Axiom Home Page Forums General Discussion Stereo M80s vs. M60s vs. M60s+sub in 14'x18' room

Okay, these are three interrelated questions on the same theme as I face a decision on M80s vs. M60s. Many threads touch on these same issues, but I could not find a dedicated 80s vs. 60s thread, and I also want to poll some divergent thoughts on room size and the need for a sub with larger mains, so here goes:

1. For stereo listening, do you think I can enjoy M80s in a 14'x18' carpeted room or will they just be too large? The system sits at one end of the room along the 14' wall. The room is 18' long but has a mostly open wall at the other end that opens into a small kitchen (another 8' deep). I ask about size b/c my previous floorstanders, a pair of Energy e-XL 25s, never seemed to fill the space completely -- AND they stood too low at 30". The low tweeter axis always bugged me. So I'm intrigued by the height of the M80s, also by the discussions of their great clarity. Some threads here have made me wonder however if they may be overkill for my medium-sized room.

2. For listening to music in this room (Lyle Lovett, John Hiatt, Stan Getz, Lucinda Williams, jazz, Brazilian, pop), do you think I'd do better with

• M80s alone
• M60s alone
• M60s + a good sub, which I have yet to purchase?

I know the sub question may sound stupid to some, but I have never owned a sub, fearing it would just be too complicated, and so I don't know if it would enhance my stereo listening when using good, fuller- to full-range mains like the M60s or M80s. I'm interested in trying some DVD-Audios, but realistically this will be a rare form of usage for now.

3. Home theater viewing is a secondary but regular use of this system. We've enjoyed it with 5 speakers but no sub, but I'm wondering .... What are people's opinions on going with just the M80s and no sub (I can't afford both) vs. the M60s while saving for a sub in the $500 range?

Since I won't have a chance to hear M80s before buying, I'd really appreciate thoughts on these configurations, esp. from M80 owners or listeners. Stereo-listening is my main interest. If anyone in the Austin area can audition M60s or M80s please contact me.

FYI these will be run on a Yamaha RV-1105 playing mostly CDs, some vinyl, DVD movies and hopefully some DVD-Audio soon. Thanks for your thoughts.

For your room size, the M80s might be overkill. While they are definely Axiom's best speaker, you really can't go wrong with the M60s paired with a sub.

It's been said before that the M60s and M80s sound the same, but the M80s can handle more power and can play louder.

M60's plus a Hsu STF-2

A good subwoofer will greatly enhance your music listening.

I use my M80's in a room of similar size to yours... While i would not say they are overkill, they are probbly better suited for bigger rooms.. But i figured that if i was spending that amount of money id just buy what i really wanted. the m80's. I would like to have a good sub with the M80's keyword GOOD as in.. can keep up with the speakers. because i like to get that punch in the gut feeling while not having the music completely overpowered by bass.. but the M80's can certianly hold their own without a sub and i doubt i will ever want one bad enough to spend the money.

Haoleb,

You don't know what you're missing without a sub.

Yeah, you know those bits in Sting songs that are silent? They aren't.... ;-)

It's problematic, once you start down this road, austinbirdman. In descending order
M80s + 2 subs
M80s + 1 sub
M60s + 2 subs
M60s + 1 sub
M80s + 0 sub
M60s + 0 sub

JMO
G'luck!

In reply to:

---

Haoleb,

You don't know what you're missing without a sub.

---

I dont think its as much what im missing. Just what im not getting enough of! I dont want to say that the M80's dont have enough bass, because they do. but they certainly dont have too much of it.. I have my cheapo KLH sub that i dont really use. Ive tried it out before and every time its the same outcome. either i dont have it loud enough to hear or its overpowering. If i were to get a sub i probbly woulndt get an axiom sub since they are pretty expensive... I dunno i guess its just not real important at the moment. I cant bring myself to spend 400 or so on a sub that i dont really *need* lol.

I did however go and hook up the KLH for kicks again tonight, and played with setting and stuff. i got a shirt stuffed in the port and xover setting on the lowest and volume on 8 out of 10 and it doesnt sound TOO bad but nothing to write home about.

I guess I don't understand the "overkill" thing. I am putting a 16X22 addition on my house including a full basement. My basement ceiling is 7'-8" high. I am building the inside dimensions down to 11'-2" X 16'-3 3/4" with a 7'-0" ceiling. I have the Epic 80 system and an SVS 16-46PCi sub. The mains are fed with a Parasound HCA 1000a and the center and surrounds are fed with a Parasound HCA 855a. Into 4ohms, that is 200wpc for the mains and 125wpc for the center and surrounds (conservative because the 855 will only be driving 4 speakers instead of 5). I am considering a rear center QS-8 for a better rear fill on 6.1 encoded movies. There will be 6 theater seats and the speakers in the room (nothing else except accoustically treated walls and the front projector). I keep hearing that the M80's are overkill in this small room. Why? If I run at reference level, which is about 1 to 2 watts of power and peaks of 10 to 20 watts, will my speakers' responses be non-linear? Will they sound horridly aweful? I would think that playing an amp at a point where it is nearly always in pure class A without switching to class AB would be a great benefit. Amplifier AND speaker distortion should be much lower in this instance. Everything should play cleaner and more accurately.

Is there going to be a degradation of sound by playing M80s in a small room? Do they need to be "opened up" to sound good?

The reason I bought this system (which sounds great to me!) is because of the better bass from the mains. I have an Outlaw 950 that has separate crossovers for the mains, center, and surrounds. The deeper I cross my mains, the better the bass imaging should be. Once set up I plan to cross over the M80s at 60hz (and possibly 40hz, depending on their in room response) and I hope to cross the center and surrounds at 80hz, although depending again on room response, it might be 100hz).

So again...is it "overkill" because the M60s are capable of filling a small room this size (which the M22s could easily fill also) or is their going to be a sonic degradation by not "opening up" the M80s with high power?

Thanks for the awesome replies. Looks like I face an embarassment of riches in terms of choices. Too bad my bank account doesn't have the same problem! You all have me thinking M60s+Hsu or comparable sub as opposed to going M80s without a sub. There's the spousal factor too of course (last thing she expects to see is a sub, esp the ugly ones from Hsu), so M80s could still be the choice ... Will be deciding soon and report back.