Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Technical Questions Speaker cables in general

I have read a lot of articles on speaker cable, and to be honest it gets a bit confusing. I have some friends that swear that they notice a significant difference between regular speaker cable and the high priced monster and others. I have a hard time telling the difference. So my questions is:
If I have M60's, 12 gage cable, and radio shack compression banana plugs (How I currently have it set up), is that good enough or am I doing myself a disservice by not getting the more expensive cables?

There are obviously two schools of thought on this issue, and things will likely get hot around here before the dust settles. But, it is my opinion that you're doing fine just as you are. Enjoy.

I haven't tried more expensive speaker cables, but I have tried expensive interconnects and heard no audible improvement over radioshack (gold series) interconnects. I don't have any personal experience, but I'd venture that the speaker cables are the same. Stick with whatcha got.

MJ, any piece of metal that has adequately low resistance, considering the length of the run, works as well as anything at any price. Even if your friends swear that on a stack of bibles, they're deluding themselves and could never identify a difference in a controlled blind test. If you have the typical length of run to your M60s of ten feet or so, then 12ga is more than good enough and is a bit of overkill.

Stickto the science, both measured and studied mjwilli.
JohnK speaks the truth.

You can always tell your friends you bought some expensive Nordost cables and let them listen to some music before you show them. Get their glowing comments before they see the 'new' wires.

As much as I love to go against the science guys around here, I can not argue on this one. I have tried the mega buck wire and the good old Home Depot stuff and heard squat for difference.

Though Axiom's cable does look cool and the insula... er, dielectric... ($10 for that word please) is nice and flexible, it's still 12ga. copper, sounds the same as the pink stuff I was using - bought the Axiom stuff for WAF only.

Bren R.

You mean we agreed on something again? Uh oh.

It's that time again. Someone start a break in thread, quick!

Full moon? Perhaps are speakers have broken in at the same time and we are now as one in the audio universe?.........I gotta get to bed. I get tired, I get goofy and it's going to get me into trouble as there a few folks in here tonight looking to argue. lol :-)

Who, me? As my wife frequently says (about herself), "I'm sweet and innocent."

Hell no, not you at all. You take all points into consideration. Some do not.

Some take the "If science says, then it must be true" a little to the extreme.

I don't buy that train of thought.

Obviously you didn't read my response to you in the other thread. Or a lot of my old posts. I'm trying to temper it, though.

I have seen a few of your posts and you are relaxing a little. It's great to defend a position and I have no problem with people doing that. What gets me is the tone and the overall condescending attitude some have in the way they present there case. It's not what if, it's more like “this is the way it is and if you don't buy into my ramblings you are a fool”

Yeah ok I look like the fool here how?

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Some take the "If science says, then it must be true" a little to the extreme.

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Define the word 'science' here.
Too many audiophiles take the term out of context.
Science does NOT just mean taking measurements with a meter, it also includes the tests derived from HUMAN HEARING under CONTROLLED CONDITIONS.

I'm sorry but anyone who has ever taken a high school science course should know about basic methodology and removing all influential factors from the experiment. Home listening tests mean squat except to the individual beliefs of the person listening. The reports are subjective and hence, cannot be considered accurate.
That does not mean they don't hold truth, but other information w/o bias is required to make conclusions fact and not belief.
This is often a simple and logical approach that is disrespected and ignored as it does not suit the requirements of the home audiophile and their craft.

chess, I hear ya and I agree on some points.

You know what? I'm tired of this whole debate. It has moved into 2 or 3 different threads and people are taking pot shots at each other based on there own beliefs etc. It's wrong and a lot of people have taken this to a personal level. Again, wrong! At the end of the day if it sounds good to the person listening to it, so be it and who cares why!

I like the debating. Its fun and I usually learn a thing or to but when it hits the level some of these threads have gotten to, it’s not fun anymore. Heck you just posted about Saturn and BrenR’s use of “Pro” gear and implied that “Pro” gear is immensely better then consumer gear. I don’t think that is always the case but I chose not to respond for fear of starting up a “Pro Gear vs Consumer Gear” debate.

Anyway, I think people (including myself) need to think before they post and this place will be a lot more fun!

All agreeable NH.
Pot shots need to stay to a fun minimum (you old goat) or at least in PMs.

My thought about pro equipment vs. consumer level was just that though. If home consumers were really looking for 'the best' stuff, we wouldnt' be buying Krell or Plinius and touting it as high grade. Chances are we would be buying the same brand names that the pros use to actually record the very music we hear at home. I know of very few ppl who have such equipment for their HT or music systems. Bren and Alan would know a ton more about this subject.
I should note that the Axiom listening room does have some pro equipment but Ian has also ventured into some music recording lately so there is a requirement. For more information on this particular notable, Alan or Ian would have to chime in.

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we wouldnt' be buying Krell or Plinius and touting it as high grade. Chances are we would be buying the same brand names that the pros use

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I agree with you on this one. For a time I ran all Crown amps which are not really intended for HT use. Anyway, I had a zillion watts in 4 different amps and I don't think I paid anymore then $300.00 for each amp. I think the one I was running for my fronts was something like 750watts into 8ohms! You can get an ungodly amount of power going this route and the amps for the most part sound just as good as the consumer based ones.

I'm actually a little surprised it doesn't come up around here more. Take the 4ohm M80's. Why drive them with a $4000.00 Krell that puts out 150 a side when for under a $1000.00 you can get a Crown that will put out 1250 a side! lol

I've been very confused about that myself. I've used and am relatively familiar with products from Crown, Mackie & QSC, and they're all excellent amps. Why wouldn't you want to use these for HT?

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Why drive them with a $4000.00 Krell that puts out 150 a side when for under a $1000.00 you can get a Crown that will put out 1250 a side! lol

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And this is exactly the kind of scenario that made me start asking questions about high priced (or low priced) audio gear and how it was all rated, ranked and reviewed.
Things just did not make sense.

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I've been very confused about that myself. I've used and am relatively familiar with products from Crown, Mackie & QSC, and they're all excellent amps. Why wouldn't you want to use these for HT?

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They're not very user-friendly (accidentally set one in 70v constant voltage - bridged mono, hook up your speakers and watch the fun!), they're big, unattractive, require fans to keep them cool and they're off the map for anyone walking into their local Circuit City.

Bren R.

Lemme guess... the cones fly across the room?

What's the use of that setup?

Even a little Mackie 1400 isn't going to sneeze or hiccup at the requirements of the average HT. Certainly not mine, anyway. As I recall, they're pretty darn quiet. I can't imagine one getting particularly warm when asked to deliver 75db dialogue and the occasional explosion. I guess my question is, is there some compelling reason in terms of sound quality why I wouldn't want to use one?

None I can think of... you could even use the effects loop to chuck a compressor/limiter in (for "Night Mode").

Bren R.

Oh, no. You'd want to put that in the master inserts at the board...

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They're not very user-friendly (accidentally set one in 70v constant voltage - bridged mono, hook up your speakers and watch the fun!), they're big, unattractive, require fans to keep them cool and they're off the map for anyone walking into their local Circuit City.

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That applies to most ppl out buying HT systems, but how about the no holds barred audiophiles in which such inconveniences are not inconveniences?
Lord knows enough of them exist, although probably more so on the forums than the Joe Average guy down at Circuit City.

My thinking is of course the power is absurd overkill, but they're built to withstand cigarette smoke, spilled beer and merciless punk bands. For far less than the price of (insert your esoteric boutique amp brand here), you can have three Mackies that would hide quietly over in the corner. I'm just curious as to why you don't see this more often in HT setups.

DMN - if you're running into a board, I'd seriously consider either working out just how many sources you're mixing, or considering maybe a girlfriend.

Bren R.

I thought your compressor comment was a joke (or you were just poking at me because of one of my previous posts). The boards and club days are long since gone. My girlfriend knows I'm a nerd, anyway.

Was just poking fun, and yes, I was kidding.

Bren R.

Thanks to all. I like it when you can get good listening quality without having to pay premium prices. I will stick too what I have

Heres the link that convinced me about speaker wire.

http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm