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My current setup with M3v2's across the front and BIC F12 sub. Not pictured are my surrounds which are old Panasonic HTIB speakers I have mounted from the ceiling.

Nice setup. Are you still not noticing any issues with the M3s laying on their sides? I don’t know of anyone else who is running 3 x M3s across the front so your setup may me unique at least for the forum.

Also have you tired them w/o the sub? It would be nice to hear from someone about how they sound alone.

Cheers,
Dean

Dean,

Thanks for the compliment on the setup!

From the couch, there are no real issues with the sound. The M3's are an absolute pleasure to listen to, but there are a few things that I did notice with regards to the M3's on their sides (listening in stereo with good recordings):

1) Response and detail drops off QUICKLY if I step 3-4 feet outside the right speaker. Fortunately, this is outside the seating area. I'm going to try tweeters out to see if that makes a difference.
2) From the listening area, the stereo soundstage extends outside of the speakers, and there is a definite sense of height (i.e. singers voices, instruments, etc. are centered right below where my center channel speaker is located (or sometimes higher).
3) I will readily admit that I may be imagining this last one, but every once in awhile I sense a hole in the stereo image where voices don't quite meet up in the middle. If I close my eyes, I don't quite get that 'singer in the room' feeling.

All of these observations are somewhat lessened by turning the speakers upright. Could be placebo, but maybe not. Unfortunately, if I stood them up, I would have access issues to the cabinets behind the speakers.

No difference to me with the center on its side.

I'm writing up a review where I listened to the speakers both with and without a sub.

1) This would be no suprise if your laying the speakers down. The "horizontal" dispersion of the tweeters would be sacrificed by laying a vertical speaker on its side.

2) same reason as 1) , the voice should be dead center with proper placement.

3) They won't if you lay the speaker on its side, the horizontal dispersion of the tweeter is gone.

Might I see similar results to standing them up if I remount the tweeters 90 degrees from their current orientation? I did notice that the piece that sits over the tweeter (sorry don't know what it is called) is biased in a particular direction on all three speakers.

It will make some difference because the location of the drivers is not symetrical to the cabinet in the horizontal plane when lying on it’s side. However, the I think it will just move the problem from outstide your seating area to inside.


That will still sound the same with the speaker standing vertically because the center speaker is highter and that’s where most vocals and some instruments are mixed. If using Dolby Pro Logic to derive your center channel from 2.0 recordings there is a width (name?) setting that will spread the center channel out more into the L/R main which may level things out a bit.



It’s being cause by having a wall right next to your L main and open space right next to your R main and also effected by having your speakers on unsymmetrical bookshelves. Also having speakers to close or to far from the front wall will impact the depth of your front soundstage. Unsymmetrical wall placement may be exaggerating horizontal dispersion issues cause by laying speakers on their sides but it will remain even if you stand them up. Treating the first reflection off that left wall will help more than anything.

Laying the speaker on it’s side will likely spread out the image of singers and instruments so they seem wider but should not move them left or right of center if either both tweeters are inboard or both are outboard.

You can also play around with settings in your receiver that can modify the 'amount' of the signal sent to the L and R channels as they are mixed with the centre channel.
On my Onkyo the setting is called 'centre' width' or something similar. By increasing the value more of the centre signal is sent to the mains broadening the soundstage but making the vocals less precise for location.
If you find the soundstage too broad, check your receiver for similar options.

Thanks guys! Currently all of my 'critical' listening in music is done in stereo, though I have devoted some time to listening in simulated surround.

I'm finding that for vocals, I will listen in stereo almost exclusively. For jazz, I do like to switch back and forth between 2 and 5 channels depending on the group.

My PLII settings are: Music/Panorama: off/Dimension: 5/C.Width: 3

I don't do much listening with DTS Neo6 because while it does tend to retain the front soundstage pretty well, I find there is a lack of ambiance and space that Dolby PLII provides. Its not bad, but just not my cup of tea.

I do find that when I'm in the sweet spot, stereo produces the best image, while the PLII gives the best sense of ambiance.

I'm actually thinking of trading down to M2's more for the size considerations. Since getting the sub, I have the M3's crossed over at 80hz so I'm not necessarily taking advantage of the lower extension, but have to deal with the larger size.