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Given your sentiments, check out this excellent review by chesseroo:
http://www.axiomaudio.com/boards/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=HT&Number=56708&page=&view=&sb=&o=&vc=1

Even though its the EP350 reviewed this should give you a good idea of what the EP125 can do in a smaller room. From chesseroo's description of the EP350 I'd say the EP125 will do exactly what you're looking for. All reviews I've read indicate it's an excellent sub that is very musical. If you want that gut wrenching HT experience then I'd give the soon to be released SVS a go. Getting it into Canada is a none issue, its just that you'll have to pay tax and brokerage fees ontop of the exchange and shipping. Duty shouldn't apply as its made in the US. I worked out the CND price and if I recall correctly it came out to about $650.00. This is about $100 CND more than the HSU STF2 purchased in Canada, but given the posted specs could well be worth it.

Good Luck, Jag

John, not a mistake at all. If you haven't read Tom Nousaine's sub reviews in the current S&V, note his analysis and lab test results . It tested best of the under $1,000 subs, slightly better than even the fine Outlaw LFM-1, said to be very similar to the STF-3.

Great link John. Nousaine had more courage than we did in pushing the max limits of the subs during his testing. Then again, he can probably afford it.

Did you notice Nousaine's subwoofer setup methods? His approach to setting up a crossover seems to ignore the THX guideline.

Uh oh. You know the gauntlet has been thrown when use someone's favorite source against them.

Hi Jag

Thanks for all the info in the link. I hadn't thought about the usage of the system (movies or music) but the more I thought about it the more I realize I'll probably have a 50/50 split between the two. I not into hearing pounding bass in my music but rather a more "musical" sound and It appears that many feel that the Axiom would provide such a sound. As for the SVS unfortunatey it's priced out of my range at the moment. The EP125 is at the limit of my price range and that's why I was considering the STF-1 instead of the STF-2 which is higher in price then the EP125.

I"m probably leaning toward the EP125 but I'll try and get out to a store that has the Hsu and listen to it before I purchase. I can always buy the Axiom and then if I don't like how it sounds return it in 30 days and go get the Hsu instead.

Personally I've found the Hsu subs to be the tightest bass I've ever heard from a sub.

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I"m probably leaning toward the EP125 but I'll try and get out to a store that has the Hsu and listen to it before I purchase. I can always buy the Axiom and then if I don't like how it sounds return it in 30 days and go get the Hsu instead.

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Sounds like a good plan rad sci guy. I know the feeling I'm back and forth trying to decide exactly what I want my system to be.

Consider this though. From what I've gathered and I think most would agree, all these are excellent subs and I'd bet you will be very happy no matter which way you go. The decision is really in the "flavour" of the sub as apposed to good or bad.

Good Luck, Jag

PS thanks JohnK for the link. Cool read...

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I'll try and get out to a store that has the Hsu and listen to it before I purchase

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Tough to judge any sub on what it sounds like in the store.

Costco has 125 watt, 12" KLH subs for $89 down here. You could get 4 of those and use them all over your family room.

Blech! Those have got to suck big time if they're going for only $89.

Blech! Those have got to suck big time if they're KLHs.

Made in China - just like the HSUs. (is there an emoticon for devious grin?).

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Made in China - just like the HSUs

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So is Axioms drivers I'm sure that would include their subs.