Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Home Theater SACD/DVD problem

As some of you know from the SACD thread in the stereo section, I just bought the Pioneer DV-578A to be used primarily as a SACD player. I already have the Panasonic DVD-RP62 that I use to watch DVDs. I would like to continue to use the Panny for DVD's, but I have run into some issues. I am using the Onkyo SR600 receiver.

1. I have no multichannel option on the CD mode through the receiver. I had to setup the new player to use the DVD mode (but I'll be almost exclusively listening to CD's with it) and the old player to use the CD mode.

2. The CD mode can't be programmed with a device code. I would need to point the remotes at each other and input each command manually.

First, does anyone know enough about these two players to know if one is any better then the other? I think my options are:

1. Take the Panasonic DVD out of the picture and use the new player for everything. The Panasonic is supposed to be a good player though, so I am a little hesitant to do that. Is the Pioneer just as good? Another holdup here is that the new Pioneer is an open box model that came without a remote. If it is going to be my main player I would like to have the remote, just in case there are certain things my receiver remote can't do (there are one or two things like this now, that I could probably manually program from my existing DVD remote, but without a remote for the new one that is not an option). I would probably want to return this open box model and go to the next closest best buy that still has a couple of this model left and spend the extra $25 to get a remote and manual.

2. Finally break down and get a remote (most likely a Harmony, so it is easy for my wife). This fixed the programming issue, but DVD and CD would still be swapped. This would annoy me, but I could get used to it. I'm sure it will annoy her as well (no, I'm not selling her ) I don't think there is a way around this without a new receiver (not happening, I like the one I have and am not going to upgrade for something so minor), but if there is a way around it I'd like to hear it. Actually, it makes sense now that I think about it. The RCA cables for SACD go into a spot on the receiver that is labeled DVD, so this must be why multichannel only appears under DVD.

3. Scrap this SACD idea all together and return the whole batch of stuff. I would have to keep the SACD Floyd CD at this point since I listened to it already, but that is minor, and it is a hybrid anyway.

Any other options anyone can think of? I am missing anything? I am probably leaning towards option #1, assuming my concerns about the Pioneer vs. the Panny are unfounded.

It never fails....$70 worth of Best Buy gift certificates and I still will end up spending $100 anyway.

Hmm...I don't know if I could give up my SACD's and I don't think that you have to either. I have a semilar setup so this might help. I have a CD player and a universal player. The CD player for stereo mixes (duh) and the universal for DVD and multi-channel audio. From your description it sounds like you're wanting to use one input (DVD) for 2 inputs and I think your only choice is to use two inputs. I ran an RCA for the CD player and 5.1 (SACD) and digital coax (DVD) for the universal. My suggestion would be to run 5.1 RCA's for the SACD and a digital coax for the DVD player (to Video 1 input). Other than that, I don't see any other options. Best of luck.

Yea, what he said.
I actually have my player hooked up 3 ways. 6 RCA cables for SACD, Coax for DVD and then stereo RCA cables for stero only SACD (so my sub gets pulled into the mix)
When I want to play a sacd, I switch the source to dvd and then hit "ext. in", which activates the six seperate channels (this is how it works on a Denon) for dvds I just turn the "ext" off and then for 2 channel sacds I have the player RCA cabled into "aux" so I can hear them 2 channel + sub with my crossover settings.
Sounds alot more complicated than it is.
Good luck

Bray:
You made me realize that I need to spend time with the manual of my Denon 3805... something I really haven't had time to do yet.

I have my Pioneer 578 hooked up to the receiver through the 6 analog inputs for the sake of SACD and DVD-A discs. I also have two CD jukeboxes daisy-chained (as they were designed) to the analog RCA "CD input" on the receiver.

When I pop in a movie, the 6-channel analog inputs sound fine. When I listen to multichannel SACD/DVD-A, ditto...fine. But when I listen to a "stereo only" SACD or DVD-A disc, I've become aware of the fact that I don't have any subwoofer output. Makes sense, since there's no "point-one" channel for the receiver to see.

I've been leaving my receiver on the "large" setting for the front M60s so that I don't have too huge a bass loss without the sub, but I figured there has to be a better way!

In response to Zarak:

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Scrap this SACD idea all together and return the whole batch of stuff. I would have to keep the SACD Floyd CD at this point since I listened to it already, but that is minor

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How can you even consider scrapping multichannel, hi-rez discs arter hearing DSOTM on SACD? It makes me wonder if something isn't setup right on your receiver or player, because I can't imagine someone hearing that disc and saying "I can take it or leave it"....

This whole hi-rez disc experience has been a learning experience of trial and error for me too (and I'm still learning, obviously) but I think it's so worth it!

I effectively have two DVD players. The Pioneer is being used for SACD and the Panasonic for DVD. It seems like I need a DVD1 and DVD2 on my receiver, since I have to choose one of the DVD players to be controlled by the remote in DVD mode.

I have RCA to the SACD and digital optical for the DVD (panny). There is also a video cable, but it appears I have that going right into the TV (I'd have to pull everything out to be sure, but it looks this way from what I can see).

The SACD goes into the 6 RCA connections on the receiver, but these are labeled DVD.

The DVD goes into the optical connection on the receiver, which works in either DVD or CD mode on the remote.


As far as the last comment on giving up SACD....I did hear it in all channels and do feel it was setup correctly, and it was a good experience and I enjoyed listening to it, I just don't know how much I'll be using it since I have just one SACD (two in a couple weeks). I guess I'll use it more as more stuff comes out on it, I probably do a lot more CD listening in the car then at home though. The speakers were purchased mainly for HT, but I do listen to some music as well.

If I was using a single player I would hook things up the same way Bray. The issue appears because of having two different players and trying to control them both through the inputs available to me on the receiver.

If I took the Panasonic out of the picture and just used the Pioneer, I would hook things up this way. I just don't know if the Pioneer is as good of a DVD player as the Panny, which is my only holdup with doing that.

What possible inputs do you have on the receiver? Is the 6 channel (5.1 or whatever) a discreet input? Can you assign various digital or analog inputs to different devices? On my H/K, the 6 channel is a separate device from the 8 channel and the DVD and the CD etc. Doesn't your receiver have Vid1, 2, 3, etc? I'm a little confused as to whether the problem is semantic or technical.

Click here: http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?m=TX-SR600&class=Receiver&p=i Then click on photo gallery and rear view to see the connections that I have. The 6 channel is labeled as DVD, and I only have one spot (other then the digital area) for DVD, but in actuality I now have two DVD players, one of which will only be used for SACD.

I do have video 1,2,3, but I don't really care about these since I don't really need video for the new DVD player. It is strictly going to be used for audio ie. SACD. The CD inputs only have 2 channel, not 5.1 like the DVD one.

Does this help? Let me know if you need more info.

OK, how about this... put the new player on the DVD inputs (you don't even need to hook up the video parts), set it to use Digital in 1 or optical (depending on the outpust of the player). Put the old DVD player on Vid2 or three, and assign the other digital in to that video. Et voila! You'll have to screw with the remote to get it to be universal for both of them, but if you really need to do that, you should probably spring for a new remote. Does this solve the problem, or am I missing the point?

I think you are basically explaining the way I have it now. The new one uses the RCA DVD connections on the receiver. The old one uses the optical connection.

When I switch the mode on the remote to DVD, it operates the new one, since only my DVD mode has a multichannel option for SACD.

The player I use for DVD's actually then needs to be controlled through the CD mode on the reciever. This works fine with DD and DTS, but is a little confusing since I control DVD's in CD mode. The CD mode also must be manually trained a button at a time by pointing the remotes at each other and programming each function in. I can't just use the code for the device and have everything work. If I leave things this way, that is where option two from above likely comes into the picture and I buy a harmony remote.

I'm actually not using the video connections on my receiver now. The old DVD hooks right into the TV. The VCR gets to the TV through the cable connection. I don't have any other video sources (ie. playstation) that I am concerned about at the moment. I supposed I could hook up the TV to the receiver and the DVD to a video input, but I probably didn't have an extra cable or a need for that at the time so did it that way it is now. That is not really an issue in this case anyway, since I don't care about the video portion for the new player.

OK, so the problem is the remote control. Or am I being dense?

I'd say the only good answers are to

a) get a new universal remote
b) get a reciever with a separate 6 channel input.
c) use the new thing for everything

In other words, I have no useful advice.

I think the problem is a combo of receiver and remote.

If I get a new remote I will still be controlling DVD mode on the receiver for my SACD player, and CD mode for my DVD.

I'm not getting a new receiver, I'd scratch SACD all together before doing that.

Use the new for everything was my other option, but I was looking for advice on the quality of the Pioneer vs. the Panasonic players. Is the Pioneer just as good of a DVD player?

I let this problem sit for a while, and then I was driving to work yesterday morning, and BAM! it hit me.

My remote has an audio select button, that allows the receiver to switch between using OPT1 (for DVD) and Multichannel (for SACD) mode. I can actually turn both sources on at the same time, and use that button to switch between them, even though they are both in DVD mode on the receiver.

Now, my only problem is that I can't control both DVD players through the remote, since only one can be set to the DVD mode.

I need to do one or both of these I think.

1. Return the 578a and get one that is not open box so that it comes with a remote and manual. Use that remote for SACD.

2. Buy a harmony remote. I assume this will allow me to program in multiple DVD players and manage both.

I might need the remote for the 578 either way, since when I try to use to code to have my current universal control it, not everything works. Normally you can point the remotes at each other and have the universal learn when this happens, but without the original I can't do that.

Perhaps the harmony gets around this. I believe there some setup on the computer you can do with it, right? I have to start looking into them more. My wife wants one too, to make it easier, so it might be a Christmas present for both of us Any recommendations on which one to get, with the following info in mind?

I have two DVDs, a TV, and a VCR. A new TV is in future plans, and I'm sure some type of DVR/Tivo will come someday.

I just ordered the 659 but it has not arrived yet. On the website there is a demo for programming the remote and it looks like you can program more than one DVD player into the remote. You should go there and see if the 578 is in the list: here The demo is at the bottom of the page.

I would say that you would probably want to get the 688 as it is the only on with an actual hard button for a PVR but I'm pretty sure you can program any one of them to use a pvr -- you may just have to use the LCD screen for the PVR on the other remotes.

Anyways, I will give you my impressions of the 659 when I get it, probably sometime next week.

I use the 688 w/ my Pio Elite 45TX, HD Tivo, Denon 2200, VCR, and Panny Plasma. Works GREAT for PVRs, though the button placement/size is a case for argument. A little small and close together, but still works fine for me. You can reprogram any button to any device function or use the soft buttons. You can also create separate activities, one for 2 channel CD and one for multichannel DVDA/SACD. OR, you can do what I did and w/ the CD activity, just add some of the A/V functions to toggle multichannel. But then you'd need the ability to do the same on the CD player too. User preference.

I used to use the 768 which is WAY more programmable. I had to learn XML to customize it even more. VERY powerful but take some time to learn how to get the most out of it. Personally, for PVRs, the 688 is better. The newer 676 (can't recall the exact numbers) are supposed to be a good compromise between the 688 and 659. I like my Harmony and recommend them. But I'm sure you'd get the same feedback from MX users too.

From what I hear, the Harmony is easier to use. A big part of getting a new remote is WAF, so I'm looking at Harmony mostly just for that. I might just do the 659, I just wonder if I will feel like I am missing something later if I end up with a PVR (like what just happened with my DVD not handling SACD). I'll have to spend some time with the demos on the web site and check them out.

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In other words, I have no useful advice.

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But you have 2,800+ posts

In reply to:

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But you have 2,800+ posts

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does that mean the 2,799 of them are useless?



bigjohn

Yeah, most likely!

OK, I think I've solved my problem, at least for now. I am going to return the 578A and get one that comes in a box with the remote and manual. They are down to $95 at the next closest best buy. I paid $75 without that stuff, but it is worth the extra $20 at this point.

I'll use the remote for the 578 when I play SACDs. I will likely plan on a Harmony remote as a Christmas present for both of us (it's nice to buy HT gifts for two )

you could always get a harmony and then go to a store and use their display remote to program teh harmony

I did the swap last night. The store's version of the web site must be different from what we see at home though. The player still scanned at $100. I had him check the web site and it said $100. I swore it was $95 when I looked. I checked when I got home and it said $95 here. Perhaps they have a cached copy of the site at the store and hadn't gotten the update yet or something. Now I'll have to go back with a printed copy that says $95....all for a measly $5 bucks!

Anyway, the new player is hooked up and working, along with the remote and manual. Now it's on to harmony.